Current assessment vs expectations

[baggerbob]

Need a true PG, one that loves to create and pass - not a selfish slasher that can't shoot, hates to pass, makes boneheaded plays at the worst time, and has absolutely zero leadership.

Someone said Carey is injured again. Time to move on 3 injuries in 3 years, can't count on him ever being a player.
The only center to keep would be Patterson, because he is unknown.
That opens up 4 spots counting Williams, actually 5 because Judah should be gone.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

Someone said Carey is injured again. Time to move on 3 injuries in 3 years, can't count on him ever being a player.
The only center to keep would be Patterson, because he is unknown.
That opens up 4 spots counting Williams, actually 5 because Judah should be gone.

Patterson is unknown to fans but not to the staff. If he’s here next year it means the staff thinks he can develop into a P5 center. If he can’t get there we need to move on. He wasn’t really recruited out of high school. I have my doubts if he can develop into an ACC caliber center. We’ve had too many prospects with a “sign & hope” strategy. We need a “sign & know” strategy going forward. Seems like Freeman and Moore fit that mold.

 

[realorange]

My worry is that Red really doesn’t have an outside/non-Syracuse perspective on how to change and improve the program. Many things aren’t working right now with the program and it really takes an outside opinion to point out things that need to be changed. Red desperately needs to make a key staff hire to give him that outside perspective. GMac and Grif aren’t those guys. Real change needs to come from a new, fresh, outside perspective.

So Red's time as an AAU coach and on the staff at Va Tech didn't give him a different perspective?

 

[SoBristol]

. . . .Seems like Freeman and Moore fit that mold.

Freeman is top 10 -15 per recruiting sites, so clearly one of our best in years. Add Freeman to Brown, and next year’s team can at least compete inside. Different ball game. Then you can judge Red.

Find another inside player in the portal, all the better.

 

[zilo]

Someone said Carey is injured again. Time to move on 3 injuries in 3 years, can't count on him ever being a player.
The only center to keep would be Patterson, because he is unknown.
That opens up 4 spots counting Williams, actually 5 because Judah should be gone.

Agreed. Judah, Taylor, Carey, and Hima should be gone after this year, plus, Benny that's 5. We have Freeman and Moore coming in, so Red needs to go bring in the best possible Pg, Sf, and C that he can from the portal. If done right, all 3 portal transfers should be starting caliber. Then you plug JJ in at the 2, Brown at the 4, Freeman first man off the bench, Bell and Moore come in for a spark and shooting off the bench. McLeod backup C if he can stay healthy and cope, Westry, and Cuffe battle for backup G min

 

[Scooch]

My worry is that Red really doesn’t have an outside/non-Syracuse perspective on how to change and improve the program. Many things aren’t working right now with the program and it really takes an outside opinion to point out things that need to be changed. Red desperately needs to make a key staff hire to give him that outside perspective. GMac and Grif aren’t those guys. Real change needs to come from a new, fresh, outside perspective.

I agree, we need more non-Syracuse lifer POVs.

I hate to sound so detached, but like I said previously, Red will either get it done, or he won’t.

And if it’s the latter we’ll need to move on, and likely rapidly. Things are moving too quickly in the college landscape to clutch onto a non-performing HC in football or men’s hoops too long.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

So Red's time as an AAU coach and on the staff at Va Tech didn't give him a different perspective?

That was a long time ago and Grif and GMac don’t have enough experience outside the program to bring a different perspective. They’ve created a bit of an echo chamber by having only alumni guards make up the staff for so long.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

Freeman is top 10 -15 per recruiting sites, so clearly one of our best in years. Add Freeman to Brown, and next year’s team can at least compete inside. Different ball game. Then you can judge Red.

Find another inside player in the portal, all the better.

Need at least two more inside players. Preferably one that can rebound and one capable of shooting the mid-range and long-range shot.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I think Bell and Copeland have improved, but I’m not sure either are starters on a top 25 team.

They’re not. We have a recent bias at play here. It’s been a decade since we’ve seen a legit top 25 SU team. Some of us weren’t even born yet.

 

[baggerbob]

I agree, we need more non-Syracuse lifer POVs.

I hate to sound so detached, but like I said previously, Red will either get it done, or he won’t.

And if it’s the latter we’ll need to move on, and likely rapidly. Things are moving too quickly in the college landscape to clutch onto a non-performing HC in football or men’s hoops too long.

We looked at how bad our recruiting was in football before Fran.
If you go to 247 for basketball recruiting, our last good class before next year's, was when we recruited McCullough.
That tells you why we have been bad for so long it's not having good players.
And that is on the head coach who gave up on recruiting, because he didn't want to spend the time needed to get the best players.

 

[newmexicuse]

I assume we will bring back Maliq, JJ, Cope, Westry, Bell, and MacLeod. We add Freeman and Moore.

Where would that leave us ?

Maliq and Bell would probably be starting forwards. Freeman should get plenty of minutes off the bench. That is a huge upgrade over this season's forwards.

JJ and Cope can be starting guards. Moore can be the third guard.

MacLeod can be a backup center. Brown could also play some backup center depending upon how good Freeman does.

That would leave the biggest portal need as a bona fide starting caliber center. Getting the right guy in this slot could really solidify the team. Gimme a tough kid who can rebound and defend the interior and has at least a little bit of an inside game other than a dunk, if he could hit an occasional trey - perfecto !!!

Westry is a huge wild card - can he even play, and if so, at what level ?

With this situation, I would not see us attracting any really top guys at G or F, since it would be hard to say that minutes or even starting could be guaranteed unless we are talking about getting a mega talent. Possibly a plus PG could supplant Cope as starting guard, but I do love the way Cope sees the floor and I think Cope is starting caliber.

 

[Red2003]

I assume we will bring back Maliq, JJ, Cope, Westry, Bell, and MacLeod. We add Freeman and Moore.

Where would that leave us ?

Maliq and Bell would probably be starting forwards. Freeman should get plenty of minutes off the bench. That is a huge upgrade over this season's forwards.

JJ and Cope can be starting guards. Moore can be the third guard.

MacLeod can be a backup center. Brown could also play some backup center depending upon how good Freeman does.

That would leave the biggest portal need as a bona fide starting caliber center. Getting the right guy in this slot could really solidify the team. Gimme a tough kid who can rebound and defend the interior and has at least a little bit of an inside game other than a dunk, if he could hit an occasional trey - perfecto !!!

Westry is a huge wild card - can he even play, and if so, at what level ?

With this situation, I would not see us attracting any really top guys at G or F, since it would be hard to say that minutes or even starting could be guaranteed unless we are talking about getting a mega talent. Possibly a plus PG could supplant Cope as starting guard, but I do love the way Cope sees the floor and I think Cope is starting caliber.

This is correct.

 

[Cusefan0307]

They’re not. We have a recent bias at play here. It’s been a decade since we’ve seen a legit top 25 SU team. Some of us weren’t even born yet.

You’re ten?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I assume we will bring back Maliq, JJ, Cope, Westry, Bell, and MacLeod. We add Freeman and Moore.

Where would that leave us ?

Maliq and Bell would probably be starting forwards. Freeman should get plenty of minutes off the bench. That is a huge upgrade over this season's forwards.

JJ and Cope can be starting guards. Moore can be the third guard.

MacLeod can be a backup center. Brown could also play some backup center depending upon how good Freeman does.

That would leave the biggest portal need as a bona fide starting caliber center. Getting the right guy in this slot could really solidify the team. Gimme a tough kid who can rebound and defend the interior and has at least a little bit of an inside game other than a dunk, if he could hit an occasional trey - perfecto !!!

Westry is a huge wild card - can he even play, and if so, at what level ?

With this situation, I would not see us attracting any really top guys at G or F, since it would be hard to say that minutes or even starting could be guaranteed unless we are talking about getting a mega talent. Possibly a plus PG could supplant Cope as starting guard, but I do love the way Cope sees the floor and I think Cope is starting caliber.

Freeman is going to start.

 

[swish7]

If we were going to have a successful season we needed several players to improve. The reality is very few have improved and we’ve had far more busts and injuries to expect a successful season. Here’s the assessment of each player:

Mintz - needed him to make a big jump forward as a premier guard in college basketball. Reality is he’s largely the same player as last year
JJ - needed him to live up to McD AA hype. Reality is he’s struggled with his shot and has been woefully inconsistent
Bell - needed him to be more than just a shooter. Reality is he’s largely just a shooter, although he’s improved a bit
Taylor - needed him to be a consistent deep threat. Reality is he’s struggling as much as any starter in SU history. Massive bust so far
Brown - needed him to be a force down low. Reality is he’s lived up to expectations and is largely the reason we’ve won as many games as we’ve had
Cope - needed him to improve from last year. Reality is he has improved since last year, but needs to develop a consistent shot
McLeod - needed him to develop into a dominating center and rebounding force. Reality is he’s been a bust even before his injury
Cuffe - needed him to provide depth at guard and outside shooting. Reality is he’s been buried on the bench and hasn’t really made an impact
Westry - needed him to provide depth or even start at SF/SG. Reality is the guy is injured and we don’t know if he’ll ever be back
Hima - needed him to be a solid backup at center. Reality is he’s constantly injured and can’t play more than a minute at a time
Carey - needed him to show he can play at this level. Reality is it looks like he’s not cut out to play at this level
Patterson - needed him to redshirt and get stronger. Reality is he’s redshirting, who knows about the other stuff
Benny - needed him to finally make the jump to be a great college small forward like we all thought when he was recruited. Reality is he became one of the biggest bust in SU basketball history and ended up getting kicked off the team

Looking at that assessment I’m actually surprised we’ve won 15 games so far under Red. He’s got his work cut out for him to reshape the roster after this season. He’ll be challenged very early in his head coaching tenure. Let’s hope he figures it out and is able to bring in another 2 or 3 strong players to address the team’s issues. If guys like Hima and Westry are too injured they need to be medically retired. Guys that can’t improve or are not capable of playing at this level need to be asked to move on. The remaining players need to make a big leap forward to improve on their weaknesses. Next year is a critical year for Syracuse basketball. NCAA tournament is the expectation. It must happen or Wildhack has to end the JB succession plan and take the program in a different direction like he did with football.

The assessment is a bit harsh on some players..

Agree about JT, Hima, Naheem, Cuffe, Westby, Brown.

Judah definitely has been a big reason we've won most of these games. His slide is more recent. I agree he hasn't improved enough or in the way we really needed him to, but he's been good to great more often than not.

JJ looked like a bust early, and has recently shown great improvement.

I don't think Benny has been the biggest bust in program history. I'd say Winfred Walton holds that honor.

Copeland has improved, but he set a low bar for himself last year.

Bell? Hard to say... seems to be benefitting from Benny being gone.

 

[Scooch]

Freeman is going to start.

Yeah, if he can’t beat out Bell for a starting spot then we’re truly screwed.

 

[kirbivore]

I agree, we need more non-Syracuse lifer POVs.

I hate to sound so detached, but like I said previously, Red will either get it done, or he won’t.

And if it’s the latter we’ll need to move on, and likely rapidly. Things are moving too quickly in the college landscape to clutch onto a non-performing HC in football or men’s hoops too long.

IFFFFFFFF Autry doesn't get it done SU needs a full national search with all JB remnants purged.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

The assessment is a bit harsh on some players..

Agree about JT, Hima, Naheem, Cuffe, Westby, Brown.

Judah definitely has been a big reason we've won most of these games. His slide is more recent. I agree he hasn't improved enough or in the way we really needed him to, but he's been good to great more often than not.

JJ looked like a bust early, and has recently shown great improvement.

I don't think Benny has been the biggest bust in program history. I'd say Winfred Walton holds that honor.

Copeland has improved, but he set a low bar for himself last year.

Bell? Hard to say... seems to be benefitting from Benny being gone.

Not sure how you can claim Walton was the biggest bust in Syracuse history when he never played a game in a Syracuse uniform. Benny at least got here and busted (or imploded if that is a better term).

 

[OrlandoCuse]

You’re ten?

He joined site in 2015 so it’s plausible

 

[OrlandoCuse]

Yeah, if he can’t beat out Bell for a starting spot then we’re truly screwed.

I’d rather see Bell move to SG than start over Freeman at SF

 

[NorSyr66]

Give it another year dudes. Red was always playing the long game with the youth. Just for recency lets talk Clemson who will yes make the tournament this year but will Brownell ever get them back again, who knows. He has 5 Seniors walking out the door, 4 of the of them that have been playing a half decade. He is not getting recruits. Is he going to be able to replace all those pieces in the portal no way.

There are 2 years worth of players leaving in a month, not the usual 1. These are the career college guys like Girard and Jesse that stayed for NIL and will be off to Europe or Asia for 3 years before who knows. The covid kids are done finally and they are leaving behind underclassmen that have not got nearly as many minutes as they usually would have. Most of the ACC has 1-2 underclassmen seeing real mins.

In one short offseason we will go from the youngest least experienced team to the oldest most experienced team in the ACC. This week alone we will see a UNC and Clemson team of 23.5 year olds and we have 6 guys that can't buy a beer.

It's on Autry for going too young and taking chances on injury prone guys but let's see if he learns.

When Autry stops getting in top HS recruits or stops getting top portal talent then I'll say let's get the pitchforks out but that hasn't happened.

I had to like this post for no more than the statement about the ages of Clemson and UNC vs our team that can not buy beer yet! That one hit summed it up perfectly

 

[DilemaCuse]

IFFFFFFFF Autry doesn't get it done SU needs a full national search with all JB remnants purged.

Yeah I describe this contract/tenure as a long Audition, not a marriage.

 

[23Zone]

Brown, Freeman, and Starling are 100% starting next year.

Need a real center and a true well rounded PG (ala Ennis) from the portal.

Cope, Moore, Bell, and hopefully Chance off the bench.