What happens if Cuse cracks top 75 NET?

[orangenauburn]

Say Cuse wins Tuesday and by some miracle ends up in the top 75 of NET, what impact will that have downstream?

And the impact downstream of getting Syracuse into top 75 NET, would likely boost other ACC teams NET (Quad wins), right?

And better numbers for other ACC teams (NC State somehow stuck in neutral from getting any movement towards top 75 NET) would further help the ACC case for more tourney teams right?

So why are Syracuse and NC State stuck in neutral on the NET, just outside top 75?

Looking at some of the teams ahead of them are head scratchers.

Other conferences seem to get consistent movement in NET and ACC seems stuck

 

[721Comstock]

Say Cuse wins Tuesday and by some miracle ends up in the top 75 of NET, what impact will that have downstream?

And the impact downstream of getting Syracuse into top 75 NET, would likely boost other ACC teams NET (Quad wins), right?

And better numbers for other ACC teams (NC State somehow stuck in neutral from getting any movement towards top 75 NET) would further help the ACC case for more tourney teams right?

So why are Syracuse and NC State stuck in neutral on the NET, just outside top 75?

Looking at some of the teams ahead of them are head scratchers.

Other conferences seem to get consistent movement in NET and ACC seems stuck

Tacos!!

Uh, I’m pretty sure nothing magical happens if/when we do that.

It’s the winning enough games to get to that point that matters exponentially more.

 

[orangenauburn]

Tacos!!

Uh, I’m pretty sure nothing magical happens if/when we do that.

It’s the winning enough games to get to that point that matters exponentially more.

But like, wouldn't we become Q2 for our opponents?

Wouldn't that boost our SOS? And if our opponents benefit from us becoming a Q2 game, don't we benefit from them gaining in the NET because their SOS improved?

Like if Syracuse and NC State snuck into top 75, some teams are going to get a nice boost on their Q games from Q3 to Q2, which means in theory, we should see a boost too, right?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

 

[jdubs30]

we are at the point where our NET will not change drastically.

I’m sure if we won by 10+ tomorrow and make it to the ACC semis and lost a close game to UNC, we could get to 70 or so.

If we get in, our NET will be an outlier and will be talked about. There’s almost nothing we can do to change it at this point, the sample size is too big we only have (hopefully) 3+ games left.

What we need more is Q1 wins. NC State losing tonight hurts. Pittsburgh, Oregon, etc continuing to win get us close to Q1 wins as possible


Our NET will suck but if we win tomorrow it’s hard to imagine they can keep us out

 

[pwong]

To get into the 70’s, probably would have to beat Clemson by more than 6 (15 pt swing vs the -9 pt spread)

 

[jncuse]

But like, wouldn't we become Q2 for our opponents?

Wouldn't that boost our SOS? And if our opponents benefit from us becoming a Q2 game, don't we benefit from them gaining in the NET because their SOS improved?

Like if Syracuse and NC State snuck into top 75, some teams are going to get a nice boost on their Q games from Q3 to Q2, which means in theory, we should see a boost too, right?

We would get no boost. Its not a "circular" calculation.

Q1-Q4 is not an "input" into the NET
Q1, Q2, Q3, Q4 is purely an "output" derived whatever the NET's of teams are.


So if we move up to #75 in the NET.
a) It will make a few teams happy like Virginia, Wake since they get an extra Q2 ****
b) But it will have zero impact on the calculated NET of Virginia or Wake, or our own NET.

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**** Should also be noted for those that are quadrant obsessed on the edges - and I am talking to myself at times as well in this regard because I do look at. It might not matter that much if a team is #77 instead of #75, if its an actual legit team, and I think we are viewed as a legit "Q2" team for those that play us..

The NCAA committee has said when they assess teams right on the bubble line, they tend to scrub the edges of quad lines and may move up the quality of a victory. Whether we are Q3 or not, that Wake win over us could well be assessed as a Q2 win by the committee when they scrub theWake resume. I think for Wake, we could be viewed as "Q2" in that scrub. Unfortunately for us, I'm not sure someone like NC St would get the boost to Q2.

They don't really take deep dives like that on teams that are clearly in... but they do scrub things out when you are on the bubble line. They have to do something to justify their hanging out for 6 days after all.

 

[Orangezoo]

We would get no boost. Its not a "circular" calculation.

Q1-Q4 is not an "input" into the NET
Q1, Q2, Q3, Q4 is purely an "output" derived whatever the NET's of teams are.


So if we move up to #75 in the NET.
a) It will make a few teams happy like Virginia, Wake since they get an extra Q2 ****
b) But it will have zero impact on the calculated NET of Virginia or Wake, or our own NET.

--------

**** Should also be noted for those that are quadrant obsessed on the edges - and I am talking to myself at times as well in this regard because I do look at. It might not matter that much if a team is #77 instead of #75, if its an actual legit team, and I think we are viewed as a legit "Q2" team for those that play us..

The NCAA committee has said when they assess teams right on the bubble line, they tend to scrub the edges of quad lines and may move up the quality of a victory. Whether we are Q3 or not, that Wake win over us could well be assessed as a Q2 win by the committee when they scrub theWake resume. I think for Wake, we could be viewed as "Q2" in that scrub. Unfortunately for us, I'm not sure someone like NC St would get the boost to Q2.

They don't really take deep dives like that on teams that are clearly in... but they do scrub things out when you are on the bubble line. They have to do something to justify their hanging out for 6 days after all.

I will be curious how the NET is treated next year if the Big 12 does indeed get 9 teams and is down to 2 teams or less by the sweet 16 while the MWC is down to 1 or none. It’s likely both fizzle out early given the inflated rankings.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

I will be curious how the NET is treated next year if the Big 12 does indeed get 9 teams and is down to 2 teams or less by the sweet 16 while the MWC is down to 1 or none. It’s likely both fizzle out early given the inflated rankings.

ACC needs to raise a massive stink about the NET if they only get 3 or 4 teams in the tournament this year. But unfortunately UNC and Duke are already locks and the ACC really only cares about them getting in. Everyone else can pound sand.

 

[CLTCuse]

I don’t pretend to understand the NET rankings but the relative rankings of Syracuse and Maryland seem to demonstrates that metrics beyond wins and losses matter more. Which in my opinion makes the whole thing worthless. If that can happen in these convoluted ranking, someone took a wrong turn on the way to Albuquerque.

Overall records and quad records:

#74 Maryland 15-15 (7-12)
13th of 14 in the Big10
(2-8) (4-3) (2-4) (7-0)

#84 Syracuse 19-10 (11-8)
4th in the ACC
(2-7) (4-2) (9-1) (4-0)

 

[CorduroyG]

we are at the point where our NET will not change drastically.

I’m sure if we won by 10+ tomorrow and make it to the ACC semis and lost a close game to UNC, we could get to 70 or so.

If we get in, our NET will be an outlier and will be talked about. There’s almost nothing we can do to change it at this point, the sample size is too big we only have (hopefully) 3+ games left.

What we need more is Q1 wins. NC State losing tonight hurts. Pittsburgh, Oregon, etc continuing to win get us close to Q1 wins as possible


Our NET will suck but if we win tomorrow it’s hard to imagine they can keep us out

Thats what im banking on. Beat clemson, win an acc tourny game, then dare the committee to keep a 22 win (at least) 12-8 acc team out of the tournament. I dont think they will regardless of the NET.

 

[pokercuse08]

To get into the 70’s, probably would have to beat Clemson by more than 6 (15 pt swing vs the -9 pt spread)

To get to 75 in KenPom from 79, we probably need to beat Clemson by 6. To get to 75 in NET, it's hard to say. My guess would be that we probably need to beat them by about 20-25.

Unfortunately for us, I'm not sure someone like NC St would get the boost to Q2.

So they would scrub us (84th) to top-75 level to evaluate, say, Wake... But in evaluating us, they would not scrub NC State (80th) to top-75 level? If so, that's infuriating. They'd be scrubbing us up to help a team we're competing against for one of the last spots have a better resume, potentially to beat us out for the last spot.

 

[SWC75]

NCAA eyeing modest men's tournament expansion

"There is little to no appetite for 96 teams, or really even 80," said a college administrator who was briefed on the conversations.

theathletic.com