Conference Realignment - Basketball Future

[Day2]

I think it’s been losing steam since joining the ACC, we were the Big East like UNC/Duke are the ACC.

I won’t even pretend to know what’s going on with all this, but nothing I’ve read would lead me to believe your wrong, I hope you are but our brand isn’t even what it was 12 years ago, I hope this won’t be a death blow.

The death blow is if we’re on the outside looking in.

 

[two3zone]

The death blow is if we’re on the outside looking in.

Being like UConn in football isn’t much worse.

 

[Cusefan0307]

The death blow is if we’re on the outside looking in.

You can win in basketball in any conference within reason.
Football is a different story. That said this realignment is going to blow up in about 5-10 years with the decrease in cable coverage. All of this is moot because it’s not like the ACC is going to disband tomorrow and the reason we have sucked was not because of our conference. JB got old and mailed it in for 5 or 6 years.

And the Big 10 sucks in the postseason in both sports. This is all about money.

 

[Sherman20]

If Syracuse joins the Big East for basketball, I would also like to see Boston College, Duke, WF SMU and Tulane join as well.
Then add Army and Navy as FB only.

Big East Basketball
UConn
Syracuse
Duke
Villanova
Georgetown
Boston College
Providence
St John’s
Seton Hall
Wake Forest
Tulane
SMU

Lol, are you planning to kick out Xavier, Creighton, Butler and Marquette? That will never happen. They are some of the stronger current members of the BE basketball conference and are aligned with the other small Catholic schools from the East Coast. Let’s be realistic.

 

[Orangefan1]

I really believe that people need to calm down. Nothing that has happened yet has hurt us. We have time to put ourselves in a position to be a half. Never put a down payment on worry. If something bad does happen, we have all the time in the world to whine about it at that point. Until that time, relax and see how this all plays out. Contrary to what some believe, we are not run by morons who are clueless.

It’s just bad all the way around I don’t want the Cuse to be part of a sinking ship with presidents that have no forward thinking.

 

[SmilinBob]

It seems like the past presenting itself in the future. I wouldn't be surprised if there are 2 championships like when the NIT and NCAA had champions.

 

[Hoo's That]

Doubtful that Duke is going anywhere without UNC.
It's probably the last rivalry that means anything.
Sadly.

But would love to see the Orange back in a basketball version of the Big East with many of our old pals...plus despicable G-town.

Duke isn't going to be DUKE anymore. They'll still be very good, but not like they were under K. They don't bring eyeballs for football, which is the biggest part of every conference's TV contract. Just look at the difference in ND's payout from the ACC and the base payout (before bowl money) everyone else gets. They'll still play, but as a single OOC game.

 

[Hoo's That]

It really would be so much better if football broke away and modeled a league after the NFL but with multiple tiers or something like that. And then basketball and olympic sports go back to sensible regional conferences. That would look more like the old Big East for Cuse than the ACC.

It feels like it may be heading in that direction but will take a couple decades. Given the amount of money at stake, you can't really speed up the process because it likely needs to naturally progress to a point where it's financially beneficial for the top to change things. The NCAA is intentionally kept completely toothless by the member schools or else maybe it could have to make sure it doesn't organized something like that while keeping football under the NCAA umbrella.

FIFY. NCAA HQ can only act on issues when the membership allows it to act. They do not want it involved in realignment. No one is forced to be in the NCAA. IIRC, there are more NAIA schools than NCAA schools. Football will leave and there is no way for the NCAA to stop it.

 

[Sherman20]

Duke isn't going to be DUKE anymore. They'll still be very good, but not like they were under K. They don't bring eyeballs for football, which is the biggest part of every conference's TV contract. Just look at the difference in ND's payout from the ACC and the base payout (before bowl money) everyone else gets. They'll still play, but as a single OOC game.

No offense to you, Hoo, but UVA doesn’t bring football eyeballs either. Duke, Wake and UVA have been the ACC’s worst TV draws. The football thread has a link to an article that proves that.

 

[dasher]

It’s just bad all the way around I don’t want the Cuse to be part of a sinking ship with presidents that have no forward thinking.

You have no idea what you don't know. You just want them to do something. No idea if whether what they do will help in the long run. Right now, they are #3. Those Presidents have a tv network. They have a GOR keeping the league together until 2036. Sounds like forward thinking to me.

 

[CardiacCuse]

each school fighting each other for what they can get...might work if there was an acual governing body with power to organize everything

this whole mess is going to hurt college sports...maybe even kill it

 

[Cusefan0307]

each school fighting each other for what they can get...might work if there was an acual governing body with power to organize everything

this whole mess is going to hurt college sports...maybe even kill it

I don't think it will "kill" college sports, but it's going to have an affect on football. It will become a regional sport like baseball.

 

[CardiacCuse]

I don't think it will "kill" college sports, but it's going to have an affect on football. It will become a regional sport like baseball.

football is driving all of this...how can that not have a negative effect on the other sports?

the other sports are being held hostage and forced into situations they wouldnt choose...

eventually fans will be driven away

 

[Hoo's That]

No offense to you, Hoo, but UVA doesn’t bring football eyeballs either. Duke, Wake and UVA have been the ACC’s worst TV draws. The football thread has a link to an article that proves that.

But UVa has a higher carriage fee for the SEC Network or the BTN than Duke does ($X vs. $0, and X>0). UVa makes VA a conference state while Duke doesn't do that for NC if UNC joins the same conference.

 

[Sbucketball]

You have no idea what you don't know. You just want them to do something. No idea if whether what they do will help in the long run. Right now, they are #3. Those Presidents have a tv network. They have a GOR keeping the league together until 2036. Sounds like forward thinking to me.

To your point and others on here, if we're in a sports media bubble and it bursts within a few years, then in hindsight we'll think that 20-year GOR was a stroke of genius as it will be the only reason the ACC survived the gold rush. Of course if that's not the case and the B1G and SEC continue to increase the revenue gap, it could be viewed as a problem because it held ACC programs hostage until all the seats were taken. Who knows.

 

[Sherman20]

But UVa has a higher carriage fee for the SEC Network or the BTN than Duke does ($X vs. $0, and X>0). UVa makes VA a conference state while Duke doesn't do that for NC if UNC joins the same conference.

I agree, if it’s between Duke and Virginia there’s no contest. Virginia is getting that invite. However, I don’t think UVA and UNC are going anywhere until much closer to the expiration of the GOR.

 

[Hoo's That]

I agree, if it’s between Duke and Virginia there’s no contest. Virginia is getting that invite. However, I don’t think UVA and UNC are going anywhere until much closer to the expiration of the GOR.

Totally agree. Neither one can come close to putting together all the buyout fees and no conference will advance them the money to do so. The only thing that's guaranteed to get any school out of the ACC GoR is the dissolution of the ACC.

 

[Orangezoo]

Wouldn't be likely to the point of obvious that anyone else besides Clemson and FSU would take far less money much like Oregon and UW with the big 10? Even then FSU is probably getting less as well...

So if you dissolve the ACC with enough schools agreeing to do so... I just don't see how that's not a major self inflicted wound. That's just my uninformed view from afar reading all that's been shared via articles or folks' opinions.

It does seem there is a general illogical directional movement for the football power struggle to cave in college sports as we know it. Hasn't happened yet.. but doesn't seem to be very many standing in the way. The ACC holding steady for a few years while maybe the dissolved Pac 12 and other consolidation starts to show up on national viewership figures... maybe can at least inject some pause into others realizing a trend that likely only gets worse.

 

[grepal]

Being like UConn in football isn’t much worse.

When I was an undergrad late 70's to 1980 our football record was very poor, but I went to all the games, we had excellent hoops, I went to all the games. I was very entertained. I watched Lacrosse, Crew, some women' hoops and some wrestling, we had a great wrestler I think his name was Gene Mills who lost out in the 1980 Olympics due the ban we had imposed due the Moscow venue. We had a defensive lineman, Mike Rotunda who went on to wrestling fame, I remember a character he acted called IRS. I have religiously watched SU football and hoops since I graduated and will continue to do so, no matter the conference, if we are an indie or our record. I will go to games as my life allows. I know this is about big money and I find that very sad. It will not diminish my love for SU.

 

[Col. Bleep]

When I was an undergrad late 70's to 1980 our football record was very poor, but I went to all the games, we had excellent hoops, I went to all the games. I was very entertained. I watched Lacrosse, Crew, some women' hoops and some wrestling, we had a great wrestler I think his name was Gene Mills who lost out in the 1980 Olympics due the ban we had imposed due the Moscow venue. We had a defensive lineman, Mike Rotunda who went on to wrestling fame, I remember a character he acted called IRS. I have religiously watched SU football and hoops since I graduated and will continue to do so, no matter the conference, if we are an indie or our record. I will go to games as my life allows. I know this is about big money and I find that very sad. It will not diminish my love for SU.

Mike Rotunda also wrestled at heavyweight. And Gene was a two-time NCAA champion.

But back to the issues at hand.
If football is the major cause of conference instability...then it seems to make sense to create different conferences for different sports.
Why should a great basketball conference, for example, be torn apart because schools need to get better football position?

 

[Day2]

You can win in basketball in any conference within reason.
Football is a different story. That said this realignment is going to blow up in about 5-10 years with the decrease in cable coverage. All of this is moot because it’s not like the ACC is going to disband tomorrow and the reason we have sucked was not because of our conference. JB got old and mailed it in for 5 or 6 years.

And the Big 10 sucks in the postseason in both sports. This is all about money.

Solid point about the upcoming decrease in cable coverage. Could we be looking at a Bally situation with ESPN before the GoR expires? Disney is already planning to sell off parts of ESPN.

 

[Day2]

No offense to you, Hoo, but UVA doesn’t bring football eyeballs either. Duke, Wake and UVA have been the ACC’s worst TV draws. The football thread has a link to an article that proves that.

UVA is a public institution and attractive to the Big 10.

That’s another reason why we’re in an uphill battle: we’re a private school. At least we’re bigger than Duke and Wake and bring a larger share of a larger state.

 

[Day2]

To your point and others on here, if we're in a sports media bubble and it bursts within a few years, then in hindsight we'll think that 20-year GOR was a stroke of genius as it will be the only reason the ACC survived the gold rush. Of course if that's not the case and the B1G and SEC continue to increase the revenue gap, it could be viewed as a problem because it held ACC programs hostage until all the seats were taken. Who knows.

Yeah, it’s more the latter. Dasher blocked me, so I wasn’t going to respond to him. The ACC has been reactive at best and complacent at worst since the GoR went into effect. That is not forward thinking.

The conversations about adding Cal, Stanford, and SMU have already hit a snag. The ACC is on borrowed time.

If anything, SU leadership needs to be forward thinking. 22 schools will join the Big 10, SEC, or Big 12 by 2036. We need to be one of them.

 

[Orangezoo]

Yeah, it’s more the latter. Dasher blocked me, so I wasn’t going to respond to him. The ACC has been reactive at best and complacent at worst since the GoR went into effect. That is not forward thinking.

The conversations about adding Cal, Stanford, and SMU have already hit a snag. The ACC is on borrowed time.

If anything, SU leadership needs to be forward thinking. 22 schools will join the Big 10, SEC, or Big 12 by 2036. We need to be one of them.

Even if that happens.. the joy of being part of it I expect will be short lived as by that time the reality of a shrinking viewer base and ever shrinking revenues exposes this perceived utopia of super conferences to be light years from just that.

There will be infighting ( or whatever you want to call it) between the powers akin to what you see with FSU today and honestly I could see a few try out the Notre Dame path to be their own brand. It's the road to crushing college football even further.

If it takes hoops along for the ride it will stupidly ruin it alongside.

So in will come the NFL and NBA at some point to fill the void or attempt to have a leadership role in the media market to also preserve the primary developmental path for pro athletes... or they will keep growing to create more formidable competition or alternatives for collegiate sports to the tune of the systems used outside the U.S.

 

[grepal]

Yeah, it’s more the latter. Dasher blocked me, so I wasn’t going to respond to him. The ACC has been reactive at best and complacent at worst since the GoR went into effect. That is not forward thinking.

The conversations about adding Cal, Stanford, and SMU have already hit a snag. The ACC is on borrowed time.

If anything, SU leadership needs to be forward thinking. 22 schools will join the Big 10, SEC, or Big 12 by 2036. We need to be one of them.

Since the decision to leave the Big East I have always thought the Big 10 would have been better for us. Of course one needs an invitation first. If we are in say a 24 team league for football that would be nuts. Two division, 11 league games and one non conference game? Hoops schedules would be weird too. How many home and homes could a team get. Would the NCAA, ESPN leadership ho with a 36 or 40 game hoop season.