2021 NFL Thread | Page 32 | Syracusefan.com

2021 NFL Thread

Honestly it applies to Lawrence less than almost all the top 8 or so QBs in this draft class. Relative to their competition, Alabama, ND State, BYU, Ohio State, and Florida were all significantly better than Clemson was. The two that had it worse than Lawrence were Kellen Mond at A&M and Davis Mills at Stanford.
Real good point on Mond. I was a College Station resident the last 2 years and he had absolutely no one to throw to. His top 2 main targets were a RB and a TE. He had a powerhouse OL and great running game though so they were able to became a great team despite no outside weapons. With that, I'm still extremely skeptical that he will even be a good #2 in the pros because he's so robotic. Off the charts leader and great kid though.
 
I still have to finish scouting Trask and Mond (and maybe return to Lance as his All-22 film came in late), but to me, I view this year's QBs roughly like this:

Lawrence - High floor, high ceiling, just a flat out elite prospect. Jacksonville messed something up terribly if he isn't an above average starter by year 2 IMO.

Fields - I think he likely falls somewhere in the realm of being a bigger Tyrod Taylor and Dak Prescott. So, probably likely to at least be a below-average/sometimes average starter but with really strong potential.

Lance - Eerily similar to Josh Allen coming out of Wyoming, except he's a much better decision-maker and probably a little better running the ball. I think Allen was the better passer of the two in college both in terms of the velocity and the accuracy. As Allen has shown, there's a high ceiling there, and I think he can play right away, but it will probably be a bit of a bumpy road as he works on getting his footwork under control and hopefully improves his accuracy as a result.

Wilson - The different arm angles he can throw with and the quickness of his throwing motion are really fun to watch, but he's unpolished in a lot of ways right now (maybe the worst/laziest playaction I've personally ever seen, and he tends to just throw the ball whenever he sees someone without caring about his feet at all). Still, a creative coordinator will have fun with the things he can do. I have his likely range as somewhere between Jake Plummer and less mobile Kyler Murray.

Mac - Not as bad a prospect as Mason Rudolph was, but still an unexciting floor and ceiling IMO. He just isn't a special passer, both in terms of arm strength (though I do think he could throw with more velocity if he works on his footwork more) and accuracy (which is good but not great) and he certainly doesn't have the legs to make up for it like Lance for example. I see his upside being Brad Johnson and wouldn't be surprised if he starts for a few years and ultimately settles into being a backup.

Davis Mills - I have him rated slightly behind Mac, but considering where the two will be drafted, I'd rather just wait and take Mills. He shows the same anticipatory throw ability and accuracy that Mac has with better arm strength. Mac definitely does a better job protecting the ball though, and that probably makes him a safer bet to have a long career. I also don't factor it into my grades, but Mills and his knee just don't look right to me. He doesn't look comfortable moving around and there's a few examples where he couldn't really turn his body to throw a screen pass and ended up limping after trying to throw it even though he wasn't touched.

The top 3 I'd for sure take if I needed a QB. I'm more skeptical of Wilson but I'd still take him somewhere in the first. Mac and Mills should be Day 2 picks at best IMO.
 
Real good point on Mond. I was a College Station resident the last 2 years and he had absolutely no one to throw to. His top 2 main targets were a RB and a TE. He had a powerhouse OL and great running game though so they were able to became a great team despite no outside weapons. With that, I'm still extremely skeptical that he will even be a good #2 in the pros because he's so robotic. Off the charts leader and great kid though.
I was listening to Greg McElroy analyze Mond the other day. He praised him for the attributes you mentioned but said his accuracy is well below what is needed to thrive in the NFL and he doubted that could be corrected. Of course we heard the same thing abut Josh Allen.
 
Didn't the Heisman winner say he liked Mac better?
so did I, but then again...i thought Tua totally sucked.

i dont see much in Mac either, the guy who put him the 3rd round here is more in line with my thought, id even think 4th, but you got to give him credit for rising to the top there.
 
I still have to finish scouting Trask and Mond (and maybe return to Lance as his All-22 film came in late), but to me, I view this year's QBs roughly like this:

Lawrence - High floor, high ceiling, just a flat out elite prospect. Jacksonville messed something up terribly if he isn't an above average starter by year 2 IMO.

Fields - I think he likely falls somewhere in the realm of being a bigger Tyrod Taylor and Dak Prescott. So, probably likely to at least be a below-average/sometimes average starter but with really strong potential.

Lance - Eerily similar to Josh Allen coming out of Wyoming, except he's a much better decision-maker and probably a little better running the ball. I think Allen was the better passer of the two in college both in terms of the velocity and the accuracy. As Allen has shown, there's a high ceiling there, and I think he can play right away, but it will probably be a bit of a bumpy road as he works on getting his footwork under control and hopefully improves his accuracy as a result.

Wilson - The different arm angles he can throw with and the quickness of his throwing motion are really fun to watch, but he's unpolished in a lot of ways right now (maybe the worst/laziest playaction I've personally ever seen, and he tends to just throw the ball whenever he sees someone without caring about his feet at all). Still, a creative coordinator will have fun with the things he can do. I have his likely range as somewhere between Jake Plummer and less mobile Kyler Murray.

Mac - Not as bad a prospect as Mason Rudolph was, but still an unexciting floor and ceiling IMO. He just isn't a special passer, both in terms of arm strength (though I do think he could throw with more velocity if he works on his footwork more) and accuracy (which is good but not great) and he certainly doesn't have the legs to make up for it like Lance for example. I see his upside being Brad Johnson and wouldn't be surprised if he starts for a few years and ultimately settles into being a backup.

Davis Mills - I have him rated slightly behind Mac, but considering where the two will be drafted, I'd rather just wait and take Mills. He shows the same anticipatory throw ability and accuracy that Mac has with better arm strength. Mac definitely does a better job protecting the ball though, and that probably makes him a safer bet to have a long career. I also don't factor it into my grades, but Mills and his knee just don't look right to me. He doesn't look comfortable moving around and there's a few examples where he couldn't really turn his body to throw a screen pass and ended up limping after trying to throw it even though he wasn't touched.

The top 3 I'd for sure take if I needed a QB. I'm more skeptical of Wilson but I'd still take him somewhere in the first. Mac and Mills should be Day 2 picks at best IMO.
Good stuff. I watched Wilson a lot and he amazed me with some of the plays he made. He probably has the biggest gap between upside and downside. One thing he has to be careful about is that he is fearless and will take off and not necessarily get down or OB fast enough. But he can make plays some of these other dudes just can't make.

Listened to Danny Kannell and Greg McElroy talk this morning about the QB prospects and they kept emphasizing that so much of QB play is from the neck up and that it's hard to know how guys will fare in that regard when they get to the NFL. They both said the jump from college to the NFL is massive and that the prep work and study involved is insane.
 
so did I, but then again...i thought Tua totally sucked.

i dont see much in Mac either, the guy who put him the 3rd round here is more in line with my thought, id even think 4th, but you got to give him credit for rising to the top there.
I'm betting Mac is the last of the five QBs chosen.
 
I was listening to Greg McElroy analyze Mond the other day. He praised him for the attributes you mentioned but said his accuracy is well below what is needed to thrive in the NFL and he doubted that could be corrected. Of course we heard the same thing abut Josh Allen.
If you watch him a lot, it just doesn't look natural or fluid. Everything is mechanical looking. I don't know if that's just how he became because he was a big natural athlete and then Jimbo got hired and put him into a high level pro-style offense and this was kind of the Frankenstein creation that came out of that.
 
Good stuff. I watched Wilson a lot and he amazed me with some of the plays he made. He probably has the biggest gap between upside and downside. One thing he has to be careful about is that he is fearless and will take off and not necessarily get down or OB fast enough. But he can make plays some of these other dudes just can't make.

Listened to Danny Kannell and Greg McElroy talk this morning about the QB prospects and they kept emphasizing that so much of QB play is from the neck up and that it's hard to know how guys will fare in that regard when they get to the NFL. They both said the jump from college to the NFL is massive and that the prep work and study involved is insane.
Think that last part is where Mac catches up to the field. He supposedly is absolute off the charts in smarts. So if he has an elite brain and nearly elite accuracy then that creates a heckuva floor. I'd be mad if my team took him in the top 10 but I guess the ceiling there is Matt Ryan and the probability of hitting his ceiling may also be higher than any of the other guys outside of Lawrence.
 
Good stuff. I watched Wilson a lot and he amazed me with some of the plays he made. He probably has the biggest gap between upside and downside. One thing he has to be careful about is that he is fearless and will take off and not necessarily get down or OB fast enough. But he can make plays some of these other dudes just can't make.

Listened to Danny Kannell and Greg McElroy talk this morning about the QB prospects and they kept emphasizing that so much of QB play is from the neck up and that it's hard to know how guys will fare in that regard when they get to the NFL. They both said the jump from college to the NFL is massive and that the prep work and study involved is insane.
No doubt. He doesn't have the strongest arm or throw the most accurate balls, but he can do some stuff with his arm and without his legs that you just don't see at all from the other guys right now. He and Fields missed so many wide open guys in college though; it's so jarring watching it on All-22 after watching the TV angles for so many years. Ohio State scored over 40 points a game and it felt like Fields was leaving multiple TDs on the field every game lol
 
I'm betting Mac is the last of the five QBs chosen.
the 1st 3 are locks and id say that Lance is basically a lock at 4, if not even at 3...which would cause someone to jump all over Fields.
 
the 1st 3 are locks and id say that Lance is basically a lock at 4, if not even at 3...which would cause someone to jump all over Fields.
If u feel that way you should go out and bet on it cuz Fields is -115 to be the 3rd pick. Mac Jones is +115 and Lance is +400.
 
Think that last part is where Mac catches up to the field. He supposedly is absolute off the charts in smarts. So if he has an elite brain and nearly elite accuracy then that creates a heckuva floor. I'd be mad if my team took him in the top 10 but I guess the ceiling there is Matt Ryan and the probability of hitting his ceiling may also be higher than any of the other guys outside of Lawrence.
I just don't think the ceiling or floor is that high to be honest. His accuracy isn't nearly elite; it's just pretty good. His pre-snap reads are elite for a college QB but that's the only elite part IMO, and a coach like Shanahan can basically do that part for you anyways. Realistically, the most effective QB early on will probably be Lawrence or whoever San Fran drafts (and maybe that'll be Mac but I highly doubt it), but I'd probably roll with Lance if I wanted to start someone right away and couldn't get Lawrence. For early success, you either need a coach/supporting cast like San Fran's or you need to be able to make plays with your legs while your eyes and arm catch up to the pro game IMO. That's why Lamar and Allen were able to have early success while Darnold and Rosen struggled IMO. The ability to make plays with your legs just increases your margin for error so much. I don't think Mac has the arm to make up for the lack of legs early on and he's looked pretty bad whenever a defense can shut down his initial read.
 
If u feel that way you should go out and bet on it cuz Fields is -115 to be the 3rd pick. Mac Jones is +115 and Lance is +400.
Yeah, I put a pretty good bet on both Fields and Lance before Fields was the favorite. I just don't think San Fran can really justify taking Mac.
 
The whole Generational talent thing is getting out of hand. How many generational talents have their been in the history of the league?The best Tight End we ever had was a third round pick. Even if this kid is Travis Kelce. We don't need him. We need help on defense and to.get younger on the online.

Fair point about the phrase.

That aside if he turns out to be the next Tony Gonzalez or Gronk he was worth the top 10 pick.

None of the corners look like Hall of Famers. I would be okay with the risk on the TE at 10.

Also bear in mind that Cooper will not play out his contract and Gallup is probably gone next year. So what seems like overkill for this year could look like a great pick next year.
 
Fair point about the phrase.

That aside if he turns out to be the next Tony Gonzalez or Gronk he was worth the top 10 pick.

None of the corners look like Hall of Famers. I would be okay with the risk on the TE at 10.

Also bear in mind that Cooper will not play out his contract and Gallup is probably gone next year. So what seems like overkill for this year could look like a great pick next year.
You don't need to worry about Pitts at 10. Would be absolutely shocked if he's available past 6.
 
You don't need to worry about Pitts at 10. Would be absolutely shocked if he's available past 6.

Not ruling out Jerrah being Jerrah and trading up.
 
He has a point, but I have a feeling nobody really wants to hear it lol. I'm sure it'll make things a little more difficult on the OLines, but they'll survive. Having said that, the only point in this rule change is for the NFL to regain some of the revenue they lost this past year; the actual on-field impact can only be a negative.

The draft can't get here soon enough when stuff like this is blown up into a big story
 
He has a point, but I have a feeling nobody really wants to hear it lol. I'm sure it'll make things a little more difficult on the OLines, but they'll survive. Having said that, the only point in this rule change is for the NFL to regain some of the revenue they lost this past year; the actual on-field impact can only be a negative.

The draft can't get here soon enough when stuff like this is blown up into a big story
this is probably the 1st 'rule'... put in place that sorta helps the Defense in 50 years.
 

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