ACC Football

[orangenirvana]

But if you were 4-0, even with total walkovers, and beat Clemson, they'd probably drop to #15, and you guys would definitely be ranked. The talk would be that Syracuse is good this year, not just that Clemson is overrated. Then if another ACC team beats you, then they get the rub of beating a ranked team.

Schools that should be national title contenders should be aware of their SOS, and be looking for showcase games they can win. Clemson-UGA, FSU-Oklahoma State next year, UF-UM. Two of those a year is plenty for the conference.

Other than that, everyone needs to be scheduling wins until they establish themselves as top 15-20 teams.

Why is everyone in the ACC scheduling UP in all their BCS opponents (not talking about the state rivalries)? Why are we constantly scheduling Alabama, Georgia, Auburn, Florida, USC, and never scheduling Ole Miss, Arkansas, Vandy (except for WF), Mississippi State, and now Missouri?

We have our second- and third-level teams playing the likes of Alabama, Oregon, USC, but where are the games against Indiana, Minnesota, Wash St, Mississippi State, etc?

We have to stop scheduling with our heart and use our brains. Look at every program that was built from crap into gold in the last 25 years and they were all built on easy OOC scheduling. KSU, South Carolina, Virginia Tech, Oklahoma State. It's a formula and it works. It means when you're mediocre you're still 8-4, and when you've got a good team you've got a shot at 10-2.

Buttgers football likes this post.

 

[Moontan]

Lou_C: for the foreseeable future, Syracuse will not play a home game on Labor Day weekend. And for the rest of my life they will always play at least two FBS programs OOC. That's just the way it is.

Edit: (blush) I meant to say "two BCS programs OOC". As in 2 BCS, 1 FBS and 1 FCS... unless that becomes politically incorrect.

One more prediction: Syracuse's AD will continue to delay announcement of ACC football schedules. The SEC has already released its 2014 schedule. Meanwhile, Syracuse does not have a single OOC opponent scheduled. <sigh>

 

[Lou_C]

Lou_C: for the foreseeable future, Syracuse will not play a home game on Labor Day weekend. And for the rest of my life they will always play at least two FBS programs OOC. That's just the way it is.

Of course they will be FBS programs. Have to have three of them. But it's not that tricky...

1. FCS
2. Sun Belt
3. MAC
4. Notre Dame, or mid to low-range Big 5 or upper level AAC/MWC (Mississippi State, or Illinois, or San Diego State) or occasional upper level matchup like a Penn State or Tennessee. Never two of these in the same year.

Lather, rinse, repeat until you're a top 20 program year in and year out.

 

[phil77]

Schedule cupcakes until you get enough media attention and they start complaining about the cupcakes.

Look at Buttgers you laugh heck we all laugh at the OOC schedule but like clock work year after year they have been winning 8 or so games. Guess what now they have the perception on an up and coming team and they are beating is on the recruiting trail on prospects we want. Nobody cares they play 3 high school teams and Colgate. All they care about is year in and year out they get at least 8 wins.

Perception is key. If we are 4-0 going into Clemson people will not care how we got there it will be played up as two ACC undefeated teams battling it out. But more than likely we will be 2-2 and nobody will care about the game nationally. You want to start getting better recruits and talked about better nationally then we need to win games.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk - http://tapatalk.com/m/

 

[Moontan]

Of course they will be FBS programs. Have to have three of them. But it's not that tricky...

1. FCS
2. Sun Belt
3. MAC
4. Notre Dame, or mid to low-range Big 5 or upper level AAC/MWC (Mississippi State, or Illinois, or San Diego State) or occasional upper level matchup like a Penn State or Tennessee. Never two of these in the same year.

Lather, rinse, repeat until you're a top 20 program year in and year out.

Oops, I misspoke. I've corrected my original post, but here are the changes:

Edit: (blush) I meant to say "two BCS programs OOC". As in 2 BCS, 1 FBS and 1 FCS... unless that becomes politically incorrect. I know that you're pushing for 1 BCS, 2 FBS and 1 FCS, but it's just not Syracuse's nature.

One more prediction: Syracuse's AD will continue to delay announcement of ACC football schedules. The SEC has already released its 2014 schedule. Meanwhile, Syracuse does not have a single OOC opponent scheduled. <sigh>

 

[anomander]

Well we already have ND, Penn St, Northwestern, and what sounds like Maryland and Navy already penciled in for the next 8 years. Someone may need to explain this to Herm. I'd even settle for starting out at home with the 2 cupcakes first. It seems like we have had at least 1 loss in the first 2 games for the past 25 years

 

[Chris02M]

Lou_C: for the foreseeable future, Syracuse will not play a home game on Labor Day weekend. And for the rest of my life they will always play at least two FBS programs OOC. That's just the way it is.

Edit: (blush) I meant to say "two BCS programs OOC". As in 2 BCS, 1 FBS and 1 FCS... unless that becomes politically incorrect.

One more prediction: Syracuse's AD will continue to delay announcement of ACC football schedules. The SEC has already released its 2014 schedule. Meanwhile, Syracuse does not have a single OOC opponent scheduled. <sigh>

we have at least 1 out of conference game scheduled for next season:
Vs Notre Dame on September 27th @the Meadowlands

1 rumored FCS game Vs Villanova@ the Loud House

to round out the 2014 schedule we should have 1 mac school and 1 bcs school 1 home 1 away

 

[SmilinBob]

ACC plays 3 ranked foes this weekend:

SU vs Northwestern...Virginia vs Oregon.....Miami vs Florida. Winning 2 out of 3 would be fantastic (especially if SU is one of the 3!)
Can't lose any of the other games even though I'd love to see Maryland lose.

Another reason why I hate divisions...Louisville takes Marylands place. Seriously, 3 teams from the same division in the top 10.

 

[Lou_C]

Oops, I misspoke. I've corrected my original post, but here are the changes:

Edit: (blush) I meant to say "two BCS programs OOC". As in 2 BCS, 1 FBS and 1 FCS... unless that becomes politically incorrect. I know that you're pushing for 1 BCS, 2 FBS and 1 FCS, but it's just not Syracuse's nature.

One more prediction: Syracuse's AD will continue to delay announcement of ACC football schedules. The SEC has already released its 2014 schedule. Meanwhile, Syracuse does not have a single OOC opponent scheduled. <sigh>

Whelp, they've now made that perfectly clear with these Maryland games. Not smart. You've got FSU, Clemson and Louisville every year, plus ND every third year.

Hopefully Pitt or BC will get the right idea, and we'll get one of our Northeastern teams putting up 9-win seasons regularly.

 

[Btstimpy]

I didn't see a just ACC thread anywhere so I thought maybe I'd make a little post here to get some info and feedback on the past and future week. I'd love to read your thoughts!

Atlantic:
Clemson and FSU look really good. SU's division (our first division ever in football and it feels weird) all won their games...some against good competition some not so good. Some took care of business like Maryland and NCS , Wake did what they had too and BC struggled.

This week:
FSU bye vs Nevada who got blown out vs UCLA next week. Maryland vs Old Dominion...please win ODU. NCS vs Richmond another tough FCS. Clemson vs SC State. ACC game Wake vs BC both on a short week. SU vs the #19 Wildcats of Northwestern.

Coastal:
VT looks like VT, tough first game. NC played a very tough USCe team and showed signs of being pretty solid. Virginia with a tough fought win over BYU. GT and Miami took care of business. Duke played a high school team but did what they had to do. Pitt showed they struggle vs speed but should be solid but Savage still looks scared.

This week:
GT bye next week vs Duke. Duke vs Memphis our first ACC vs AAC game. #9/12Florida @ Miami...big game here. Virginia vs #2/3 Oregon ...the Cavaliers have a tough one here and kudos to them for these first 2 games. NC plays Middle Tennessee and we'll get aq better read on what kind of team they will be. VT vs Western Carolina...back to a Beamer type of OOC schedule. Pitt bye and next week New Mexico.

The ACC did pretty well in week 1 with some very big games coming up.

Here is some more interesting information. I got this from the Texas Board, so I'm assuming it's accurate. Didn't verify with ESPN though, so take it at face value. It shows TV ratings for the games shown on ESPN/ABC networks during week one. It doesn't include other stuff like ND-Temple. The ACC got a lot of good visibility. Some may argue that the SEC helped the ACC get it, but it was ACC playing SEC. Kudos to ACC teams for doing this. The Syracuse Penn State game did well. The UVA-BYU game bombed, but it had a long weather delay, and we were on at the same time as Alabama-VT.

Georgia-Clemson, ABC, 4.9
South Carolina vs North Carolina 3.65 (before storm delay)
South Carolina vs North Carolina 3.14 (after storm delay)
Alabama-Virginia Tech, ESPN, 3.1
Florida State-Pittsburgh, ESPN, 3.0
Texas A&M-Rice, ESPN, 2.9
Ole Miss @ Vanderbilt 2.74 (for a game that did not end till around 1 am on the east coast on a weeknight)
Mississippi St.-Oklahoma St./Syracuse-Penn St., ABC Regional, 2.2 (combined rating)
LSU-TCU, ESPN, 1.9
Buffalo-Ohio State, ESPN2, 1.5
Texas Tech-SMU, ESPN, 1.4
Ohio-Louisville, ESPN, 1.3
Mississippi Valley St.-Florida A&M, ESPN, 0.7
Northwestern-California, ESPN2, 0.6
Washington State-Auburn, ESPN2, 0.5
Florida Atlantic-Miami, ESPNU, 0.4
Purdue-Cincinnati, ESPNU, 0.3
BYU-Virginia, ESPN2, 0.3
Kentucky-Western Kentucky, ESPNews, 0.2
Boston College-Villanova, ESPNews, 0.1
Texas-New Mexico St., LHN, 0.0

 

[riskylogic]

Texas-New Mexico St., LHN, 0.0

Lol.

Makes me wonder how the BTN fared in comparison.

 

[SWC75]

I think Lou_C is well into the "all boats rise with the tide" mode of thought that I have always advocated: you root for your conference brethren because their reputations are tied to yours, (same thing with your opponents).

I'd like Syracuse to begin every year by playing Colgate and Army. Then play two BCS schools for two different conferences, (other than the ACC, obviously). One of them should be a school that is often ranked. Then the ACC schedule. Dr. Gross would only have to schedule 2 games a year and the team would get a chance to build up to the big games, rather than play them right off.

 

[CuseLegacy]

Thanks CL! I love being in the ACC and I'm pretty pumped about being a full time member... finally. I'd like to see some thoughts about the ACC here and hopefully some of the ACC fans can post here as well regarding what they saw regarding SU and the rest of the ACC as well.

Here are some (free) snippets from the ACC pressers this week..
http://www.accsports.com/articles/unc-press-conference-9313

 

[Lou_C]

I think Lou_C is well into the "all boats rise with the tide" mode of thought that I have always advocated: you root for your conference brethren because their reputations are tied to yours, (same thing with your opponents).

I'd like Syracuse to begin every year by playing Colgate and Army. Then play two BCS schools for two different conferences, (other than the ACC, obviously). One of them should be a school that is often ranked. Then the ACC schedule. Dr. Gross would only have to schedule 2 games a year and the team would get a chance to build up to the big games, rather than play them right off.

Yep. And it's not because I have some ACC pride or I like all the ACC teams. I'd root for UNC and North Carolina to lose every game by 50 otherwise. But this stuff affects the whole conference. If Syracuse loses again this Saturday, which is likely, every conference game they win is bad for the ACC. It becomes optimal (for the conference) that Syracuse lose every ACC game at that point. It shouldn't be that way.

Had Syracuse had two cupcakes, they'd have come into Clemson 4-0. That would be a huge game. Maybe an ABC night game. A huge recruiting tool for Syracuse, and an amazing atmosphere. It's probably still in the best case for the conference that Clemson wins, to keep a national title contender alive, but Syracuse winning is not that bad. Clemson would drop, but not severely, and Syracuse would rocket into the Top 25.

Now, if SU is 2-2 and beats Clemson, it's total disaster for the ACC. Clemson is ridiculed and becomes a laughing stock again, and Syracuse is still on the outside.

This is with the exact same team. It's also what has happened to the ACC year after year after year.

Although I like Syracuse, I could hate Syracuse and still see that Syracuse coming in 4-0 is a much better scenario for the ACC and FSU. But it's also better for Syracuse. If you can't see the difference in recruiting and fan support and building a program between an 8-4 season and a 6-6 season, then I don't know what to say. There are definitely fans that would rather go 6-6 against high competition and call for the coach's head than go 8-4 and a decent bowl game. But in the real world, it doesn't work that way. Recruits don't respect the 6-6, they don't like coaching turnover and turmoil, the media doesn't respect a tough schedule if you've got a middling record.

Look at UVA. They got a nice win, an upset win, over BYU on Saturday. If they had a cupcake this week, they would have a legitimate chance to win every game until November. Instead, they will get waxed 55-3 and won't be able to be discussed seriously. If they beat Georgia Tech, it's bad for Georgia Tech. And for what reason? What does UVA gain by being blitzed by Oregon this Saturday?

But it's an emotional thing for a lot of fans. Believe me, none more so than FSU that was built on an "anytime, anyone, anywhere" philosophy.

 

[SU2NASA]

Yep. And it's not because I have some ACC pride or I like all the ACC teams. I'd root for UNC and North Carolina to lose every game by 50 otherwise. But this stuff affects the whole conference. If Syracuse loses again this Saturday, which is likely, every conference game they win is bad for the ACC. It becomes optimal (for the conference) that Syracuse lose every ACC game at that point. It shouldn't be that way.

Had Syracuse had two cupcakes, they'd have come into Clemson 4-0. That would be a huge game. Maybe an ABC night game. A huge recruiting tool for Syracuse, and an amazing atmosphere. It's probably still in the best case for the conference that Clemson wins, to keep a national title contender alive, but Syracuse winning is not that bad. Clemson would drop, but not severely, and Syracuse would rocket into the Top 25.

Now, if SU is 2-2 and beats Clemson, it's total disaster for the ACC. Clemson is ridiculed and becomes a laughing stock again, and Syracuse is still on the outside.

This is with the exact same team. It's also what has happened to the ACC year after year after year.

Although I like Syracuse, I could hate Syracuse and still see that Syracuse coming in 4-0 is a much better scenario for the ACC and FSU. But it's also better for Syracuse. If you can't see the difference in recruiting and fan support and building a program between an 8-4 season and a 6-6 season, then I don't know what to say. There are definitely fans that would rather go 6-6 against high competition and call for the coach's head than go 8-4 and a decent bowl game. But in the real world, it doesn't work that way. Recruits don't respect the 6-6, they don't like coaching turnover and turmoil, the media doesn't respect a tough schedule if you've got a middling record.

Look at UVA. They got a nice win, an upset win, over BYU on Saturday. If they had a cupcake this week, they would have a legitimate chance to win every game until November. Instead, they will get waxed 55-3 and won't be able to be discussed seriously. If they beat Georgia Tech, it's bad for Georgia Tech. And for what reason? What does UVA gain by being blitzed by Oregon this Saturday?

But it's an emotional thing for a lot of fans. Believe me, none more so than FSU that was built on an "anytime, anyone, anywhere" philosophy.

Spot on.

 

[dollarbill44]

Ok, I just went back and looked it up. You scheduled this Northwestern series in 2008. Based on where the two teams were, almost anyone following college football considered the Northwestern program to be in better shape than Syracuse, and would have expected NW to take at least 3 out of 4.

Anyway, it was a different time and you were in a different conference, so no judgements.

But the idea that Northwestern was a doormat win when it was scheduled couldn't be further from the truth.

And I would have considered scheduling Wake or Vandy up, based on where the Syracuse program was at the time. Even now those would be break even games.

No more than one loseable game should be scheduled a year, and it also needs to be a winnable game. Not like BC-USC, Duke-Alabama or UVA-Oregon.

There are exceptions to your rules about scheduling. SU beat #1 Nebraska in 1984 in a game that would have gone in your "55-0 whipping" category that should never be scheduled. That win led to a big improvement in recruiting which led to... 1987, where we had defending NC PSU at the Dome in a game that we came out and crushed them. That win led to a ton of national recognition, an 11-0 record (with a break, i.e. a Miami loss, we would have played in the NC game) and served as a launchpad for a decade of great football at SU.

There's more than one way to skin a cat and whether you agree or not, SU has always believed in scheduling tough OOC opponents as a way to gain notariety. On the off-chance you win out with a schedule like ours this year, we would be playing for the NC. Pipe-dream? Maybe, but 15-20 years ago, no one thought it was possible that Boise St, NW, Wisconsin, Oregon, etc. would ever be any good at football.

 

[SmilinBob]

1984 and 87 were a long long time ago Bill. Look how the national champions have scheduled OOC and you will have your answer. When was the last time SU went 2-0? 3-0?

 

[Lou_C]

There are exceptions to your rules about scheduling. SU beat #1 Nebraska in 1984 in a game that would have gone in your "55-0 whipping" category that should never be scheduled. That win led to a big improvement in recruiting which led to... 1987, where we had defending NC PSU at the Dome in a game that we came out and crushed them. That win led to a ton of national recognition, an 11-0 record (with a break, i.e. a Miami loss, we would have played in the NC game) and served as a launchpad for a decade of great football at SU.

There's more than one way to skin a cat and whether you agree or not, SU has always believed in scheduling tough OOC opponents as a way to gain notariety. On the off-chance you win out with a schedule like ours this year, we would be playing for the NC. Pipe-dream? Maybe, but 15-20 years ago, no one thought it was possible that Boise St, NW, Wisconsin, Oregon, etc. would ever be any good at football.

How did those schools get "good at football"? How did they schedule? It is possible and there's a way to do it, and schools like BC, UVA and Syracuse are refusing to do so.

You think Boise State plays it tough? They got where they are by scheduling ONE high profile game, and to be favorites in every other game of the year.

There may be one way to skin a cat. I want you to use a knife and cut the skin off. You want to throw it in the air because a remote control helicopter might fly by and clip off the skin. Could happen.

You're talking about something that happened 30 years ago. Do you also think your players should be running a 30 year old offense, or training with 30 year old methods? Just because something happened once, doesn't mean it works.

What works has been established over and over. I personally don't care if Syracuse wants to be irrelevant by ignoring how things actually work, but it screws up the conference.

 

[SmilinBob]

One thing that always went well for SU Lou is that SU had a lot of big OOC wins for the Big East, even ND when we had GRob. That said we also lost more than our fair share and I'd love to get off to a 2-0 or 3-0 start for once.

 

[SmilinBob]

ACC teams only lost twice OOC SU and Virginia as they both played ranked teams. Not too bad of a week for the conference and Miami definitely stepped up with a big win. Georgia beating USCe makes Clemsons win look really good as well.