7th in media poll. No surprise.

[JrodCuse]

I think we're winning at least 8 games this year.

 

[Scooch]

I'm really looking forward to the prediction thread when so many people through everything out the window and talk themselves into putting down 9 wins and a bowl victory.

People are fans, nothing wrong with blind optimism.

Of course a lot of those same people will then tell us why 5 wins was a good year.

But whatever.

 

[OrangePA]

Yeah, I keep looking at this roster, and at our schedule, and I'm not seeing any more than a handful of wins, at best.

It's unfortunate because this conference is simply God-awful. One of those '99-'04 post-McNabb editions might have run the table in a league of this quality (as long as Walter Washington isn't suiting up for Temple).

I agree that we face a challenge this fall.

But I do not agree that Louisville, Rutgers, Cincy, or USF god awful. Not even close.

They all have better talent than we do at this point.

We are probably comparable to UConn in terms of talent.

If we lose our OOC schedule, other than Stonybrook, we could see a eight loss season.

That would not mean that we are not getting better and would not justify ending the Marrone era in my opinion.

 

[Scooch]

I agree that we face a challenge this fall.

But I do not agree that Louisville, Rutgers, Cincy, or USF god awful. Not even close.

They all have better talent than we do at this point.

We are probably comparable to UConn in terms of talent.

If we lose our OOC schedule, other than Stonybrook, we could see a eight loss season.

That would not mean that we are not getting better and would not justify ending the Marrone era in my opinion.

I'm not comparing the Big East to SU, I'm comparing it to the other 5 major leagues.

This conference is dreadful.

 

[Scooch]

If we lose our OOC schedule, other than Stonybrook, we could see a eight loss season.

That would not mean that we are not getting better and would not justify ending the Marrone era in my opinion.

I'm not even remotely suggesting that.

But if we go 4-8 we're not getting better, let's be freakin' real.

 

[GoSU96]

I'm not comparing the Big East to SU, I'm comparing it to the other 5 major leagues.

This conference is dreadful.

1-2 is baked in. The other 9 teams are all technically BCS teams, and all are in that middle 30-90 range. The challenge this year is to go 5-4 against that peer group.

SU as a program is 13-12 the last two years. No longer in the bottom 30, nowhere close to the top 30. Stablizing the program coming off of the end of last year shows that the program has progressed at least to the middle of distribution. Would love to see more progress than that but I doubt it for now.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

SU as a program is 13-12 the last two years. No longer in the bottom 30, nowhere close to the top 30. Stablizing the program coming off of the end of last year shows that the program has progressed at least to the middle of distribution. Would love to see more progress than that but I doubt it for now.

As a two year sample 13-12 doesn't look all that bad, but the losses are all equal whereas the wins are not. Those three subdivision wins really pad the books. Nothing wrong with that, everybody does it, but it makes being solidly over .500 feel even more important.

 

[OrangePA]

I'm not even remotely suggesting that.

But if we go 4-8 we're not getting better, let's be freakin' real.

I know - you did not suggest that.

I know that Bill Parcells said famously that you are what your record says you are.

But, I have seen way too many exceptions to the rule to really believe that. Especially when the team is burdened with a very difficult schedule - or one that is more difficult than a previous one or one of a comparable team.

I remember when Bill Mallory came to Indiana University years ago. In his first season he went 0-11. And yet it was clear that the team was far better than it had been the year before under Sam Wyche who had won four games.

This year we are playing a very tough OOC schedule. That alone makes this season a tough one - one that may blur our view of the progress that is being made.

Given the schedule, if we were to lose say seven games this year, I would not be surprised. But that would not cause me to conclude that we are not getting better, because I think we are getting better.

That improvement will likely not be reflected in the record.

 

[OrangePA]

I'm not comparing the Big East to SU, I'm comparing it to the other 5 major leagues.

This conference is dreadful.

I just can't say that Louisville, Cincy, USF or Rutgers are dreadful.

I can't say that Pitt is dreadful or that SU is dreadful.

I just can't go that far.

Heck, didn't Rutgers beat a pretty good Big XII team last year in a bowl game?

Didn't Cincy win nine games?

Don't many feel that L'ville is pretty talented this year?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I know - you did not suggest that.

I know that Bill Parcells said famously that you are what your record says you are.

But, I have seen way too many exceptions to the rule to really believe that. Especially when the team is burdened with a very difficult schedule - or one that is more difficult than a previous one or one of a comparable team.

I remember when Bill Mallory came to Indiana University years ago. In his first season he went 0-11. And yet it was clear that the team was far better than it had been the year before under Sam Wyche who had won four games.

This year we are playing a very tough OOC schedule. That alone makes this season a tough one - one that may blur our view of the progress that is being made.

Given the schedule, if we were to lose say seven games this year, I would not be surprised. But that would not cause me to conclude that we are not getting better, because I think we are getting better.

That improvement will likely not be reflected in the record.

I think your point is valid. It still concerns me though how much it looks like people are hedging.

 

[Aweart23]

Bunch of Negative Nancys on here

Last years team was one dropped Phillip Thomas INT from starting the season 6-1.

With the exception of the loss of C. Jones, this years team is deeper, more experienced, more quality players, more playmaker's on both sides of the ball, has had their VH1 fall from grace losing five in a row last year, has the eye of the tiger, and MOST IMPORTANTLY plays in the crappy Big East.

No way we don't go to a bowl game this year...

 

[Millhouse]

I think your point is valid. It still concerns me though how much it looks like people are hedging.

why is that a concern?

fwiw i'm not hedging, i know this year is going to suck

 

[kingottoiii]

As a two year sample 13-12 doesn't look all that bad, but the losses are all equal whereas the wins are not. Those three subdivision wins really pad the books. Nothing wrong with that, everybody does it, but it makes being solidly over .500 feel even more important.

9-12 regular season vs D1A
6-12 regular season vs BCS
5-9 vs a bad BE
1-7 after Halloween

These need to start changing ASAP. Especially with next year having 9 ACC games, PSU in NJ, and @NW. This year's schedule is a piece of cake compared to that.

 

[JoeSU]

I just can't say that Louisville, Cincy, USF or Rutgers are dreadful.

I can't say that Pitt is dreadful or that SU is dreadful.

I just can't go that far.

Heck, didn't Rutgers beat a pretty good Big XII team last year in a bowl game?

Didn't Cincy win nine games?

Don't many feel that L'ville is pretty talented this year?

It's also worth noting that West Virgina totally destroyed ACC champion Clemson in their bowl matchup.

 

[JeremyCuse]

9-12 regular season vs D1A
6-12 regular season vs BCS
5-9 vs a bad BE
1-7 after Halloween

These need to start changing ASAP. Especially with next year having 9 ACC games, PSU in NJ, and @NW. This year's schedule is a piece of cake compared to that.

The 1-7 after Halloween has go to improve, we are developing a bad pattern of fading down the strech under Marrone.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Bunch of Negative Nancys on here

Last years team was one dropped Phillip Thomas INT from starting the season 6-1.

With the exception of the loss of C. Jones, this years team is deeper, more experienced, more quality players, more playmaker's on both sides of the ball, has had their VH1 fall from grace losing five in a row last year, has the eye of the tiger, and MOST IMPORTANTLY plays in the crappy Big East.

No way we don't go to a bowl game this year...

I can see a bowl game but this team didnt suddenly become the NE patriots in the offseason there are still a lot of question marks all over the field and there is definitely a lack of playmakers on the defensive side of the ball with the loss of Chandler, MM, and Thomas.

 

[kingottoiii]

The 1-7 after Halloween has go to improve, we are developing a bad pattern of fading down the strech under Marrone.

That's just the last two years. Adding in his 1st year we are 2-11 from Halloween on. That will be the one thing I am curious to see this year. Being that we are a young team and have nearly everyone returning for 2013, I want to see us get better as the year goes on. That will give everyone hope for 2013 despite having arguably our hardest schedule ever.

Crazy thing is, taking away the cupcakes and built in Ls we are 7-7 before Halloween under Marrone. How we go from 7-7 to 2-11 is kinda nuts, especially since you can argue that the first 14 games have been against slightly stronger competition vs the last 13. If we follow this pattern again then we should be 4-4 come Halloween this year. However since Marrone hasn't beaten anyone but RU after Halloween, we would end up 4-8.

 

[Millhouse]

reminder - if you were dismissive of people discounting wins against weaker schools, you shouldn't be discount losses against stronger schools

if the record tells the story in weaker schedule years, it's only fair that it tells the story this year.

 

[JeremyCuse]

That's just the last two years. Adding in his 1st year we are 2-11 from Halloween on. That will be the one thing I am curious to see this year. Being that we are a young team and have nearly everyone returning for 2013, I want to see us get better as the year goes on. That will give everyone hope for 2013 despite having arguably our hardest schedule ever.

I agree but the schedule save for Temple isnt set up for SU to make a run late. The fact we are playing Mizz in the second to last game on the road is a disgrace. That being said if we could go 2-2 in the last four that would be a good sign.

 

[Aweart23]

I can see a bowl game but this team didnt suddenly become the NE patriots in the offseason there are still a lot of question marks all over the field and there is definitely a lack of playmakers on the defensive side of the ball with the loss of Chandler, MM, and Thomas.

This years team has depth all over the field that it didn't have last year...as well as finally some size on the DL.
As good as C. Jones was/is, he sure didn't help last years W/L record when he came back.

And no, this years team is not the New England Patriots, but they are playing in the Big East not the NFL. A thin, young, undersized, physically beat up team was one win short of a bowl last year...No reason this years version shouldn't improve on last years results...

As for question marks, I had way more question marks last year than I do this year..

 

[OttoinGrotto]

why is that a concern?

fwiw i'm not hedging, i know this year is going to suck

Probably all just in my head, but last year people had all kinds of expectations that 8 wins were in the bag (all the talk about how everybody would have been happy with 6 and 6 was revisionist history) and we pretty much sucked.

This year people are already hedging and preparing for the reality of a 4 or 5 win season, so we'll... pretty much suck more?

 

[JeremyCuse]

This years team has depth all over the field that it didn't have last year...as well as finally some size on the DL.
As good as C. Jones was/is, he sure didn't help last years W/L record when he came back.

And no, this years team is not the New England Patriots, but they are playing in the Big East not the NFL. A thin, young, undersized, physically beat up team was one win short of a bowl last year...No reason this years version shouldn't improve on last years results...

As for question marks, I had way more question marks last year than I do this year..

Not to call you out but exactly what depth do they have all over the field now that they didnt have last year? Secondary is deeper and we have added some JUCO depth to the D line but I am failing to see how they now have depth all over the field?

 

[MattyL]

[quote="Edit: And specials -- Christ. Please get better here. Please!!! I'm begging. I swear if nothing else changed from last year except far more consistent -- not even spectacular -- play from our specials we could at least be around .500 and bowling. Like with the offense and the OL, three years we might be able to rationalize, four years becomes a nasty trend.[/quote]

I've been trying to block last years special teams performance out of my mind! A.W..U.L.

Are the ST responsibilities still being split up amongst the coaches? I've never liked that idea.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

9-12 regular season vs D1A
6-12 regular season vs BCS
5-9 vs a bad BE
1-7 after Halloween

These need to start changing ASAP. Especially with next year having 9 ACC games, PSU in NJ, and @NW. This year's schedule is a piece of cake compared to that.

I'm trying to look on the bright side of things.

But yes, the BE and late season records are troubling.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

reminder - if you were dismissive of people discounting wins against weaker schools, you shouldn't be discount losses against stronger schools

if the record tells the story in weaker schedule years, it's only fair that it tells the story this year.

I disagree. Your statement is true if all our games are played against division one schools. They aren't.

Weaker schools is one thing. Different division entirely is another.