Zone rebounding

[STEVEHOLT]

Could someone explain to me why our forwards, particularly our centers, have been terrible at blocking out the last few years? The announcers are always harping on the "no block out responsibilities" in a zone and I think that is freaking BS. Of course you have block out responsibilities. Find the nearest body and block it out.

The game vs Cal, a replay was shown where Cal missed a shot and one of their forwards comes crashing from the top of the key for an uncontested put back. The narrative being, "see, no block out responsibilities in the zone" . In that same replay you can see Rak blocking out air, never looking to pick up a body that he would have had a significant positional advantage on had he identified him and done his job.

 

[Brooky03]

This is not a 'last few years' thing. For this team, it's likely just a result of having inexperienced forwards. But we've been a poor defensive rebounding team since I remember. Also, the fact that we have multiple guys trying to swat every shot in the paint probably doesn't help.

 

[Ghost]

I'm never sure what to make of zone rebounding. Rak early on, starting maybe half-way through his Sophomore year, used to spend too much time looking for his man to box out in my opinion. It hurt his numbers probably - he got too focused on it. It often had him backing his man out of the area while someone else swooped in, took the rebound, and got an easy put back. Which became Rak's fault.

Since assignments aren't as clear - it does lead to stuff like that happening.

 

[stuckinbig11]

Zone or Man, it has been my opinion for some time now that few people teach boxing out anymore. It was drilled into my head as a kid and remained my first instinctive action as soon as I saw a shot go up, even when I reached middle-age (and beyond). The emphasis has changed to high-flying for rebounds, which we 6'3" so-called big men of old could not do, so we boxed out.

 

[Brooky03]

Zone or Man, it has been my opinion for some time now that few people teach boxing out anymore. It was drilled into my head as a kid and remained my first instinctive action as soon as I saw a shot go up, even when I reached middle-age (and beyond). The emphasis has changed to high-flying for rebounds, which we 6'3" so-called big men of old could not do, so we boxed out.

I don't think there has been any shift away from boxing out being taught. I'm not much older than college players and I remember decent amounts of practice being dedicated to rebounding, boxing out specifically, in junior high and high school. Perhaps it's not taught in AAU, but I would guess that our coaches are teaching it.

 

[Czar]

Could someone explain to me why our forwards, particularly our centers, have been terrible at blocking out the last few years? The announcers are always harping on the "no block out responsibilities" in a zone and I think that is freaking BS. Of course you have block out responsibilities. Find the nearest body and block it out.

The game vs Cal, a replay was shown where Cal missed a shot and one of their forwards comes crashing from the top of the key for an uncontested put back. The narrative being, "see, no block out responsibilities in the zone" . In that same replay you can see Rak blocking out air, never looking to pick up a body that he would have had a significant positional advantage on had he identified him and done his job.

It's not BS, that is a tried and true downside of the zone. In the man you don't have to go anywhere to box out, your assignment is next to you. In the zone you don't have that. So yeah, people can be unchecked since there's no time from the shot going up to look around for a man to box out.

 

[STEVEHOLT]

It's not BS, that is a tried and true downside of the zone. In the man you don't have to go anywhere to box out, your assignment is next to you. In the zone you don't have that. So yeah, people can be unchecked since there's no time from the shot going up to look around for a man to box out.

Its bs that you cannot rebound effectively out of a zone. A different technique is required and it takes a little more awareness, but it can be done. Just watch how often our guys box out air instead of finding a body, any body, and putting their butt into the guy.

 

[rstone7727]

It's not BS, that is a tried and true downside of the zone. In the man you don't have to go anywhere to box out, your assignment is next to you. In the zone you don't have that. So yeah, people can be unchecked since there's no time from the shot going up to look around for a man to box out.

No time? the ball is in the air for over a second, maybe a second and a half. It takes about 1/10 sec. to turn your head, ID the opposition and step in front of them.

 

[jordoo]

Its certainly a built in weakness of the zone but some of our teams do a better job than others do. Usually we have good rebounding guards when we have our better defensive rebounding teams. They can help out a lot by doing a couple of things. Pursuing the long rebounds that bounce over the back line, if they are weak side without anyone to guard drop down into the lane and help and finally be alert enough when a shot goes up to get in front of whoever is in your area to prevent a free runner into the action. Its just the very nature of the way the zone works and is played that makes defensive rebounding something that you have to work really hard at and still have a team effort to being alert to when shots go up just to avoid it being a real weakness.

 

[Brooky03]

We were even on the boards with Iowa and Cal. Why are we complaining about rebounding right now?

 

[Coach Orange]

Some points that should help answer the question:

• The defensive slides required by our 2-3 zone often create natural 2-on-1 disadvantages on the weak side based on the rotations. Four defenders end up on the ball side of the court when the ball is on the wing or in the corner. The offense doesn't always overload the ball side with players, though. At least two offensive players are often on the weak-side. The weak-side forward cannot box out one player; this would leave one unchecked. Instead, he needs to get between the two offensive players and fight hard for the ball. This is not an easy assignment against teams with big, strong players.
• One disadvantage of trying to fast break on every defensive rebound is that players try to leak out rather than staying disciplined to their assignments. This is especially true of our guards, who don't crash to help rebound on occasion because they are trying to get to their fast break responsibilities.
• Because all five defenders have to react to ball movement with specific slides, they are not always in a beneficial position to turn and establish rebounding position. Man defenses also require all five players to fulfill position responsibilities, but at least two players are almost always in help position, which is easier for rebounding purposes; they are often already inside (closer to the basket) the offensive players they are defending. There's no guarantee of such positioning advantage in a 2-3 zone like ours, especially given how high our forwards often extend to cover shooters.

I hope this helps.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Two thoughts on this, although I doubt mine will offer as much info as Coach above me.

1. Lots of the guys on our team have always been the best jumpers on their teams growing up. So boxing out was never a worry for them, because they just jumped over everyone. Takes a while for these kids to realize they aren't the most athletic one in the gym any more.

2. Coach referenced this above, but since you mentioned one thing specifically STEVEHOLT , the scenario you bring up (crashing from the top of the key), is all on the guards. They are the ones who have to slow down the guys above the lane. And as Coach Orange mentioned, they are often leaking out and getting ready to break.

 

[Hoo's That]

I don't think there has been any shift away from boxing out being taught. I'm not much older than college players and I remember decent amounts of practice being dedicated to rebounding, boxing out specifically, in junior high and high school. Perhaps it's not taught in AAU, but I would guess that our coaches are teaching it.

This wouldn't surprise me in the least. Today's players pick up a lot of bad habits in AAU ball nowadays. I guess we can add poor/no rebounding techniques to matador defense.