The offense to me still looks like a Shafer team

[OrangeFoo]

Babers is comitted for 3 years...can't say why I know this but once 2019 hits SU will need to pony up to keep him or not based upon how successful the program gets. His goal is to win the ACC and ultimately have a chance to win the NC. No one runs his offense in the NE...because of this he's counting on better recruiting, fan support and the Dome's controlled environment to get him there. Recruits of the caliber like Devito will keep him here much longer.

I don't know if you guys know this but he could have gone elsewhere for more money. However, we are so much more like how Baylor turned it around and plus some - program down, small town, controlled environment plus our rich history - I was told that HCDB said that Briles recommended he come here to take advantage of all of these things we have here over a few more dollars elsewhere.

So does that mean after three years if we win more than 7 games its mission accomplished move on to bigger and better... Or is it we are on the way to top 25 lets see how this plays out? I really hope babers is willing to turn this into a destination job like Briles was doing to Baylor.

 

[Rocco]

trying to run a hurry up offense. It doesn't look crisp, cohesive or fluid. That is to be expected but a few of the scoring drives have looked good but again, don't know if we have the quick strike athletes or the O Line to really carry this thing through right now... One game at a time, hopefully we continue to see improvement which I think we will to take some of the pressure off the D

Looks absolutely nothing like a Shafer hurry up. C'mon man.

A Shafer offense wouldn't have scored that easy on a defense that loaded with NFL talent. They made LVille look foolish on a few of those drives.

You guys need to give this dude some time. It's going to more than likely disappoint you for quite a while.

Bumps in the road come before champagne in the glass.

 

[Cuseregular]

Is this the same Cuseregular i was talking to at the tailgate and was all,pumped up for the season? What the heck?

Yep I know man. This is where playing the game like I did my whole life, at the level level I did (on a personal level), helping in the coaching and recruiting world for a while, this all allows insights into the game and seeing things that some might not see.

You focus in on individual performers, evaluate the fundementals of what the positions requires and what the physical capacity is of the performers involved is. Despite understanding and thinking I was watching a Final four playoff team led by a Heisman type star, still I've never seen what I did on Saturday (as the statistical numbers and objective indicators obvious suggested and demonstrated) and sitting there near to the end was a gut blow of depressing negativism that was soul sapping realizing how far away we are from the '87-98 level of performance we were treated to here.

Not saying I'm off the bandwagon, no not at all, not thinking Babers isn't the guy to best make a return to success happen (think he's just the type needed and if he can't do it might not be able to be done), but to a man at EVERY position defensively they are lacking something crucial fundamentally whether it be size, speed, quickness, smarts or a combination of those attributes.

And with their insistence on staying with this Tampa 2 without the players to do it vs. making lemonade out of the availbable lemons and minimizing your weaknesses while maximizing the chance for success by masking the weaknesses the way Shafer had done it with a more attacking type defense, well it's all a prescription for continued defensive failure.

Until Saturday I was hoping that what I saw in the spring game (13 Td's) was just because the Offense would be that good, Saturday was the realization that reality showed that much of it was due to a D that is fundamentally lacking.

Now the offense will be sufficient to overcome some of this and get some W's, but it is going to take far longer than I had hoped for and take years of a recruiting rebuild and reload on the defensive side of the ball that as I was looking at the sparse crowd I couldn't help thinking that I just don't think he will stick around long enough for it to be accomplished, this is what was going through my head at that horrendous game while watching that historically abysmal defensive performance.

If you remember (I think it was you at the tailgate) where I was saying I really had virtually NO IDEA what to expect, and what we saw and found out suggested all the above. Thus the glass half empty posts today. To steal a line from our past AD, gotta live in the truth of what is right in front of my eyes.

And listen I have no doubt that a lot of this year will be fun to watch with our peer schools, while watching us get throttled by the others won't be a big deal now as now I feel I know what to expect there putting hope to the side for the foreseeable future, and hey, the rebuild continues on, keep the faith, etc., but man oh man it just seems like this rebuild has and will take forever ad infinitum.

So still drinking the Babers Orange Koolade but depressed that to think that now with the available hard objective data that it will take even longer than Babers thinks. It gets tough to keep the faith, still gonna do it, but it's tempered now unfortunately by the available evidence.

 

[OburgOrange]

Yep I know man. This is where playing the game like I did my whole life, at the level level I did (on a personal level), helping in the coaching and recruiting world for a while, this all allows insights into the game that some might not see.

You focus in on individual performers, evaluate the fundementals of what the positions requires and what the physical capacity is of the performers involved is. I've never seen what I did on Saturday (as the statistical numbers and objective indicators obvious suggested and demonstrated) and sitting there near to the end was a gut blow of depressing negativism that was soul sapping.

Not saying I'm off the bandwagon, no not at all, not thinking Babers isn't the guy to best make a return to success happen (think he's just the type needed and if he can't do it might not be able to be done), but to a man at EVERY position they are lacking something crucial fundamentally whether it be size, speed, quickness, smarts or a combination of those attributes.

And with their insistence on staying with this Tampa 2 without the players to do it vs. making lemonade out of the availbable lemons and minimizing your weaknesses while maximizing the chance for success by masking the weaknesses the way Shafer had done it with a more attacking type defense, well it's all a prescription for continued defensive failure.

Until Saturday I was hoping that what I saw in the spring game (13 Td's) was just because the Offense would be that good, Saturday was the realization that reality showed that much of it was due to a D that is fundamentally lacking.

Now the offense will be sufficient to overcome some of this and get some W's, but it is going to take far longer than I had hoped for and take years of a recruiting rebuild and reload on the defensive side of the ball that I just don't think he will stick around long enough for to be accomplished is what was going through my head at that horrendous game while watching that historically abysmal defensive performance.

If you remember (I think it was you at the tailgate) where I was saying I really had virtually NO IDEA what to expect, and what we saw and found out suggested all the above. Thus the glass half empty posts today. To steal a line from our past AD, gotta live in the truth of what is right in front of my eyes.

And listen I have no doubt that a lot of this year will be fun to watch with our peer schools, while watching us get throttled by the others won't be a big deal now as now I feel I know what to expect there putting hope to the side for the foreseeable future, and hey, the rebuild continues on, keep the faith, etc., but man oh man it just seems like this rebuild has and will take forever ad infinitum.

So still drinking the Babers Orange Koolade but depressed that to think that now with the available hard objective data that it will take even longer than Babers thinks. It gets tough to keep the faith, still gonna do it, but it's tempered now by the available evidence.

What was striking to me was how much bigger, faster and stronger they were to a man. They had us at every position and they turned the gas on when they felt like it. I believe they actually took it easy on us. The score could have been worse.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Yep I know man. This is where playing the game like I did my whole life, at the level level I did (on a personal level), helping in the coaching and recruiting world for a while, this all allows insights into the game that some might not see.

You focus in on individual performers, evaluate the fundementals of what the positions requires and what the physical capacity is of the performers involved is. Despite understanding and thinking I was watching a Final four playoff team led by a Heisman type star, still I've never seen what I did on Saturday (as the statistical numbers and objective indicators obvious suggested and demonstrated) and sitting there near to the end was a gut blow of depressing negativism that was soul sapping realizing how far away we are from the '87-98 level of performance we were treated to here.

Not saying I'm off the bandwagon, no not at all, not thinking Babers isn't the guy to best make a return to success happen (think he's just the type needed and if he can't do it might not be able to be done), but to a man at EVERY position they are lacking something crucial fundamentally whether it be size, speed, quickness, smarts or a combination of those attributes.

And with their insistence on staying with this Tampa 2 without the players to do it vs. making lemonade out of the availbable lemons and minimizing your weaknesses while maximizing the chance for success by masking the weaknesses the way Shafer had done it with a more attacking type defense, well it's all a prescription for continued defensive failure.

Until Saturday I was hoping that what I saw in the spring game (13 Td's) was just because the Offense would be that good, Saturday was the realization that reality showed that much of it was due to a D that is fundamentally lacking.

Now the offense will be sufficient to overcome some of this and get some W's, but it is going to take far longer than I had hoped for and take years of a recruiting rebuild and reload on the defensive side of the ball that I just don't think he will stick around long enough for to be accomplished is what was going through my head at that horrendous game while watching that historically abysmal defensive performance.

If you remember (I think it was you at the tailgate) where I was saying I really had virtually NO IDEA what to expect, and what we saw and found out suggested all the above. Thus the glass half empty posts today. To steal a line from our past AD, gotta live in the truth of what is right in front of my eyes.

And listen I have no doubt that a lot of this year will be fun to watch with our peer schools, while watching us get throttled by the others won't be a big deal now as now I feel I know what to expect there putting hope to the side for the foreseeable future, and hey, the rebuild continues on, keep the faith, etc., but man oh man it just seems like this rebuild has and will take forever ad infinitum.

So still drinking the Babers Orange Koolade but depressed that to think that now with the available hard objective data that it will take even longer than Babers thinks. It gets tough to keep the faith, still gonna do it, but it's tempered now by the available evidence.

I like D so I am about as pissed off as anyone about the worst performance I have ever seen. Are we far from competing with the top teams? Sure, but I am not going to worry until I see the D stink vs a bad O. USF can put up 50 and I still think we will make a Bowl as long as UConn doesn't put up 30 the next week. Then I will start to worry. Despite the epically bad game vs Louisville, the advanced stats rank our D 76th. Yes there is only 2 weeks of data but even with the UL game we aren't as bad as it seems.

 

[Chip]

I like D so I am about as pissed off as anyone about the worst performance I have ever seen. Are we far from competing with the top teams? Sure, but I am not going to worry until I see the D stink vs a bad O. USF can put up 50 and I still think we will make a Bowl as long as UConn doesn't put up 30 the next week. Then I will start to worry. Despite the epically bad game vs Louisville, the advanced stats rank our D 76th. Yes there is only 2 weeks of data but even with the UL game we aren't as bad as it seems.

400 on the ground AND in the air is just impossible to wrap your head around. I still can't believe it. And they had so many dropped passes, at least one sure long TD (they may have scored anyway on that drive it's all blurry at this point).

Will we ever see anything like that again? I'd guess no. But being so fresh in our heads there's only one way to forget it. Saturday.

 

[Cuseregular]

What was striking to me was how much bigger, faster and stronger they were to a man. They had us at every position and they turned the gas on when they felt like it. I believe they actually took it easy on us. The score could have been worse.

No doubt, I will be shocked absolutely shocked if they're not a final four playoff team and that, barring injury, the qb will be the favorite to win the Heisman. Best I've ever seen in the dome including Vick and McNabb. We'll know more this weekend with their game vs. FSU if they really are that good and I'm being a tad too pessimistic or if they get rolled by FSU making me even more depressed.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

400 on the ground AND in the air is just impossible to wrap your head around. I still can't believe it. And they had so many dropped passes, at least one sure long TD (they may have scored anyway on that drive it's all blurry at this point).

Will we ever see anything like that again? I'd guess no. But being so fresh in our heads there's only one way to forget it. Saturday.

I think it was more like the GA Tech game than what the norm will be. We played cover zero a lot which I hope isn't the plan going forward. Tampa 2 will use a lot of cover 3 or even cover 2. I want to see how we play against a normal team before I write off the D. If we are giving up big plays vs UConn, Wake, VA Tech, BC, NC State, Pitt the I will be pissed and worried long term. Since none of those teams play a system like Louisville, I don't think we will defend them the same way. If the D looks like vs UConn I will be the first to point it out. Until then I hope that UL was a GA Tech like moment for the staff.

 

[nzm136]

trying to run a hurry up offense. It doesn't look crisp, cohesive or fluid. That is to be expected but a few of the scoring drives have looked good but again, don't know if we have the quick strike athletes or the O Line to really carry this thing through right now... One game at a time, hopefully we continue to see improvement which I think we will to take some of the pressure off the D

Actually, last year's offense was better. Admittedly, we've only played 2 games - one against an fcs team, and one against a top 10-15 team - so 2016 season stats are pretty close to meaningless right now. The unreliability of statistics especially true in this case because we have a new coach and a new system, so we don't really have the players to fit the system and the players that we do have are still learning how to play in it. However, for the fun of internet banter, the 2016 Orange squad has only scored 80% as many points per possession as the 2015 Orange.

We have more points per game, but that's just because we have a faster tempo. If our defense is equally good, then we could expect to lose more games, and we could expect more blowouts. In other words, so far we stink more and we do it faster.

All that said, these stats are completely meaningless right now for a number of reasons, and I expect them to improve over the course of the year. Still, I think that they provide an interesting perspective.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Another way to look at it is like vs like. Last year vs Louisville we scored 17 points on 16 drives. This year we scored 28 points on 18 drives. Yes those aren't complete "likes" as one game was on the road while the other was home, and both rosters have changed. But using those two games last year's performance was 68% of this year.

 

[nzm136]

Another way to look at it is like vs like. Last year vs Louisville we scored 17 points on 16 drives. This year we scored 28 points on 18 drives. Yes those aren't complete "likes" as one game was on the road while the other was home, and both rosters have changed. But using those two games last year's performance was 68% of this year.

True - It's honestly too early in the season for stats to have any meaning other than to further mindless internet banter. I think that late season stats will be much more telling - even if this season's schedule is harder than last season's. I'm hoping to see this year's stats improve over time. It would also be interesting to see defensive stats.

 

[orangenirvana]

Reading this thread like...

sitting there near to the end was a gut blow of depressing negativism that was soul sapping realizing how far away we are from the '87-98 level of performance we were treated to here.

You honestly thought this team was close to competing at the level of 87-98 going into this season? Really? Did you think Shafer was bringing in NFL athletes across the board and left Babers a full cupboard?

No wonder you're depressed.

One would have thought you'd have better instincts than that.

 

[Cuseregular]

Reading this thread like...

You honestly thought this team was close to competing at the level of 87-98 going into this season? Really? Did you think Shafer was bringing in NFL athletes across the board and left Babers a full cupboard?

No wonder you're depressed.

One would have thought you'd have better instincts than that.

No. Reading comprehension man. Not sure how in the world you got that I expected that this year. Not at all but maybe at least trending in that direction in in the next couple years and perhaps this year. Don't see it happening where we can be competitive with the big boys for a while beyond that.

I don't follow nor pay attention as closely as I used to (recruiting, etc. and will parrot what you wrote elsewhere reading that it was on the uptick while it's anything but on D at least), so I don't pay close attention at all, except for when I'm actually there, and what was demonstrated is that if it's going to happen at all to get back there (crossing the fingas) we're on a 4-6 year trajectory to get there ala how long it took Mac.

The instincts are fine and the instincts tell me you're one negative caustic dude off the board beyond a analytical/critical post or two as I've done here.

 

[Cuseregular]

Ok you Jamokes can now officially apologize to Barrell...

Watching us=:bang:

 

[NineOneSeven]

I'm shocked the offense filled with Shafer players sometimes resembles a shafer offense. Amazing, really.

That said, offense after first quarters resemble shafer offense more and more. Tonight though, yes it was bad. Weather played a huge role but playcalling was really soft.

 

[Millhouse]

The o line is so bad that it wrecks everything. They get beat so fast, it's worse than pariani where they stood in place. I've never seen anything like it. It's not scheme or playcalling, it's just guys who can't block at all yet


E-dung will be throwing end over end like a-Rob shortly.

 

[Chip]

E-dung will be throwing end over end like a-Rob shortly.

Defensive players intercepting ARob passes were calling for a fair catch.

 

[RF2044]

Definitely felt like it tonight.

Sucked.

 

[Ish88888]

Agreed. This team was not recruited to play this offense and I would say there is no way we could have recruited the athletes needed under the old regimes anyway. We needed a name like Babers, who has credibility based on his record.

We are already seeing more success with skill players than we have had in a decade. WRs actually want to play in this offense - imagine that!

I am afraid that the roster needs more renovation than the dome.

These kids are learning the system. It isnt like you recruit "fast " players on offense that run his style in HS. its a transition for any player regardless of talent level.