Since we have so many great coaches on this board

[upperdeck]

if you read all the takes they have all the answers.. so just what D should we be playing?

if you cant stop the deep ball with tampa 2 then what will work? we dont have corners to man up all game, we dont have safeties with great size/speed to cover the back end , so its pick your poison when we play teams with a HUGE advantage at OLINE and WR..

lets see how wake and BC work out first

 

[Millhouse]

if you read all the takes they have all the answers.. so just what D should we be playing?

if you cant stop the deep ball with tampa 2 then what will work? we dont have corners to man up all game, we dont have safeties with great size/speed to cover the back end , so its pick your poison when we play teams with a HUGE advantage at OLINE and WR..

lets see how wake and BC work out first

I'm concerned about how well they're teaching more than the scheme. They look too confused to me

 

[Cusefan78]

They aren't the right players for the scheme. Simple as that. Players are being forced to play different positions because of injuries and some players are being rushed to service cause of depth and or quality of the upper classmen.

 

[PhatOrange]

Corey Winfield got beat on the long pass because he bit on the play fake. Why is Corey worried about run support ? His first and only job should be to cover the wr and not be worried about the rb taking a handoff. I assume thats on Winfield

 

[Orangetradition44]

Personally I think this is overblown and a cop out. I'm with Millhouse... They look confused and unsure of their responsibilities and to me that's coaching. Now the three missed tackles on that first touchdown... That's a pro wide receiver against lesser talent.

They aren't the right players for the scheme. Simple as that. Players are being forced to play different positions because of injuries and some players are being rushed to service cause of depth and or quality of the upper classmen.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Personally I think this is overblown and a cop out. I'm with Millhouse... They look confused and unsure of their responsibilities and to me that's coaching. Now the three missed tackles on that first touchdown... That's a pro wide receiver against lesser talent.

Agreed, it's the perfect storm, it's really not easy to be this bad, scheme, coaching, and talent.. you have to be bad at all 3 to be this bad, but I agree the biggest issue to me is mass confusion that is what leads to the total btreakdowns. I think scheme is well below the coaching and talent as we ur bigger issues

 

[HRE Otto IV]

if you read all the takes they have all the answers.. so just what D should we be playing?

if you cant stop the deep ball with tampa 2 then what will work? we dont have corners to man up all game, we dont have safeties with great size/speed to cover the back end , so its pick your poison when we play teams with a HUGE advantage at OLINE and WR..

lets see how wake and BC work out first

WE ARE NOT PLAYING A TAMPA 2.

We are tied for 122nd out of 128 teams in yards per play. To be fair that doesn't take into account SOS. IMO our D talent is bad but it is good enough to make the Top 75% of CFB. Sure being 96th in the nation still sucks but it isn't as bad as 122nd. That difference IMO is on coaching. So what happens when our talent is 64th? Are we going to be 90th on D? If so we aren't going to be much more than a .500 team.

We have only played 5 games this year thus far. Compared to the ENTRIE year last year:

Plays over 40 yards
2016 Twelve
2015 Sixteen

Plays over 50 yards
2016 Nine
2015 Seven

We have already given up more 50+ yard plays this season. In that category we are a lot worse than last season. We returned the majority of our D we shouldn't be worse even with a system change.

 

[upperdeck]

many of these guys were just as confused last year on D. we have played 3 games against teams with huge WR advantage, the 2 who didnt we look OK on D.

when a DB hands off a WR to the safety and there is no safety, is that coaching? thats 2 guys not being on the same page.

ND moves the ball on everyone, turns out Texas has huge issues on D too and they have great talent. right now the offense has to win these types of games and its not ready to do that, we scored 33, gave away 8-10 in the kicking game. if the coach is right they are a yr away from being decent on Offense. that puts us in the 45-50 pt range and then its a winnable game with a D thats not very good.

 

[oldpinepoint]

I'll say this, how many times do you need to tell a kid his responsibilities before he does it. My point is that the coaches I'm sure are teaching the right technique and instruction that they want to see. Now if the kid doesn't get it or relies on old habits is it on the coach? Should he start the next player? I just don't think it's that simple, it will take A LONG time for these kids to develop new techniques, learn the system and allow them to become habits. You can only tell a kid so many times that he has outside contain, but if he continuously can't perform his duty, what do you do? Especially if you have a serious depth issue.

 

[djorange1989]

Forget about the NFL draft, the majority of our defense isn't ACC level talent. Period. Too small, too slow. I am not a fan of a defensive scheme that, minus a great front 4, cannot create pressure on the QB. I would like us to adopt a more aggressive defensive scheme but we badly, desperately need a talent upgrade. As Millhouse said, just have an ordinary bad D with a Babers offense and we can win.

 

[DoctorBombay]

I'll say this, how many times do you need to tell a kid his responsibilities before he does it. My point is that the coaches I'm sure are teaching the right technique and instruction that they want to see. Now if the kid doesn't get it or relies on old habits is it on the coach? Should he start the next player? I just don't think it's that simple, it will take A LONG time for these kids to develop new techniques, learn the system and allow them to become habits. You can only tell a kid so many times that he has outside contain, but if he continuously can't perform his duty, what do you do? Especially if you have a serious depth issue.

Not for nothing but I assume you don't have kids or else you'd never ask this question. As a parent of 2 teenagers and a tween girl, the answer is "until". You're welcome.

 

[Briancuse]

We need to start blitzing more, we are probably going to get beat in the secondary anyway, might as well send some more pressure. And we need to start mixing up coverages, try to confuse other qb's.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Not for nothing but I assume you don't have kids or else you'd never ask this question. As a parent of 2 teenagers and a tween girl, the answer is "until". You're welcome.

Sometimes, until they have kids of their own

 

[tipphill]

th

if you read all the takes they have all the answers.. so just what D should we be playing?

if you cant stop the deep ball with tampa 2 then what will work? we dont have corners to man up all game, we dont have safeties with great size/speed to cover the back end , so its pick your poison when we play teams with a HUGE advantage at OLINE and WR..

lets see how wake and BC work out first

that is for babers to figure out---i do not fault the d players , they are not skilled enough AT this point. i question the scheme given the talent that u have.

 

[Hoov50]

WE ARE NOT PLAYING A TAMPA 2.

We are tied for 122nd out of 128 teams in yards per play. To be fair that doesn't take into account SOS. IMO our D talent is bad but it is good enough to make the Top 75% of CFB. Sure being 96th in the nation still sucks but it isn't as bad as 122nd. That difference IMO is on coaching. So what happens when our talent is 64th? Are we going to be 90th on D? If so we aren't going to be much more than a .500 team.

We have only played 5 games this year thus far. Compared to the ENTRIE year last year:

Plays over 40 yards
2016 Twelve
2015 Sixteen

Plays over 50 yards
2016 Nine
2015 Seven

We have already given up more 50+ yard plays this season. In that category we are a lot worse than last season. We returned the majority of our D we shouldn't be worse even with a system change.

I honestly don't know the answer to this question, but compared to last year how many plays a game more or less are our opponents running this season? A byproduct of us running more plays and our quicker pace would seem to be more opportunities for the opponent. With that in mind a stat like 3 and outs or opponent drives ending in punts through five games may be a better comparison. These stats may show the same thing, I truly don't know.

 

[Hoov50]

Not for nothing but I assume you don't have kids or else you'd never ask this question. As a parent of 2 teenagers and a tween girl, the answer is "until". You're welcome.

As a parent and a coach of high schoolers I would like to add this: You're going to think they get it and they may even do it correctly a few times, but chances are "until" hasn't come yet!

 

[SmilinBob]

Stop using the Tampa 2 and go to the Syracuse 16. 16 on D will help ease the transition to the Tampa 2.

 

[tipphill]

I'll say this, how many times do you need to tell a kid his responsibilities before he does it. My point is that the coaches I'm sure are teaching the right technique and instruction that they want to see. Now if the kid doesn't get it or relies on old habits is it on the coach? Should he start the next player? I just don't think it's that simple, it will take A LONG time for these kids to develop new techniques, learn the system and allow them to become habits. You can only tell a kid so many times that he has outside contain, but if he continuously can't perform his duty, what do you do? Especially if you have a serious depth issue.

i buy into the fact that we are playing a lot of new kids and they need time to mature. i also buy into that our talent is marginal at this time . as per dino our kids are going up against 4-5 star guys, and being young does not help that.
this is a wait and see season. waiting to see if the kids can mature, and seeing is how dino recruits, players on both sides of the ball. i have to believe the coaches know what they are doing and maybe trying to adapt to the existing talent level, as best they can. murphy is having a tough time now and i am not sure why.

 

[CuseOnly]

Corey Winfield got beat on the long pass because he bit on the play fake. Why is Corey worried about run support ? His first and only job should be to cover the wr and not be worried about the rb taking a handoff. I assume thats on Winfield

If you know or have read about the Tampa 2 when we are actually running it on the field, the corners are the only outside defense against the run and if they aren't great open field tacklers, it's off to the races. That is why this scheme relies on larger more physical corners with great tackling skills in the open field. That is why they are looking in the backfield.

That is why they are looking in the backfield.

 

[PhatOrange]

If you know or have read about the Tampa 2 when we are actually running it on the field, the corners are the only outside defense against the run and if they aren't great open field tacklers, it's off to the races. That is why this scheme relies on larger more physical corners with great tackling skills in the open field. That is why they are looking in the backfield.

That is why they are looking in the backfield.

Then you need safety help over the top. There was no safety in the play. Winfield looked to me like he had man to man responsibilities there.

As soon as Winfield knew he was fkd he turned and sprinted because he knew there was no safety help.

 

[CuseOnly]

Then you need safety help over the top. There was no safety in the play. Winfield looked to me like he had man to man responsibilities there.

As soon as Winfield knew he was fkd he turned and sprinted because he knew there was no safety help.

Then we weren't in Tampa 2 in the defensive backfield. On that play, how many wide were they. We switch out of 2 safeties as soon as you see 4 or 5 wide outs. It seems they have problems when there is a fly route on the outside and a deep seam route in the middle.

Same with deep crossing patterns.

Fixable with more experience, it's gonna take time. I have seen them get better ever since Cordy and Dowels get hurt, there has been improvement from the young guys.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The D sucked last year with Shafer's scheme as well.. It's coaching, it's scheme, it's youth and it's talent and it's injuries. All factoring in, you cant be this bad without all factors being an issue

 

[Scooch]

I suspect Dino looks at defense the way that Boeheim looked at defense up until a few years ago... it's something to do until you get the ball back on offense.

I agree with IB, right now the D is a failure across every component. It won't stay this bad forever, but it'll never be great. If we can get it to slightly below average we'll win a lot of games.

 

[Millhouse]

The D sucked last year with Shafer's scheme as well.. It's coaching, it's scheme, it's youth and it's talent and it's injuries. All factoring in, you cant be this bad without all factors being an issue

they'll figure it out. at eastern illinois and bowling green, maybe some of these problems didn't come up. this was a bad defense that got a little worse. i'm not freaking out about it but we sure can't say they're doing a good job there yet.

it's not that hard to ask them to be 72nd in the country like the immortal 2012 team coached by the immortal doog

 

[IthacaBarrel]

they'll figure it out. at eastern illinois and bowling green, maybe some of these problems didn't come up. this was a bad defense that got a little worse. i'm not freaking out about it but we sure can't say they're doing a good job there yet.

it's not that hard to ask them to be 72nd in the country like the immortal 2012 team coached by the immortal doog

Exactly.