McNabb, Johnston, Anderson HOF nominees

[Stern]

Somewhat true, although Griese also [1] won a superbowl, [2] was part of the only "perfect" / undefeated season in NFL history, and [3] has gone on to have an illustrious career in football outside of his playing days, which also might be merit-worthy of inclusion.

I love McNabb. I just feel like he comes in a bit short for HOF criteria, but would love to see him get there.

Griese also led his team to 3 straight Super Bowls (yes he missed most of the 72 season but still)...and at the time that was an accomplishment for a QB that hadn't ever been done ever. Not till the Bills went to 4 straight did a QB take his team to 3 straight Super Bowls. I mean Griese is a hall of fame QB. If you want to complain about someone its Joe Namath who has more lifetime INT's than TD's. Almost 50 more INT's than TD's. He got in based off 1 game.

 

[djorange1989]

Freeney and Coughlin are LOCKS to make the Hall of Fame

I forgot about Coughlin, he could be the next SU guy in. Both should certainly make it, no doubt.

 

[KaiserUEO]

I forgot about Coughlin, he could be the next SU guy in. Both should certainly make it, no doubt.

how the F can you forget Tom Coughlin?????!!!

 

[kirbivore]

Good example, Vinatieri was great, but the Patriots have continued to be great since he left. They have been to three Super Bowls. Did they miss any field goals in those games? I honestly don't remember.

It's nice to have a great kicker, but you will be probably be fine with just an average kicker.

This wasn't a miss, but a big play in SB 42. Patriots had a 4th and around 10 in the 2nd quarter at the Giants 33 yd. line. It was Gostkowski's rookie year. They don't trust the kicker and go for it. They don't get it.

 

[sufandu]

mcnabb was a great player, hes in the iggs HOF. that alone is quite the accomplishment.

I don't see him making it to Canton unless the Veterans put him in which I now understand is 25 years from end of career.

on Aikman, that lousy SOB should not be in the HOF, save for being the QB on awesome teams back in the day. any halfway decent hack could've led them to 3 bowls.

My point exactly. Individuals often get too much credit for playing on good teams and others don't get enough when they play on bad ones.

McNabb played on a good one but people forget how much he had to do for them to be good and often remember him for the TO crap and the Redskins fiasco.

If he doesn't ever get in, I get it. He wasn't transcendent like a Marino was. If he does get in, I won't feel like I have to justify it. He's right on the fringe for me.

 

[donniesyracuse]

This wasn't a miss, but a big play in SB 42. Patriots had a 4th and around 10 in the 2nd quarter at the Giants 33 yd. line. It was Gostkowski's rookie year. They don't trust the kicker and go for it. They don't get it.

I think you're stretching pretty hard.

How many Super Bowl winning teams had elite kickers? What even is an elite kicker? All NFL kickers make a majority of their field goals. They are a $.10/dozen.

 

[sufandu]

Griese also led his team to 3 straight Super Bowls (yes he missed most of the 72 season but still)...and at the time that was an accomplishment for a QB that hadn't ever been done ever. Not till the Bills went to 4 straight did a QB take his team to 3 straight Super Bowls. I mean Griese is a hall of fame QB. If you want to complain about someone its Joe Namath who has more lifetime INT's than TD's. Almost 50 more INT's than TD's. He got in based off 1 game.

Did he LEAD them or did their defense and running game?

 

[RF2044]

My point exactly. Individuals often get too much credit for playing on good teams and others don't get enough when they play on bad ones.

McNabb played on a good one but people forget how much he had to do for them to be good and often remember him for the TO crap and the Redskins fiasco.

If he doesn't ever get in, I get it. He wasn't transcendent like a Marino was. If he does get in, I won't feel like I have to justify it. He's right on the fringe for me.

I agree with all of that. What he has in his favor was how many consecutive conference championship games he led the Iggs to, over a sustained period of consistency. Wish he could have gotten that SB win... that would really bolster his candidacy, IMO.

Otherwise, he's a very good / probably not HOF QB.

But if he gets in, I wouldn't feel the need to justify it, either. I just think he comes up a hair short.

 

[sufandu]

how the F can you forget Tom Coughlin?????!!!

Somehow non-players just don't mean as much to me. Having Al Davis in is pretty meaningless from an SU football perspective. Coughlin is a bit more meaningful because he coached at SU. As a player he was a backup for future HOF players.

 

[sufandu]

I agree with all of that. What he has in his favor was how many consecutive conference championship games he led the Iggs to, over a sustained period of consistency. Wish he could have gotten that SB win... that would really bolster his candidacy, IMO.

Otherwise, he's a very good / probably not HOF QB.

But if he gets in, I wouldn't feel the need to justify it, either. I just think he comes up a hair short.

Isn't it amazing though how if TO is healthy for that SB or if they had any other legit receiver and pull out a win, his case is strengthened. Doesn't change one thing about him but somehow matters.

 

[Stern]

Did he LEAD them or did their defense and running game?

He was the QB and had a huge part in leading them yes

 

[KaiserUEO]

Somehow non-players just don't mean as much to me. Having Al Davis in is pretty meaningless from an SU football perspective. Coughlin is a bit more meaningful because he coached at SU. As a player he was a backup for future HOF players.

al davis is a stretch for a number of reasons.

but to discount TC, or what you are really saying...discount all coaches to the HOF...is flat out wrong IMO.

you have a former player whos skill level took him no further than Syracuse, but his mind...cultivated at Syracuse got him to the highest level of his profession.

where he was an enormous success.

HALL OF FAME.

SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY, PRO FOOTBALL HALL OF FAMER.

 

[Chip]

Isn't it amazing though how if TO is healthy for that SB or if they had any other legit receiver and pull out a win, his case is strengthened. Doesn't change one thing about him but somehow matters.

TO had 9 catches for 122 in that SB. Couldn't have been that hurt.

Although I remember at the time thinking that it was impressive McNabb got them to the SB without him. Since the Eagles had tanked so badly in previous NFC Championship Games.

Something to be said for getting there. Something bigger to be said for finishing the job.

 

[sufandu]

He was the QB and had a huge part in leading them yes

He played in less than half of their games during their undefeated season. That doesn't sound like THE leader. It sounds like a good player that contributed.

The original post I responded to said "led them to three superbowls." If he was that important to them, they couldn't have gone undefeated without him. I'm not saying he shouldn't be in the HOF, but he benefited greatly from playing on a great team. They had two running backs go over 1000 yards and the best defense in the league.

 

[sufandu]

al davis is a stretch for a number of reasons.

but to discount TC, or what you are really saying...discount all coaches to the HOF...is flat out wrong IMO.

you have a former player whos skill level took him no further than Syracuse, but his mind...cultivated at Syracuse got him to the highest level of his profession.

where he was an enormous success.

HALL OF FAME.

SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY, PRO FOOTBALL HALL OF FAMER.

You misunderstood my post. I'm not discounting coaches. The importance to me as an SU fan isn't nearly as significant as one of our great players going on to be great in the NFL. If he had ever been SU's head coach and led us to success it would feel different for me. I think it's more significant to you because you're a giants fan. I'm not

Significance of the contribution while at SU is important to me. It's why I'll always care more about Dwight Freeney than Chandler Jones.

 

[sufandu]

TO had 9 catches for 122 in that SB. Couldn't have been that hurt.

Although I remember at the time thinking that it was impressive McNabb got them to the SB without him. Since the Eagles had tanked so badly in previous NFC Championship Games.

Something to be said for getting there. Something bigger to be said for finishing the job.

He was hurt. You could see him limping. Did McNabb not finish the job or did the defense not stop New England enough or did he not get enough help from the running game (Westbrook had 44 yards on 15 carries and the team had 45).

Brady benefited from 112 rushing yards from his team and Bill Belichick as his coach.

McNabb and TO carried that team but somehow McNabb lost that SB, not his defense or his RB? Exchange McNabb and Brady and which is more likely, the other team wins or the other QB wins?

 

[KaiserUEO]

You misunderstood my post. I'm not discounting coaches. The importance to me as an SU fan isn't nearly as significant as one of our great players going on to be great in the NFL. If he had ever been SU's head coach and led us to success it would feel different for me. I think it's more significant to you because you're a giants fan. I'm not

Significance of the contribution while at SU is important to me. It's why I'll always care more about Dwight Freeney than Chandler Jones.

i don't discriminate.

theyre all equal. (I do weigh the graduates a little more than a 2 and doner, but...my kingdom for a football 2 and doner)

be it the OG or the flashy WR...no different.

if they played here, and had football success after here...then Syracuse should get the recognition it deserves.

I wont bore the board with this topic any longer as it is a game week Friday.

 

[Stern]

He played in less than half of their games during their undefeated season. That doesn't sound like THE leader. It sounds like a good player that contributed.

The original post I responded to said "led them to three superbowls." If he was that important to them, they couldn't have gone undefeated without him. I'm not saying he shouldn't be in the HOF, but he benefited greatly from playing on a great team. They had two running backs go over 1000 yards and the best defense in the league.

His numbers for that era are HOF worthy. He is the first QB in history to lead (yes he missed a lot of that season but still) a team to 3 straight super bowls. You have a better case against Namath who shouldn't be in than you do against Griese in all honesty.

 

[SUfaninAZ]

As I've mentioned on occasion... Walt Sweeney should have been in a long time ago. Look him up.

 

[NJCuse97]

Freeney and Coughlin are LOCKS to make the Hall of Fame

I'm not sure about Freeney. Definitely not a lock.

 

[NJCuse97]

Somehow non-players just don't mean as much to me. Having Al Davis in is pretty meaningless from an SU football perspective. Coughlin is a bit more meaningful because he coached at SU. As a player he was a backup for future HOF players.

Al Davis played at Syracuse, and as an owner he was pretty good about trying to get SU guys on NFL rosters. Kevin Mason was a Raider

 

[Eric15]

You have a better case against Namath who shouldn't be in than you do against Griese in all honesty.

Namath might be the most overrated player in the history of the NFL.

 

[sufandu]

Al Davis played at Syracuse, and as an owner he was pretty good about trying to get SU guys on NFL rosters. Kevin Mason was a Raider

He never played at SU, despite trying out multiple times.

I get the pride people take in his connection to SU and his AFL/NFL success. I'm not saying anyone shouldn't. I'm just saying it doesn't feel as meaningful to me as a player that went on to have success as a pro player. It's just my opinion and I don't think people have to feel the same way. When I have discussions with fans of other schools they don't care that Al Davis went to SU, they care that Jim Brown did or that the Mackey Award was named after a SU player.

 

[AZOrange]

If Joe goddamn willy Namath is in, mcnabb should be .

 

[NJCuse97]

He never played at SU, despite trying out multiple times.

I get the pride people take in his connection to SU and his AFL/NFL success. I'm not saying anyone shouldn't. I'm just saying it doesn't feel as meaningful to me as a player that went on to have success as a pro player. It's just my opinion and I don't think people have to feel the same way. When I have discussions with fans of other schools they don't care that Al Davis went to SU, they care that Jim Brown did or that the Mackey Award was named after a SU player.

I get your point and in many regards I agree. I thought I remembered an article about Bernie Custis where it said that Al Davis tried to bring his former teammate to the NFL, but he would come as a CB or something so Custis went to the CFL to play QB instead. Turns out after checking I am wrong, the article says they were roommates, not teammates.