HOW THE ACC BECAME JUST ANOTHER CONFERENCE | Syracusefan.com

HOW THE ACC BECAME JUST ANOTHER CONFERENCE

Zack80

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How the ACC Became Just Another Conference

Lax Magazine give us this article.
I actually thought the ACC started this downward trend last season. I was surprised that the Big Ten was playing even with the ACC then. I really expected it to take 5+ years to the Big Ten to get close.

I don't think the ACC is just another conference yet. There aren't any Dartmouth's at the bottom of it for one thing.
 
Last edited:
How the ACC Became Just Another Conference

Lax Magazine give us this article.
I actually thought the ACC started this downward trend last season. I was surprised that the Big Ten was playing even with the ACC then. I really expected it to take 5+ years to the Big Ten to get close.

I don't think the ACC is just another conference yet. There aren't any Dartmouth's at the bottom of it for one thing.

Things are cyclical, the ACC has lost a ton to graduation the last few years and it finally caught up with a lot of the schools. The ACC has also been let down by their OOC record this year of which SU unfortunately played a prominent role. That said outside of your own Maryland team I am not sure there B10 has become the ACC of 3-4 years ago. Rutgers can't beat anyone of note away from home, Penn State is in year 7 or 8 in the Tambroni era and really hasn't done anything, Ohio State was great last year but took a step back due to graduation which was inevitable, Michigan is still years away, and JHU appears to be having a nice rebound year after a few disastrous seasons including losing by what felt like 40 in last years NCAA tourney and I still don't trust them at all in the NCAA tourney with that defense.

Going into next year, Syracuse, UVA and Duke return a ton, SU and UVA especially return almost everyone. Duke loses Guterding which I think will be massive but their always pretty good. UNC should rebound after an injury decimated year though the loss of Cloutier will be massive. I know JHU, Rutty and Maryland lose a ton to graduation especially Rutgers. Both Conferences are good easily 1-2 but the hyperbole in that article is a bit much.
 
At least the B1G has an AQ for their conference regular season champion. Wouldn't it be nice if the ACC had that right now? The ONLY conference that doesn't have an AQ.
 
Tournament Champion.
From LaxPower:Automatic Qualifiers and At-Large Teams

The Division I Men's Lacrosse Championship is an 18-team, single-elimination tournament. Nine conferences are eligible for automatic qualification. However, the two lowest-ranked AQ teams, regardless of conference RPI, will compete in a preliminary game to determine the final AQ spot in the 16-team bracket. The remaining teams are selected at large. Conferences with Automatic Qualifier (AQ) consideration are:America East
Big East
Big Ten
Colonial (CAA)
Ivy League
Metro Atlantic (MAAC)
Northeast (NEC)
Patriot League
Southern
 
From LaxPower:Automatic Qualifiers and At-Large Teams

The Division I Men's Lacrosse Championship is an 18-team, single-elimination tournament. Nine conferences are eligible for automatic qualification. However, the two lowest-ranked AQ teams, regardless of conference RPI, will compete in a preliminary game to determine the final AQ spot in the 16-team bracket. The remaining teams are selected at large. Conferences with Automatic Qualifier (AQ) consideration are:America East
Big East
Big Ten
Colonial (CAA)
Ivy League
Metro Atlantic (MAAC)
Northeast (NEC)
Patriot League
Southern

They all have tournaments. Tournament winner gets the AQ.
 
Things are cyclical, the ACC has lost a ton to graduation the last few years and it finally caught up with a lot of the schools. The ACC has also been let down by their OOC record this year of which SU unfortunately played a prominent role. That said outside of your own Maryland team I am not sure there B10 has become the ACC of 3-4 years ago. Rutgers can't beat anyone of note away from home, Penn State is in year 7 or 8 in the Tambroni era and really hasn't done anything, Ohio State was great last year but took a step back due to graduation which was inevitable, Michigan is still years away, and JHU appears to be having a nice rebound year after a few disastrous seasons including losing by what felt like 40 in last years NCAA tourney and I still don't trust them at all in the NCAA tourney with that defense.

Going into next year, Syracuse, UVA and Duke return a ton, SU and UVA especially return almost everyone. Duke loses Guterding which I think will be massive but their always pretty good. UNC should rebound after an injury decimated year though the loss of Cloutier will be massive. I know JHU, Rutty and Maryland lose a ton to graduation especially Rutgers. Both Conferences are good easily 1-2 but the hyperbole in that article is a bit much.

I think your prediction is a tad pessimistic towards the Big Ten and a tad optimistic towards the ACC. I don't really see the ACC returning to their status 3-4 years ago next year.
PSU, OSU, and Michigan all return a lot next year also. PSU has been struggling with the loss to injury of their star attackman Grant Ament. He should be back next year with Mac O'Keefe and their star FOman Gerard Arceri, and they should be quite tough. Speaking of cyclical, OSU has up odd years and down even years lately, next year is an odd year. OSU showed they can still play pretty well beating UMd last week. I don't know that Michigan is years away, they beat Notre Dame this year and only lost to Hopkins by 1 last week. They will have a lot more senior leadership next season. Rutgers does lose a lot and could struggle next season. Hopkins loses some top players: Tinney, Stanwick, and Moreland, but don't really lose a lot. They return Marr, Williams and DeSimone and bring in a top attack recruit in Epstein, Foley returns to lead the defense; FOs could be a problem. The Terps lose some key guys: Kelly, Rotanz, Dan Morris, and Bryce Young, but Tillman has been pretty resourceful and has a top attackman in Jared Bernhardt to build his offense around.

Duke does lose Conley and All-ACC goalie Fowler to go with Guterding, so their losses are getting fairly close to the Terps'. Maybe UNC will rebound, maybe OSU will rebound, OSU does return their star LeClaire. Where is Syracuse's big star on offense? Certainly didn't see him last night.

I tend to think the Terps won't be top 5 next year, but then I look at a lot of the other top 5 teams - Denver loses Baptiste, Duke loses Guterding, Albany is already struggling without Fields, and Yale loses Ben Reeves. So it will be interesting.
 
Things are cyclical, the ACC has lost a ton to graduation the last few years and it finally caught up with a lot of the schools. The ACC has also been let down by their OOC record this year of which SU unfortunately played a prominent role. That said outside of your own Maryland team I am not sure there B10 has become the ACC of 3-4 years ago. Rutgers can't beat anyone of note away from home, Penn State is in year 7 or 8 in the Tambroni era and really hasn't done anything, Ohio State was great last year but took a step back due to graduation which was inevitable, Michigan is still years away, and JHU appears to be having a nice rebound year after a few disastrous seasons including losing by what felt like 40 in last years NCAA tourney and I still don't trust them at all in the NCAA tourney with that defense.

Going into next year, Syracuse, UVA and Duke return a ton, SU and UVA especially return almost everyone. Duke loses Guterding which I think will be massive but their always pretty good. UNC should rebound after an injury decimated year though the loss of Cloutier will be massive. I know JHU, Rutty and Maryland lose a ton to graduation especially Rutgers. Both Conferences are good easily 1-2 but the hyperbole in that article is a bit
much.

Yes, there's that cyclical data reference, but if the ACC was still getting the top talent year in and year out as they did in the past, the cyclical lulls don't happen, at least not as notable. SU went to 24 straight final fours because they had the best talent, year in and year out. That cycle remained constant, regardless of the losses to graduation. The best players bar none are in the northeast/east coast. As long as SU/ACC can keep the majority of these guys here, it will still generally dominate.

I realize that UM and Hopkins are in the B1G, but they will always be east coasters in my view. Take UM & Hopkins (I still find Hopkins in the B1G as comical) away from the B1G, and it's nothing more than a low non P5 conference in hoops.
 
I realize that UM and Hopkins are in the B1G, but they will always be east coasters in my view. Take UM & Hopkins (I still find Hopkins in the B1G as comical) away from the B1G, and it's nothing more than a low non P5 conference in hoops.

Certainly it is true that when one looks at the history of the other 4 Big Ten teams, it pales in comparison to UMd, JHU, or the ACC teams.
But this thread is more about the current time, the last 2 seasons, and you have to deal with OSU making it to the NCAA final, knocking off Duke on the way last Spring, and then you have to deal with Michigan beating Notre Dame and Rutgers beating Syracuse this Spring.
 
Certainly it is true that when one looks at the history of the other 4 Big Ten teams, it pales in comparison to UMd, JHU, or the ACC teams.
But this thread is more about the current time, the last 2 seasons, and you have to deal with OSU making it to the NCAA final, knocking off Duke on the way last Spring, and then you have to deal with Michigan beating Notre Dame and Rutgers beating Syracuse this Spring.

Why are you even on a Syracuse lacrosse board. I am sure you can go where you are wanted.
 
Why are you even on a Syracuse lacrosse board. I am sure you can go where you are wanted.

I just enjoy discussing D1 lacrosse. I mainly discuss the more general topics.
There actually are a handful of pretty good posters here.
JeremyCuse is usually pretty good.
 
I just enjoy discussing D1 lacrosse. I mainly discuss the more general topics.
There actually are a handful of pretty good posters here.
JeremyCuse is usually pretty good.

Were happy to have ya Zack, different opinions make for a much better discussion. How about PSU today, oofa.
 
Certainly it is true that when one looks at the history of the other 4 Big Ten teams, it pales in comparison to UMd, JHU, or the ACC teams.
But this thread is more about the current time, the last 2 seasons, and you have to deal with OSU making it to the NCAA final, knocking off Duke on the way last Spring, and then you have to deal with Michigan beating Notre Dame and Rutgers beating Syracuse this Spring.

There's a thing in sports called upsets, you've likely heard of it. One victory or milestone does not equate to a change of guard. This is generally a down year for ND and SU, so those outlier type victories by UM & Rutgirls is relatively inconsequential in the realm of things. If moving forward over the next few years, this pattern becomes more than an anomaly, then I guess that would be the time to "deal" with it.
 
I think one of the issues you see with the “decline” of ACC play has to do with length of coaching tenures. UVa held on to Starsia too long and Cuse is doing the same with Desko. Corrigan has been at ND for two decades. While ppl may not agree with it, it helps to have change at some point to continue growth of the program.

Getting someone in the program that is younger and can relate to the players today helps. Cuse has no one on their sideline under 50, a lot has changed with the type of player recruited today. One thing I like about Duke is they have two younger coaches in Crotty and the younger Danowski. I’m sure Cuse can find a similar person to add as a volunteer and be a go between for players and Desko
 
The other thing to note about the comparative “rise” of the B1G is they have nowhere to go but up.

PSU and OSU have been Div I for decades and never won squat. Michigan’s program is brand spanking new.

JHU hasn’t won a title since before SU’s last two. And Maryland perennially underachieved for forty years until last year.

The B1G’s a nice lax conference that will continue to grow due to large AD budgets at massive land grant institutions and national growth of the game at the youth level.

But the point of this thread - that a snapshot in time (2017-2018) represents a decline of the ACC is absurdly misguided.

And Zack - this is more of a rant against that article and not your original post.
 

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