For the people who have watched practice

[Alsacs]

Do we even practice offensive sets? I mean I know JB works on the zone and the team watches film of themselves and the opponents. I just don't see anything on offense that changes outside of the talent being able to shoot. This year's team can shoot a lot better but if the opponent gives adequate effort to shutdown our transition we turn into an exclusive ISO offense where the 5(Coleman) will set a pick and the defense never has to worry about a roll because he won't shoot jumpers.
I mean we run the same out of bounds plays to the point where I who
Knows nothing about basketball coaching could call them out. So we know the opponent knows them.
What do we do at practice to help the offense?

 

[NineOneSeven]

You will probably get a lot of BS replies to this, but I think it is a great question and I am genuinely interested as well how practices usually go. Not even just about offense, just the overall practice set-up.

 

[Cusefan0307]

The defense was worse.

 

[Alsacs]

The defense was worse.

The D was carved up by a smart good team. It will get better with more reps and effort. Our offense is lazy and I honestly don't know what the heck we do in practice to get better. It is The same pick and roll and jump shooting. We have no motion on offense the defense does not have to worry about who doesn't have the ball.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

They play lightning.

 

[Jasoncuse]

Running the exact same out of bounds play under the basket every single time is just silly. And now, it appears that there isn't even a desire to try to get a good look at the basket or for the inbounder rubbing off the screen. All we do is throw the ball out near mid court and try to set up our one pick and roll offensive set. It's maddening.

 

[Alsacs]

They play lightning.

Thanks for letting me know sport.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Thanks for letting me know sport.

Keep it here.

 

[Brooky03]

I laughed a little when the color commentator last night noted that Boeheim runs a very simple offense and it's good because it allows the players to just play and not think too much. That's all well and good when we have dynamic players who can hurt you in multiple ways like Melo, Wes, or Waiters. When we don't have those guys, which we don't this year, our offense is ugly.

I think we'll crush some decent-good teams this year because we'll have games where we shoot 40%+ from behind the arc with multiple guys filling it up. But when the 3's aren't falling, we're dead in the water. We're like a midmajor, just with taller guys. We can shoot and do nothing else.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I laughed a little when the color commentator last night noted that Boeheim runs a very simple offense and it's good because it allows the players to just play and not think too much. That's all well and good when we have dynamic players who can hurt you in multiple ways like Melo, Wes, or Waiters. When we don't have those guys, which we don't this year, our offense is ugly.

I think we'll crush some decent-good teams this year because we'll have games where we shoot 40%+ from behind the arc with multiple guys filling it up. But when the 3's aren't falling, we're dead in the water. We're like a midmajor, just with taller guys. We can shoot and do nothing else.

Wes is very similart to Lydon IMO. Very skilled outside of dribbling. He was not an iso player, but he did everything else well. You don't need isolation if you share the ball. We have Howard who can get to the basket and should be able to set people up.

This love of isolation by our fanbase is maddening. Mal was an ISO player and shot 35% from the field yet somehow months later you would think he was the best player we have had here in 10 years. He wasn't even our best/most important player last year.

 

[Alsacs]

Wes is very similart to Lydon IMO. Very skilled outside of dribbling He was not an iso player, but he did everything else well. You don't need isolation if you share the ball. We have Howard who can get to the basket and should be able to set people up.

This love of isolation by our fanbase is maddening. Mal was an ISO player and shot 35% from the field yet somehow months later you would think he was the best player we have had here in 10 years. He wasn't even our best/most important player last year.

I would ask though who loves the ISO offense in our fanbase? I think we all hate it but those who don't say anything probably realize JB isn't changing.

 

[Cusefan0307]

I would ask though who loves the ISO offense in our fanbase? I think we all hate it but those who don't say anything probably realize JB isn't changing.

I don't, but whenever anyone talks about their favorite players here they bring up guys who looked good one on one. Reading this board you would think Dion Waiters and Malachi Richardson were more important players here than Wes Johnson and Mike Gbinije.

 

[RF2044]

Do we even practice offensive sets? I mean I know JB works on the zone and the team watches film of themselves and the opponents. I just don't see anything on offense that changes outside of the talent being able to shoot. This year's team can shoot a lot better but if the opponent gives adequate effort to shutdown our transition we turn into an exclusive ISO offense where the 5(Coleman) will set a pick and the defense never has to worry about a roll because he won't shoot jumpers.
I mean we run the same out of bounds plays to the point where I who
Knows nothing about basketball coaching could call them out. So we know the opponent knows them.
What do we do at practice to help the offense?

Of course they do--it is a major component of most practices. But there are four factors that are beginning to emerge:

• It is harder to make plays when things aren't universally going your way, especially because our guys have zero offensive cohesion. Zero. Wisconsin put on a clinic in terms of how to execute half court offensive sets--nearly every shot they took, and I mean literally nearly every single one--was completely wide open. Clinic.
• Our starting lineup doesn't have any offensive diversification, can't make plays off of the bounce, and is too one dimensional.
• The point guards are doing an incredibly poor job relative to expectations in terms of running the offense.
• Saving the best for last, I'm beginning to wonder how much of the glowing early season reports [including the one I posted] were a function of the "spring football" phenomenon. I.E., people come away raving about how well the offense played, without taking into account that they accomplished it against our lousy defense.

 

[Alsacs]

Of course they do--it is a major component of most practices. But there are four factors that are beginning to emerge:

• It is harder to make plays when things aren't universally going your way, especially because our guys have zero offensive cohesion. Zero. Wisconsin put on a clinic in terms of how to execute half court offensive sets--nearly every shot they took, and I mean literally nearly every single one--was completely wide open. Clinic.
• Our starting lineup doesn't have any offensive diversification, can't make plays off of the bounce, and is too one dimensional.
• The point guards are doing an incredibly poor job relative to expectations in terms of running the offense.
• Saving the best for last, I'm beginning to wonder how much of the glowing early season reports [including the one I posted] were a function of the "spring football" phenomenon. I.E., people come away raving about how well the offense played, without taking into account that they accomplished it against our lousy defense.

What do we practice though? I just see nothing but pick and roll without a shooter in the roll spot.
We never move the ball. It is all beat your guy 1 on 1 or jump shot.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I would ask though who loves the ISO offense in our fanbase? I think we all hate it but those who don't say anything probably realize JB isn't changing.

Other than o-fan13, nobody gives a crap about iso ball. If we want to watch iso, put on TNT.

 

[RF2044]

What do we practice though? I just see nothing but pick and roll without a shooter in the roll spot.
We never move the ball. It is all beat your guy 1 on 1 or jump shot.

Not all practices are the same. But a typical SU practice will go something like this:

• Warm ups / individual pre-practice shooting
• Stretching
• Conditioning / running to limber up
• Fast paced, full court layup drills
• Breaking into positional units, for repetitive skills and shooting drills
• UCLA drill [which features 3 on 2 fast breaks, followed by a 2-1 break the other way -- to teach players how to attack with numbers, and how to defend shorthanded]
• Scrimmaging, which places a HEAVY emphasis on running offensive sets
• Form shooting drills
• Free throws
• Various drills that involve more conditioning / running and the team shooting from various spots on the floor tired [to simulate what they might experience during a game]

The notion that JB just rolls the ball out offensively is false. The team does work on structured plays, and running half court offensive sets. Ultimately, it comes down to the players. The talent is there for this to be a terrific offensive squad, but there's some kind of disconnect.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Still wondering about offense

 

[OttoMets]

Still wondering about offense

What, you don't think "Everybody spread the floor so Andrew White can take a step-back 21-footer without looking at his teammates" is a play they practice?

 

[two3zone]

I guess my question about the practice reports is, how in the hell could you be so far off with the talent evaluation.

 

[SoBeCuse]

This coach cannot coach good offense anymore. Relying on the zone too much which most of the time DOES its job. You can't be losing games when opponents score in the 50s. It was freaking still in the 40s before the final FTs!

 

[Zelda Zonk]

When JB said years ago 'we run only about ten different plays because the kids can't remember more than that,' was he exaggerating? Certainly looks like we have fewer plays and and a less diversified approach than everyone else.

So, does anyone think that's justifiable or effective in and of itself?
Why are we recruiting players with such poor memories?

 

[OttoMets]

This coach cannot coach good offense anymore. Relying on the zone too much which most of the time DOES its job. You can't be losing games when opponents score in the 50s. It was freaking still in the 40s before the final FTs!

Someone out there will make excuses.

But he hand-picked his team after running off 4 guys in the last couple years. He's got all the pieces, some obviously talented guys. And they're so much worse than the sum of their parts.

 

[We Are Syracuse]

Our zone offense is a joke. I count so many things we do wrong against it. Our PG literally just stands at the TOK 30 feet away as a reversal man. First off, if you're going to keep him there have him in scoring position where he can make a play. Wiscy had there stretch 4 just sitting 22 feet away at the TOK reversing the ball or shooting.

 

[retro44]

Do we even practice offensive sets? I mean I know JB works on the zone and the team watches film of themselves and the opponents. I just don't see anything on offense that changes outside of the talent being able to shoot. This year's team can shoot a lot better but if the opponent gives adequate effort to shutdown our transition we turn into an exclusive ISO offense where the 5(Coleman) will set a pick and the defense never has to worry about a roll because he won't shoot jumpers.
I mean we run the same out of bounds plays to the point where I who
Knows nothing about basketball coaching could call them out. So we know the opponent knows them.
What do we do at practice to help the offense?

I thought I heard from Boeheim he doesn'the do films for his next games