Red Season 1 Now a Bust

[Red2003]

I wonder the sesspool that this thread would've been if we lost the game last night in the 2nd half.

Just some fun facts about how this team has finished games in the 2nd half.

If we have a big lead (5+) we are: 11-0
If we have have a small Lead or Deficit (+/- 4 points) we are: 4-2 (Fell apart for Ga Tech & FSU)
If we have a big deficit (5+): 2-8 (Big Comebacks Colgate + Pitt round 1)

Autry is taking alot of heat about not making adjustments or our guys slacking in 2nd half but yet the record doesn't lie. The optics I think are getting mixed up as we had many bad blowouts, but we have not blown a big lead this year. I haven't looked at last few year but suspect we blew alot of leads and that's with more more Sr Leadership.

Autry and our young guys deserve some credit this year.

 

[Cuse181]

Way to miss the point!

There is no point being made.Those coaches wouldn’t have put themselves in a position to need to coach this team. It’s a hypothetical that completely ignores their strengths in roster construction.

 

[bnoro]

There is no point being made.Those coaches wouldn’t have put themselves in a position to need to coach this team. It’s a hypothetical that completely ignores their strengths in roster construction.

The point is IF those coaches had these players, and the set of circumstances that faced us this year, they would be in the same situation. It's not that deep.

 

[althea]

The NC State game is the worst SU coaching I have seen in a very, very long time!

You mean a game they won? Really.

 

[althea]

There is no point being made.Those coaches wouldn’t have put themselves in a position to need to coach this team. It’s a hypothetical that completely ignores their strengths in roster construction.

Your posts suggest that a magic wand and pixie dust are real things. FWIW they are not.

 

[orangecuse]

The point is IF those coaches had these players, and the set of circumstances that faced us this year, they would be in the same situation. It's not that deep.

Is the point and "set of circumstances" that you're referring to one that 'these coaches' played a role in contributing to?

 

[Cuse181]

Your posts suggest that a magic wand and pixie dust are real things. FWIW they are not.

yes of course, that is very unique to my posts and certainly not the one I was responding too. Their post was real, of course they know how the team would preform with legendary retired coaches meanwhile mine is simple fantasy.

 

[Orangezoo]

yes of course, that is very unique to my posts and certainly not the one I was responding too. Their post was real, of course they know how the team would preform with legendary retired coaches meanwhile mine is simple fantasy.

You make a living moving the goalposts and dodging the arguments you have made. Again let’s point to Pitino and how well he is doing and how he would have done so much better than Red… or maybe Cooley… the pixie dust is the depth of your arguments on this topic. Lots of criticizing Red and then weak arguments for how (insert name here) would have done so much better.

 

[Orangezoo]

This The NC State game is the worst SU coaching I have seen in a very, very long time!

sir this is a Wendy’s….

 

[bnoro]

Is the point and "set of circumstances" that you're referring to one that 'these coaches' played a role in contributing to?

These coaches played a role in the injuries to Hima, Westry, McLeod, & Carey, as well as the behavior of Benny Williams resulting in his dismissal?

 

[grepal]

These coaches played a role in the injuries to Hima, Westry, McLeod, & Carey, as well as the behavior of Benny Williams resulting in his dismissal?

Huh?

 

[orangecuse]

The point is IF those coaches had these players, and the set of circumstances that faced us this year, they would be in the same situation. It's not that deep.

These coaches played a role in the injuries to Hima, Westry, McLeod, & Carey, as well as the behavior of Benny Williams resulting in his dismissal?

"Set of circumstances" can be interpreted broadly. If you were specifically referring to the particular injuries the aforementioned players sustained during the course of the season, well, of course not. However, in regards to Westry, one certainly can argue that Red took a degree of risk there and as it played out, it didn't work out, at least not for this season. So, in that regard, he has some degree of ownership to the "set of circumstances."

Benny has been an enigma since his frosh season. Last year, there were behavorial issues, so his behavior problem didn't come out of left field where Red was unaware, etc. He made the choice to keep him on the roster, and as that played out, these behavioral patterns continued as they did in the past, and, inevitably dismissed. Therefore, as the head coach, he has a degree of culpability there as well.

Red is the head coach and is ultimately responsible for the roster he comprehensively constructs and maintains.

 

[CardiacCuse]

IMO firing Red after just two years would be a bad move. What decent caliber coach is going to consider coming here knowing the school will pull the trigger on them after a short time? Especially for a school that is close to 10+ years from it's former glory.

There's also a lot of context to consider when considering a change. If next season is a complete disaster, then yes you might move on from Red. If it's a missed tourney year but the team has injuries again + Red has a good recruiting class locked up, then I think moving on from isn't a wise move. There's always multiple variables to consider.

I think most people expect SU to be a top 25 team, they just know it might take a little time given the current state.

the X's and O's are just so spotty though

my biggest issue with the current team is strategic mediocrity

I dont see that improving no matter how much time the current coaches get because some of the decisions they have been making indicate a lack of basic aptitude for the job

in other words, the issues I have with the current staff are highly unlikely to get fixed with more seasons

 

[orange79]

the X's and O's are just so spotty though

my biggest issue with the current team is strategic mediocrity

I dont see that improving no matter how much time the current coaches get because some of the decisions they have been making indicate a lack of basic aptitude for the job

in other words, the issues I have with the current staff are highly unlikely to get fixed with more seasons

What does that even mean?

 

[CuseTG2003]

What does that even mean?

Strategically choosing to be mediocre. It's a wise move few make.

 

[SwagSocks]

With the hardest schedule in prob over a decade. But yeah he’s got no clue what he’s doing

I like Red, but what made our schedule so hard? Playing Tennessee and then a very average Gonzaga team?

Didn't have to play Duke, UVA twice.
Got to play Lville, BC (given) twice.

 

[orange79]

Strategically choosing to be mediocre. It's a wise move few make.

 

[CuseTG2003]

I like Red, but what made our schedule so hard? Playing Tennessee and then a very average Gonzaga team?

Didn't have to play Duke, UVA twice.
Got to play Lville, BC (given) twice.

Our strength of schedule is ranked 21st by Kenpom. It's been a very tough schedule.

 

[CuseTG2003]

View attachment 237981

Very well played

 

[Bulldog04]

I like Red, but what made our schedule so hard? Playing Tennessee and then a very average Gonzaga team?

Didn't have to play Duke, UVA twice.
Got to play Lville, BC (given) twice.

It is ranked as the 5th hardest schedule on several sites

 

[SwagSocks]

It is ranked as the 5th hardest schedule on several sites

You are probably right but I dont think it was a brutal schedule. Besides TENN and Zags who was a tough OOC? (Also zags arent that good, and are a bubble team) Oregon neutral site really bringing up the strength that much? ACC apparently sucks too so i am not sure why people think its that tougn

In OOC right now the only lock to make it is TENN. Metrics might say one thing but i dont see it that way.

 

[bnoro]

"Set of circumstances" can be interpreted broadly. If you were specifically referring to the particular injuries the aforementioned players sustained during the course of the season, well, of course not. However, in regards to Westry, one certainly can argue that Red took a degree of risk there and as it played out, it didn't work out, at least not for this season. So, in that regard, he has some degree of ownership to the "set of circumstances."

Benny has been an enigma since his frosh season. Last year, there were behavorial issues, so his behavior problem didn't come out of left field where Red was unaware, etc. He made the choice to keep him on the roster, and as that played out, these behavioral patterns continued as they did in the past, and, inevitably dismissed. Therefore, as the head coach, he has a degree of culpability there as well.

Red is the head coach and is ultimately responsible for the roster he comprehensively constructs and maintains.

I mean, it can be interpreted broadly, but yes, I was referring to the injuries.

And Red dismissing Benny before the season would've alienated the entire team. It's ridiculous to call him culpable for what happened.

 

[djcon57]

I like Red, but what made our schedule so hard? Playing Tennessee and then a very average Gonzaga team?

Didn't have to play Duke, UVA twice.
Got to play Lville, BC (given) twice.

Not "hard" necessarily, but Cornell and Colgate are winning their conference right now. LSU is actually ahead of us in KenPom. Honestly, one of games that penalized us was G'Town. Screw them.

 

[orangecuse]

I mean, it can be interpreted broadly, but yes, I was referring to the injuries.

And Red dismissing Benny before the season would've alienated the entire team. It's ridiculous to call him culpable for what happened.

Your "alienated the entire team" sentiment is simply your opinion, you can not provide any proof to ascertain such as fact. Who really knows?

What is a fact, is that Red decided to take the risk of keeping him on the roster being fully aware of his behavioral issues and patterns. You want to call that fact as being completely amiss of any degree of culpability relative to his roster, so be it. I won't call your view ridiculous, I'll just agree to disagree.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

It's hilarious that some fans apparently think they are doing their part to help the program by holding it to "high standards and expectations." On a fan message board no less. If you have optimism or look for bright spots in the midst of a crappy era for the program, you are soft and part of the problem. It's not just you, seems many others think same thing that comes up a lot, sometimes in much more absurd posts than this one. It's not a personal attack just an observation that such a point of view is completely delusional.

Lol