Daniel Ochefu, 0 fouls

[690West]

I had a flashback and thought Higgins and Burr were the officials today.

Sad part is that if Higgins and Burr were reffing that game, we win easily

 

[Orangeman]

And given our lead at the time, those late inconsequential calls were of potential benefit to Nova to get us to a end of game one and one situation which could have benefited them while at the same time making the foul calls appear more balanced.

Exactly. During the game I mentioned this would happen, and it DID!

Supposedly the refs are reviewed, etc…but they're always flying/driving from game to game so I don't buy it for a second.

Nova went, what, 9 mins without a foul in the 2H, the same half they called two ticky-tacks on our guys in the first 16 seconds of action? A "block" on CMac about 20 feet from the basket with no advantage gained, but they do nothing to commit a foul in 9 mins? Absolute nonsense.

 

[NKR1978]

Let me help you with this. You're a nova fan who thinks you're going to suddenly convince us that we didn't get ass banged by the three blind mice today. This in a game in which you shot 14 more free throws, we had our front court foul out and your starting center didn't have a foul called on him in a freaking brawl type game.

PS. Nobody here cares about your team. At all.

The only reason the free throw discrepancy was even as close as it was is due to the fact that Nova was fouling at the end of the game. That got them three or four more fouls. It was somehow even worse than it looks.

 

[NKR1978]

you guys have to calm down. Apologies for posting so close to a rough loss. I watched the full game, and didn't see the issues you guys are talking about. Although i've often been on the other end of that, so I understand. It's a lot easier in football to see as a fan of the other team if the refs are making the right calls.

I'm not trying to pile on, but your screen name is disconcerting. The name of one of our most beloved players in our history with the biggest play in our history sitting next to a picture of that little bag of d**** that gets away with so much s*** that aaron craft would blush.

Can't wait to see nova get upset in the first two rounds. I wouldn't feel too good if I were a nova fan after this game as far as long term prospects for the team.

 

[Cheriehoop]

Ochefu is not a physical big and he plays like 22 minutes a game. Relax. The refs weren't great both ways, but I don't think they had a huge influence on the game.

Could it be because he's foul prone ? In his last 4 games - Temple, Illinois, St Joseph's and LaSalle, he had at least 3 fouls each in 25 minutes or less, while getting 4 against St Joseph's in just 14 minutes.

 

[Orangezoo]

What it sounds like is a nova fan in denial of how the game was officiated and trying to validate the win despite the underlying reality that his team has some major issues of its own despite the gaudy record...

 

[NYCSUGrad]

Could it be because he's foul prone ? In his last 4 games - Temple, Illinois, St Joseph's and LaSalle, he had at least 3 fouls each in 25 minutes or less, while getting 4 against St Joseph's in just 14 minutes.

That is a jaw dropping set of stats. So apparently we're all NOT just paranoid, they were really out to get us.

 

[orangefan13]

What it sounds like is a nova fan in denial of how the game was officiated and trying to validate the win despite the underlying reality that his team has some major issues of its own despite the gaudy record...

And we have been there how many times before? MANY. Look at how close all our games were over the last 10 years during our best years, we rarely would put teams away more then half of the time. I remember our 09-10 team almost losing to depaul on the road. I do believe that not putting away teams by large margins is individual team based though, not program based, as basketball is a game of runs. We go through cold spots offensively to often over the years.

Nova played a awful first half defensively but were very solid in the second defensively and offensively, not giving us any open looks off a pass. They have 3 plus legit floor threats . They are a good team imo. We shot like 75% in the first half before their defense stopped sleepwalking, thats not easy to come back from.

HakWarrick1 might not want to see the foul advantage, but its good to have him, and that doesn't make this nova team soft. ALthough It would be good to have a picture of a orangeman on our site, save that picture for a nova site (hint hint)

 

[NYCSUGrad]

And we have been there how many times before? MANY. Look at how close all our games are over the last 10 years during our best years, we rarely to never put teams away, and I really believe that is individual team based, not program based. HakWarrick1 is still a orange fan, he might not have seen the foul advantage, but its good to have him. ALthough It would be good to have a picture of a orangeman on our site, save that picture for a nova site (hint hint)

I might buy that defense of the HakWarrick poster, that he's still an Orange fan, more if he gave any clue that he comprehended the factual barrage re the foul discrepancies. Cheriehoop posted in another thread that the one Nova player - the center? - who had not a single foul during our game, averaged three per about 25 minutes in three recent contests and FOUR in just 14 minutes in another. No, you don't suddenly get that perfect overnight. George Clooney will divorce his wife for me before that happens. The refs for whatever fiendish reason screwed us. No, HW is fundamentally a Nova fan, which would be fine if he would just come here and not be disingenuous about it. We appreciate posters from other boards who have good manners. But he acted like the big weighted plastic clown we used to box with as kids. You could throw all manner of punches but he'd never stay down. The best I can say for him is he's not a pseudo fan of the special kind that is igor, who doesn't even have the excuse of dual loyalties to explain his glee when SU and Boeheim suffer a loss.

 

[Orangezoo]

And we have been there how many times before? MANY. Look at how close all our games were over the last 10 years during our best years, we rarely would put teams away more then half of the time. I remember our 09-10 team almost losing to depaul on the road. I do believe that not putting away teams by large margins is individual team based though, not program based, as basketball is a game of runs. We go through cold spots offensively to often over the years.

Nova played a awful first half defensively but were very solid in the second defensively and offensively, not giving us any open looks off a pass. They have 3 plus legit floor threats . They are a good team imo. We shot like 75% in the first half before their defense stopped sleepwalking, thats not easy to come back from.

HakWarrick1 might not want to see the foul advantage, but its good to have him, and that doesn't make this nova team soft. ALthough It would be good to have a picture of a orangeman on our site, save that picture for a nova site (hint hint)

Huh? You missed the context of my post. Who cares if we have been there before.. what ever "there" is in your post. There really is little reason to support nova on a cuse board after this game.

 

[alphaorange]

Come on guys...this guy is just passive-aggressively trolling and you're all playing along. I have to believe he's laughing at us with every response. Don't facilitate...

 

[Shark58]

It would have been EVEN worse if the refs hadn't "suddenly" woken up and called three inconsequential "hand-check/body" type fouls starting with about 6 mins to go. Completely inconsistent with how they'd been calling the game. I personally think that all the money in sports has corrupted the game(s) so I'm not above thinking there is nonsense going on.

But, with about 6 mins left, and Villanova having only had 2 fouls called on them, all of a sudden, they whistled two or three fouls on them 30 feet from the basket that didn't need to be called. No impact, sideline inbounds. Actually made it harder on us because now we have to inbound.

If you wanted to think there was something fishy going on though, that does nothing to dispute the notion

there is no way the "fix" was in. I don’t think those refs would be smart enough to tease a game both ways and play the middle.

It was a very poorly ref’d game that skewed way against the orange. We still have ourselves to blame for not taking down a "quality win" and that lost opportunity will hurt our resume. If the game was called even somewhat competently/evenly, some of the headlines the next day would have included the word "spanked".

 

[Orangeman]

there is no way the "fix" was in. I don’t think those refs would be smart enough to tease a game both ways and play the middle.

It was a very poorly ref’d game that skewed way against the orange. We still have ourselves to blame for not taking down a "quality win" and that lost opportunity will hurt our resume. If the game was called even somewhat competently/evenly, some of the headlines the next day would have included the word "spanked".

You can't say "There is no way" anymore. Did you realistically think the NBA could have Refs fixing games? Guess what, it happened definitively over a long period of time.

Obviously, the more likely explanation is the refs stunk, or had some conference-affiliation bias, and woke up with 5 mins to go and said "Geez, we called 10 on them and only 2 on THEM...gotta fix this quick"...

But there is definitely the possibility that something fishy was going on, although I think the spread was 7? They would have lost anyway.

The biggest issue is the CMac tends to play his best ball mid-way through the 2H, he seems to take 30 mins to warm up, but he was forced to the bench for that stretch due to all the fouls.

BTW, something HAS to be done about our situational substitutions regarding players with 2 fouls and end-of-half scenarios. I believe we put Rak back in with 2 fouls and 30 seconds left, or at least kept him in then. The risk/reward there is very poor (stop them from getting 2 points vs. star player getting third foul). That is crazy, need to have an asst capable of stepping in and getting him out of there, put in O

 

[storange]

Ochefu is not a physical big and he plays like 22 minutes a game. Relax. The refs weren't great both ways, but I don't think they had a huge influence on the game.

No offense but your just plain wrong. No problem for Villanova, you take a gift like that because you know somewhere down the line your going to get the short end.

 

[jncuse]

Ochefu is not a physical big and he plays like 22 minutes a game. Relax. The refs weren't great both ways, but I don't think they had a huge influence on the game.

Let's assume that our homer goggles led us to miss many things the other way. Which all fans are inclined to do.

They still screwed up royally on the final sequence of the game... And given how crucial that sequence was, how can you say they did not impact the game?

 

[jordoo]

Let's assume that our homer goggles led us to miss many things the other way. Which all fans are inclined to do.

They still screwed up royally on the final sequence of the game... And given how crucial that sequence was, how can you say they did not impact the game?

I sat infront of 3 Nova fan's (mid 20's) and bantered with them but even they couldn't deny that the end was messed up. One said they thought they were trying to foul us. It didn't stop them from rejoicing and rubbing it in but they knew as well as all the SU fans around us that it was bogus.

 

[Melancer46]

Maybe I wasn't paying as much attention as usual as a result of watching with my girlfriend's family, but I didn't think any individual call was too horrible, but I guess just the buildup of weak calls going against us eventually resulted in us getting screwed. And yeah... Ryan Arcidaoiehioearho travelled on that game-tying bucket.

I wasn't surprised that Cooney didn't draw a foul when he fell over though. I thought he just lost his footing and fell over on his own and it just so happened that Arciadoijhaerijeaho's hands were touching him as it happened.

Gbinije calling a timeout earlier when we had multiple guys to inbound it too killed us though. Throwing it up for grabs like that when we once again had a wide open guy to inbound it too... I don't know who else we should have inbounding it, but he clearly doesn't have good vision. I would say Cooney but we need him on the court as a free throw shooter.

Edit: The one call that I was really pissed about was the one where McCullough was called for a foul because he happened to be in the air while a guy ran under him lol. I actually was waiting for them to call a flagrant since his foot hit someone's face while he was going along for the ride.

 

[jordoo]

Maybe I wasn't paying as much attention as usual as a result of watching with my girlfriend's family, but I didn't think any individual call was too horrible, but I guess just the buildup of weak calls going against us eventually resulted in us getting screwed. And yeah... Ryan Arcidaoiehioearho travelled on that game-tying bucket.

I wasn't surprised that Cooney didn't draw a foul when he fell over though. I thought he just lost his footing and fell over on his own and it just so happened that Arciadoijhaerijeaho's hands were touching him as it happened.

Gbinije calling a timeout earlier when we had multiple guys to inbound it too killed us though. Throwing it up for grabs like that when we once again had a wide open guy to inbound it too... I don't know who else we should have inbounding it, but he clearly doesn't have good vision. I would say Cooney but we need him on the court as a free throw shooter.

2 hands on a player is holding, pushing or impeding. All are fouls which is why in the NBA 2 hands on a player is an automatic whistle. College has just let the contact go for far too long and now its at a point where they have created a huge grey area in which pretty much anything could be called or not called at anytime. This makes it completely inconsistent which is sucking the enjoyment right out of it IMO for all NCAA games.

Yes SU made mistakes and should have won the game but the deck was stacked against them the whole way and any objective person would be able to spot out the inconsistent way that game was called especially in regards to the team initiating a vast majority of the contact on both ends being whistled for far fewer fouls and almost zero loose ball fouls.

 

[Fly Rodder]

College has just let the contact go for far too long and now its at a point where they have created a huge grey area in which pretty much anything could be called or not called at anytime.

This is the thing that drives me batty. The referees have essentially created a game where they control the action instead of just officiating it. There should never be a coach who says the referees were calling it tight or loose or just letting them play. In today's college game, there could be a whistle on every possession. Whether it gets blown or not, seems to depend on the ref's mood or hangover or who the home team is or which team is the underdog/favorite.

I'd like to rewatch the game and grab a GIF of the one possession in the 2nd half. Joseph and Cooney were trying to get the ball the Rak and he was edging out of the paint with this hands up. Ochefu was just laying the wood to him: smacking down his arms, pushing him in the back, hip checking him. And it was plain as day because it was out in the open on the camera side of the court. No whistle.

 

[jordoo]

This is the thing that drives me batty. The referees have essentially created a game where they control the action instead of just officiating it. There should never be a coach who says the referees were calling it tight or loose or just letting them play. In today's college game, there could be a whistle on every possession. Whether it gets blown or not, seems to depend on the ref's mood or hangover or who the home team is or which team is the underdog/favorite.

I'd like to rewatch the game and grab a GIF of the one possession in the 2nd half. Joseph and Cooney were trying to get the ball the Rak and he was edging out of the paint with this hands up. Ochefu was just laying the wood to him: smacking down his arms, pushing him in the back, hip checking him. And it was plain as day because it was out in the open on the camera side of the court. No whistle.

Agreed the more I think about the college bball officiating situation (which is way too much since its such a problem) it just comes down to them allowing so much contact on a regular basis that fouls are completely ambiguous and basically at the referees discretion/interpretation at that time rather than by the rules. You state the main issue well "The referees have essentially created a game where they control the action instead of just officiating it." I bet you could review individual refs game in and game out and see that they don't call things the same way game to game or even during the course of one single game. The referees, players and coaches should never have to get a "feel" for how its getting called. Like Jay Bilas says if its a foul it should be a foul at any point in the game. The problem is they do not officiate by the rule book at all anymore.

 

[Melancer46]

2 hands on a player is holding, pushing or impeding. All are fouls which is why in the NBA 2 hands on a player is an automatic whistle. College has just let the contact go for far too long and now its at a point where they have created a huge grey area in which pretty much anything could be called or not called at anytime. This makes it completely inconsistent which is sucking the enjoyment right out of it IMO for all NCAA games.

Yes SU made mistakes and should have won the game but the deck was stacked against them the whole way and any objective person would be able to spot out the inconsistent way that game was called especially in regards to the team initiating a vast majority of the contact on both ends being whistled for far fewer fouls and almost zero loose ball fouls.

Yeah, I'm not disagreeing with the fact that the 2 hands thing should be an automatic foul. I'm more just saying that isn't the reality of it, so I wasn't surprised at all that it wasn't called. I don't think Arcidoighaerniohno's hands were the cause of Cooney falling, which I assume is why they let it go even though Arciearohieaoihaeo had two hands on him.

 

[longislandcuse]

I understand your frustration, you saw a game slip from your hands in heartbreaking fashion. 5 points in 17.2 seconds. I saw a team that shored up their defense in the second half, attacked the zone by making inside passes, and overall had players with higher bball iq. Impartiality aside, how can you not like this Nova team? There's not one star player, and they dive for every loose ball. You guys showed that you're better than your record indicates but still have a lot of issues to work on.

Don't beat on me guys. I needed this win because my Eagles just got eliminated from the playoffs afterwards.

My Bills lost to the Raiders...THE RAIDERS!!! As an appetizer I got to watch that abomination of a basketball game in which my team was forced to play defense like ya'll had Ebola or risk fouling out.