Why is it so hard to be good in bball & football?

[AlaskaSU]

Only a few schools have done it and they are the jumbo public institutions.
Is it due to a large pool of local talent like Fl, Mich and Ohio or is it due to the happenstance of having a good coach for eachsport, and or does it require a large student body?.

 

[Hoo's That]

Only a few schools have done it and they are the jumbo public institions.

They have more places to hide people.

 

[dasher]

Only a few schools have done it and they are the jumbo public institutions.
Is it due to a large pool of local talent like Fl, Mich and Ohio or is it due to the happenstance of having a good coach for eachsport, and or does it require a large student body?.

it's really tough to be good in one.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

Only a few schools have done it and they are the jumbo public institutions.
Is it due to a large pool of local talent like Fl, Mich and Ohio or is it due to the happenstance of having a good coach for eachsport, and or does it require a large student body?.

I think of a school like Univ of Florida and they have had three 4 or more loss seasons in football in the last six years. With the talent in that state you would think they would never lose more than two or three games a year but it happens. Everything cycles plus they are in the toughest conference. Alabama is a great football school but borderline basketball. You look at schools like Arizona, ASU, USC, UCLA and it's one or the other over the years. Ohio State and Michigan have been cyclical as well. Penn State has never had a good hoop program. Duke has never had a good football program.

Syracuse has more than held their own. For a private school in upstate NY, they have done very well.

 

[bballbeadle]

As a Wisconsin alum, I believe having a huge student body really helps. Football is most helped, obviously, and then basketball becomes a pleasant "extra." When I was an undergrad, back when humanoids were learning to walk upright, there was also the culture of going to games which didn't correlate with success of the team. We didn't win a game for 2 1/2 years straight. Much of the culture revolved around alcoholic activities, which is the case with everything in Wisconsin. I remember little of those days. But we got 70,000 in that outdoor stadium every single year!

 

[Orange2389]

If we sit back and think... Syracuse is a big time player in the NCAA and no one knows a darn about the city or region except that the Orange play here. That is amazing. Syracuse, NY is literally on the national map because of our University. The fact that our bball program still operates and feels like a family is great too. Syracuse will have the facilities to be elite in football and basketball but the football program has a long long ways to go.

 

[bballbeadle]

If we sit back and think... Syracuse is a big time player in the NCAA and no one knows a darn about the city or region except that the Orange play here. That is amazing. Syracuse, NY is literally on the national map because of our University. The fact that our bball program still operates and feels like a family is great too. Syracuse will have the facilities to be elite in football and basketball but the football program has a long long ways to go.

One word: BOEHEIM.

 

[Jeremy L.]

The only school I can think of that is really great at both is Ohio State (off the top of my head).

 

[Dcuse]

The only school I can think of that is really great at both is Ohio State (off the top of my head).

Florida. Louisville is getting there. Michigan is getting back to there.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

The only school I can think of that is really great at both is Ohio State (off the top of my head).

It's still cyclical though. Between 1993 and 2005 (13 seasons) OSU only made the NCAA's four times (all consecutive 1999-2002). That's not very good but since then they are one of the top programs.

 

[Pat Kelly]

The only school I can think of that is really great at both is Ohio State (off the top of my head).

Notre Dame as well is consistently good at both.

 

[orangefan13]

Post Belongs on football board.

Outside of OSU, Oklahoma, Boise and TCU SEC has dominated football the last 8 years, florida and uk are the only real basketball schools in the sec. Oregon Stanford aren't to good at basketball.

Footballs head coaches leave to early imo. One of the reason syracuse is great at basketball is the 2-3 zone, their size, transition basketball. I am glad hop will be keeping it even if he tinkers with it, SU should not hire a coach who doesn't imo. You don't rebuild away from your strengths when you have something special.

 

[sutomcat]

Only a few schools have done it and they are the jumbo public institutions.
Is it due to a large pool of local talent like Fl, Mich and Ohio or is it due to the happenstance of having a good coach for eachsport, and or does it require a large student body?.

The second law of thermodynamics says that energy of all kinds in our material world disperses or spreads out if it is not hindered from doing so. Entropy is the quantitative measure of that kind of spontaneous process: how much energy has flowed from being localized to becoming more widely spread out (at a specific temperature).

 

[Alsacs]

15 scholarships vs 85 scholarships. In basketball you only need to recruit 4-5 players a year and have 1 or 2 be able to contribute in football you are recruiting 15-25 kids a year and have many positions to fill and the kids can't all be instant impact players each year. Football takes years to rebuild a down program and while coaching can mask deficiencies you can't win a lot of games consistently without developing depth. In basketball depth is a luxury but not a necessity in football depth is a necessity because of the nature of the sports and injuries. Marrone turned our football program from a 1.5 star program to a 2.5 star program we went from DePaul/Providence College level and became West Virginia in basketball we were decent but never going to be a threat. I think right now we are 5 star basketball and 2.5 star football school and can continue growing in football but will never be better than a 3.5 or 4 star football school.

 

[Quazzum69]

For whatever reasons, it seems like the northeast just does not produce the athletes that come from the South and California. Between 2011 and 2014, there were 15 ESPN top 100 basketball players from New York State, but there were 20 from the just the tiny gulf states of LA, MS and AL. The combined population of these states is about 12.5 million compared to New York's nearly 20 million. If you are in Florida and Texas, you have unlimited players within just a few states.

The "athlete gap" is much more noticeable in football - LA, MS and AL alone could probably field several teams that could beat all northeastern players.

 

[Orange87]

UCLA, Stanford, Arizona, Oregon are also very good in both.

Was it 2-3 years ago that Ohio State and Florida played each other in the National Championship games in both sports? Now THAT is amazing.

 

[NineOneSeven]

The second law of thermodynamics says that energy of all kinds in our material world disperses or spreads out if it is not hindered from doing so. Entropy is the quantitative measure of that kind of spontaneous process: how much energy has flowed from being localized to becoming more widely spread out (at a specific temperature).

Best analogy I ever heard about entropy (S) was related to a bedroom-- no matter how often you seem to clean it, it always tends towards massive messiness.

 

[Consigliere]

The second law of thermodynamics says that energy of all kinds in our material world disperses or spreads out if it is not hindered from doing so. Entropy is the quantitative measure of that kind of spontaneous process: how much energy has flowed from being localized to becoming more widely spread out (at a specific temperature).

Second law of thermodynamics! Yes - that's what I was thinking of! Guarantee they're not quoting that on the Rutgers board.

 

[jdubs30]

Elite recruits want to be the BMOC. That's why you don't see top 15 football recruits going to Kansas or Kentucky; same reason you don't see top 15 basketball recruits going to Bama. Tyler Ennis, MCW, Waiters, etc wouldn't be at Bama.