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Message: [QUOTE="billsin01, post: 308627, member: 837"] I have debated this topic too many times to get into it again but I do believe the conclusion is actually really simple. It is this: Kids not showing up and staying for ~4-5 years was a [I]massive[/I] problem for this team in the early 2000s and was the biggest single factor in this team's disastrous decade+. Whether you want to blame that on P or on everything but P is immaterial. whether it was academics or another cause that took them out after a semester or a year, etc., is also immaterial. While people will tie themselves into knots about star ratings, the real key is actually getting kids here, developing them and seeing what you have 2-3 years down the road. Marrone appears to be doing this and it's a good thing. To suggest P -- whether it was his fault or not -- didn't have major issues in this regard is beyond intellectually dishonest. It's patently absurd. [/QUOTE]