When g rob was fired
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Eric15
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Not sure I follow you. I actually think the SU fanbase's view of GRob and Shafer are fairly similar -- high character guy who just isn't cut out to be a head coach. I remember everyone being very happy for GRob after that Notre Dame win.
Finwad32
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Honestly, not me. I was convinced of Greg's ineptitude fairly early in his tenure. There were things going on on the field, both at practice and at games, that were really telling.
And because of that, I could never get behind him as a coach.
Eric15
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But you didn't like him as a person?
(We went 1-10 in his first season, I don't think you were alone in your evaluation.)
Finwad32
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My point is my view of GRob and Shafer is not similar at all. Both great guys, but, completely different respect for SS as a coach. So I don't view them similarly at all.
Oswego93
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By the time GRob was let go, it was about 1.5-2 years past the point when even his most ardent defenders finally conceded that he was an awful coach that had no chance of turning things around. With SS, there is still a sizable portion of fans who wonder if he might be able to right the ship here.
Both were player coaches though, and by all accounts great guys off the field (wasn't Boeheim good friends with GRob?).
Both were player coaches though, and by all accounts great guys off the field (wasn't Boeheim good friends with GRob?).
GoSU96
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No, Greg was incompetent beyond belief, never should have been given the job in the first place. I would have dumped him mid way through his first year.
Shafer was as much a victim of circumstance as anything else. If Coyle wants to get his guy and it's an obvious upgrade, Shafer didn't do enough to really make an argument to keep him. Win 7 games in two years and have one of the worst combined offenses and defenses in your third year, you leave yourself open, regardless of reason.
When you get an internal promotion to a slot that you wouldn't have had a shot for anywhere else, you better over-perform, Shafer didn't do that.
RICuse44
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That season was a major red flag. There was talent on that defense- Wyche and Lacasse were the ends, Gregory was a DB, Dowayne Davis was a S. McClain was a DE.
cvillecuse
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I honestly don't get the comparisons between Shafer and Gerg. I very vividly remember the hopelessness that I felt when Gerg was at the helm. The blowout losses to Rutgers, the losses to teams like Akron, I never felt anything near that level of hopelessness with Shafer. Last year was a blip, this year, they were a couple of bad breaks, a couple of boneheaded decisions, and one bad call away from 6-6. Coaches learn and improve over time the same way players do. You know Shafer had to have been looking back on the Pitt and UVA games and tried to learn from his mistakes. Yesterday's clock management was 100% better at the end of the game than the Pitt and UVA games. He needed one more year. Hopelessness under Gerg got 4, Shafer deserved 4.
H
HOFCeluck
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Then sadly, it took him a little long to learn...because he was making the same mistakes vs FSU that he made vs Pitt a week earlier.
CuseOnly
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Couldn't be further from how I feel about both of them.
When Gerg was fired, I was elated that nozzle was finally gone. Knew after his first season that he was useless, nice guy but useless and a horrendous coach.
Shafer being fired, I haven't felt worse about anything in a long time. He was genuine in everything he did, he was the epitome if integrity and class. Same with his family and children, just great people. I think his record for the most part was a matter of circumstance, he was snake bit in addition to making a few bad moves. If he had hired Lester as OC and not McF***IT, I truly believe that he would still be our coach.
Another school is going to get a heck of a DC and I think he gets another HC gig in the future and doesn't make the same mistakes he did here.
Eric15
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What you just wrote has nothing to do with the OP or my response to it. I agree GRob was horrendous as a coach. But the idea that GRob isn't a "real man" or is "fake" is childish.
I remember Greg Robinson pausing during the ND post-game interview because he wanted to show respect for the band playing the ND fight song.
This thread sucks.
Last edited:
Finwad32
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Real man? Think fast, SS and Gerg are in a fist fight, who wins? Who wins?
SS:
Vs.
Gerg
This is completely done in jest... Just jokes
GoSU96
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What I resented about Robinson was the combination of ignorance and arrogance that they approached this job with.
Add to it that he was an unorganized mess and there's the difference for me.
shafers downfall was his passion. i believe it interfered with his gameday decisions. he could not step back and see the whole picture, thus leading to bad calls on his part. he never grew into the job at the executive level. i loved the guy and like most of us wanted him desperately to succeed. truly a gem to represent this city and university. he will land on his feet, as he is an asset for any university--high character and values---he is genuine ---
jgeorge322
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Yup robinson is high character too but he was so out of his element as a hc, the choice to fire was obvious. Shafer i think could have succeeded w more time but imo i agree w the move.
NKR1978
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CuseOnly said:
Robinson has two Super Bowl rings as a DC. He did a good with the 2013 Texas defense when he had to clean up a mess. He's objectively had a more successful career than Shafer.
They're both good men who were terrible head coaches. Greg got one year too many. Thankfully we didn't make that mistake with Shafer.
Scooch
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NKR1978 said:
I don't think Shafer was a "terrible" head coach. He just wasn't successful enough fast enough given the circumstances.
Robinson was the worst head coach of any team I have ever rooted for, and that includes the Rod Rust Patriots and ML Carr Celtics.
Ringostar57
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"When GRob was fired" the earth moved. The Sun came out from behind the clouds and all was good . Say the word incompetent and the first thing that pops up in my mind is GRob.
Yes, I agree. This is my take. Both were really great guys, but poor HC's. Actually, Shafer was a little bit better, but not by much.
What kills me about this move is that pretty much everyone agrees that SS can recruit and coach a defense, and that he's loyal to SU and passionate about the university. The three questions are A) can he hire staff B) can he develop talent, and C) can he put together an offense.
I don't think that he proved that he can hire a good staff, but I'm also not sure he was given a chance. The guys that he initially hired were all hired on short notice, and they were probably hired on a limited budge. We also went to a bowl in year #1, so it's not like he could cut them without trashing his reputation. Arguably, he could have cleaned house before this year, but once again, given the nature of how they were hired, that's easier said then done.
I also don't think that he proved that he could develop talent, but he wasn't really here long enough to say for sure. His guys really are freshmen and sophomores - unless you want to include his work as DC (if so, then arguably he proved that he could develop talent).
I'm also not entirely sure he proved that he can put together an offense. However, our points per game rank increased by 43 spots between this year and last, despite a comparable schedule. AND, he did that with a really, really young offense. In all likelihood, there would have been other size able jumps over the next two years from recruiting/player maturity alone. With those figures in mind, although I don't think that he "proved" anything for sure, I don't see how you can't tentatively give him the benefit of the doubt, contingent on future success.
IMHO, he wasn't given a real chance. His offense did improve (a LOT) and his defense was weak this year, but that was clearly bad luck, not his shortcomings (see his track record - even as HC).
I get that he's fired and that the SS ship has sailed and sunk, but given the above, I have serious doubts as to the AD's competency, and that ship is still very much in port. If he doesn't come up with one h*ck of a pick for a new fb coach that pans out, this is 100% on him.
I don't think that he proved that he can hire a good staff, but I'm also not sure he was given a chance. The guys that he initially hired were all hired on short notice, and they were probably hired on a limited budge. We also went to a bowl in year #1, so it's not like he could cut them without trashing his reputation. Arguably, he could have cleaned house before this year, but once again, given the nature of how they were hired, that's easier said then done.
I also don't think that he proved that he could develop talent, but he wasn't really here long enough to say for sure. His guys really are freshmen and sophomores - unless you want to include his work as DC (if so, then arguably he proved that he could develop talent).
I'm also not entirely sure he proved that he can put together an offense. However, our points per game rank increased by 43 spots between this year and last, despite a comparable schedule. AND, he did that with a really, really young offense. In all likelihood, there would have been other size able jumps over the next two years from recruiting/player maturity alone. With those figures in mind, although I don't think that he "proved" anything for sure, I don't see how you can't tentatively give him the benefit of the doubt, contingent on future success.
IMHO, he wasn't given a real chance. His offense did improve (a LOT) and his defense was weak this year, but that was clearly bad luck, not his shortcomings (see his track record - even as HC).
I get that he's fired and that the SS ship has sailed and sunk, but given the above, I have serious doubts as to the AD's competency, and that ship is still very much in port. If he doesn't come up with one h*ck of a pick for a new fb coach that pans out, this is 100% on him.
