anyone notice the part in Marrone's presser when he

[IthacaBarrel]

discussed "mental toughness" picking yourself up and going back up and getting after it. He said he was ready to do so, I think that was interesting... As close as you will get to him calling some players out, not saying he did but I found it interesting and I will say until this year, this team played tough and never gave up out there, don't see that this year, at all.

Like I said, I know Doug is more frustrated than anyone and I am beginning to think he is realizing that he may not be able to win here or at least doubting that he can

 

[OrangePA]

I think you are right that he is disappointed in the team's lack of toughness - physical and mental.

I refuse to believe that he feels the program can't succeed.

His re-building project is still in its infancy - the move to the ACC and the construction of new facilities will make things much easier for this program.

I'm not happy about the losses, but I'm not shocked either.

We need more talent and that will happen.

 

[Chip]

discussed "mental toughness" picking yourself up and going back up and getting after it. He said he was ready to do so, I think that was interesting... As close as you will get to him calling some players out, not saying he did but I found it interesting and I will say until this year, this team played tough and never gave up out there, don't see that this year, at all.

Like I said, I know Doug is more frustrated than anyone and I am beginning to think he is realizing that he may not be able to win here or at least doubting that he can

It's possible he is thinking this, but I'm not sure it makes much sense yet. He's yet to put one of his own recruited QBs on the field, and he may be doubting how nervous he is about doing that. But you still have to get your guys out there before you throw in the towel. Not to mention, he's got the ACC to look forward to, with his 2 biggest recruiting competitors still out in the cold as of today. Needs to take that one out to drive first.

Unless, of course, he knows that the Bernie stuff could impact our ACC move. That would be worth spiraling into a depression over. I know I will.

 

[wfschrec]

discussed "mental toughness" picking yourself up and going back up and getting after it. He said he was ready to do so, I think that was interesting... As close as you will get to him calling some players out, not saying he did but I found it interesting and I will say until this year, this team played tough and never gave up out there, don't see that this year, at all.

Like I said, I know Doug is more frustrated than anyone and I am beginning to think he is realizing that he may not be able to win here or at least doubting that he can

I think his biggest issue is that they had some success last year and they took a step back and although he expected tough sledding this year I think he expected more from the players ... he isn't getting full effort and to him its perplexing.

 

[oldpinepoint]

I think you are right that he is disappointed in the team's lack of toughness - physical and mental.

I refuse to believe that he feels the program can't succeed.

His re-building project is still in its infancy - the move to the ACC and the construction of new facilities will make things much easier for this program.

I'm not happy about the losses, but I'm not shocked either.

We need more talent and that will happen.

When i look back on this season i think we as fans expected too much after the WV win. The first 5 games we hardly perfomed at a high level. Barely beat Rhode Island, Tulane, Toledo (i think we played them) we are a few breaks from being 3-8. I agree with OrangePA. You can win here and the move to the ACC and the construction of new faciltiies will help.

 

[Cusefan95]

Like I said, I know Doug is more frustrated than anyone and I am beginning to think he is realizing that he may not be able to win here or at least doubting that he can

The CEO of the company I work for has been incredibly successful at turning around a struggling company and turning it into a market leader (I actually left a compeditior while my current company was just starting its upswing, because it was obvious to me as an outsider at the time that management was moving in the right direction. At a meeting I was with that he attended someone asked him what was the key to success, and his answer was never to take anything for granted. He said he woke up every day and looked in the mirror while shaving, and told himself he needed to make sure that today wasn't the day he screwed the whole thing up.

I'm sure Doug is feeling frustrated and has doubts right now - but the absolute best leaders I've ever work for had self-doubts, so I don't see it as a weakness. Only the paranoid survive.

 

[MadNY3]

[quote="... I am beginning to think he is realizing that he may not be able to win here or at least doubting that he can[/quote]

I really truly don't think that at all. Completely do not believe he is doubting he can win here. If he is, then he is purely doubting himself as a head coach, period. And again, I don't think that is the case.

 

[kingottoiii]

I really truly don't think that at all. Completely do not believe he is doubting he can win here. If he is, then he is purely doubting himself as a head coach, period. And again, I don't think that is the case.

I think he might be doubting himself. His post game pressers he just looks like a guy with no answers. All year his gameplans have left a lot to be desired. His first two years it was more a talent issue. The plans were sound. This year they make no sense.

In addition IMO the last two games he has made some desperate like changes. Why was Hackett on the sideline last game? He ain't helping the RBs, WRs, TEs, or OL any more by being on the sideline. He isn't seeing the opposing D any better either. Maybe he could help Nassib but IMO Marrone would be the better guy vs Hackett, who has no QB coaching experience. And it isn't like Nassib can't talk to Hackett in the booth. Seemed odd to make a change in week 13.

Also for the USF game Marrone had his father in law assisting in coaching the team. He wasn't just out there on the sideline like SU's guests. He was actually in the coaching box giving advise to players and several times talking to Marrone during the game. He had more interaction with Marrone than some of the other assistants. A HC with confidence in himself IMO does not do that in game.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The deal about his father in law being in the box is completely absurd if true

That is 100% absurd if true, What. My grandfather use to be a contractor, I don't bring him into my company and ask him how to run it. Again Marrone is really doubting his abilities at this point, that wreaks of desperation to me

 

[Millhouse]

all the more reason to go down swinging next year.

if you were at your wits end, why would you go out for your make or break year with a qb who directs an offense worse than 100 others over that span

all the safe game manager stuff is out the window. roll the dice. go with the riskiest highest upside type of guy

i'm not saying he'd get fired, i'm saying he might quit after another pitiful offensive year.

but i certainly don't understand how coaches think...

 

[IthacaBarrel]

all the more reason to go down swinging next year.

if you were at your wits end, why would you go out for your make or break year with a qb who directs an offense worse than 100 others over that span

all the safe game manager stuff is out the window. roll the dice. go with the riskiest highest upside type of guy

i'm not saying he'd get fired, i'm saying he might quit after another pitiful offensive year.

but i certainly don't understand how coaches think...

Hey I agree, go all in. Amrrone has to change his philosophy or hire someone that can run the offense. marrone should stick to being a HC, maybe he can work with specials, who knows

 

[javadoc]

Hey I agree, go all in. Amrrone has to change his philosophy or hire someone that can run the offense. marrone should stick to being a HC, maybe he can work with specials, who knows

I don't know enough to say whether we are simply hamstrung by a lack of offensive talent, but regardless, what does anyone suppose the odds are of Marrone taking his hands off the offense and letting someone else do it differently? When Marrone hires guys he says that they view things the same way, thus it's a good fit. If Marrone wants to pound the ball on the ground to set up play-action, he is not going to hire someone with a drastically different vision. They wouldn't see things the same way. We'll get another yes-man who might as well be Marrone.

 

[SoBristol]

When you are on a four game losing streak, there isn't anything charming or enlightening that any head coach is ever going to say. He can say we need to be more consistent, or avoid mistakes or penalties, or be tougher or smarter -- doesn't really matter.

As for thinking that Doug lost the team, or the players stopped trying -- when did that happen, and what players are people pointing to? This team got a lead in the first half, fought hard but let it slip to 6-10; after halftime, Cincy had a big run-back, and a quick burst for a score, and took the game away. Are people saying that our half time speeches weren't effective? Didn't see Bailey or Nassib or Chew or Provo or any of the OL stop trying. They weren't all that good; they didn't get points on the board until too late, Nassib was under pressure, but it wasn't for lack of effort.

 

[MadNY3]

I think he might be doubting himself. His post game pressers he just looks like a guy with no answers. All year his gameplans have left a lot to be desired. His first two years it was more a talent issue. The plans were sound. This year they make no sense.

In addition IMO the last two games he has made some desperate like changes. Why was Hackett on the sideline last game? He ain't helping the RBs, WRs, TEs, or OL any more by being on the sideline. He isn't seeing the opposing D any better either. Maybe he could help Nassib but IMO Marrone would be the better guy vs Hackett, who has no QB coaching experience. And it isn't like Nassib can't talk to Hackett in the booth. Seemed odd to make a change in week 13.

Also for the USF game Marrone had his father in law assisting in coaching the team. He wasn't just out there on the sideline like SU's guests. He was actually in the coaching box giving advise to players and several times talking to Marrone during the game. He had more interaction with Marrone than some of the other assistants. A HC with confidence in himself IMO does not do that in game.

Wait...his father-in-law was coaching during USF Game? If true - not doubting you - then HOLY CRAP that is scary. Wow.

 

[kingottoiii]

Wait...his father-in-law was coaching during USF Game? If true - not doubting you - then HOLY CRAP that is scary. Wow.

It was an older gentleman with a grey sweater. I saw him several times pull players to the side to talk with them. And saw him talking to Marrone and pointing to the field of play. I believe the PS said it was his FIL.

 

[kingottoiii]

As for thinking that Doug lost the team, or the players stopped trying -- when did that happen, and what players are people pointing to?

Marrone implied that players weren't mentally strong enough once we were down to keep up a strong effort.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

It was an older gentleman with a grey sweater. I saw him several times pull players to the side to talk with them. And saw him talking to Marrone and pointing to the field of play. I believe the PS said it was his FIL.

What a mess, if I was a player I would have been What, who is this guy

 

[Cuse2010]

My opinion is that he is missing the leadership from the players. Lets face it we all heard how DC3 took charge I think it was halftime of the Maine game (plus with Gulley out not really a 1-2 punch), and Hogue & Smith just had a presence last year of defense. I think that without a strong peer leader these guys are just struggling and lack confidence causing them to make even more mistakes...just my opinion

 

[SoBristol]

My opinion is that he is missing the leadership from the players. Lets face it we all heard how DC3 took charge I think it was halftime of the Maine game (plus with Gulley out not really a 1-2 punch), and Hogue & Smith just had a presence last year of defense. I think that without a strong peer leader these guys are just struggling and lack confidence causing them to make even more mistakes...just my opinion

Another way to phrase this -- DC3 was tough as nails and an NFL caliber running back; Hogue & Smith were two of the better linebackers at SU in the past 8 years. Hogue was good enough to win national player of the week twice. With that talent in the mix, we eked out some close low-scoring wins last year, but still faded in November.

Look, I think we have good guys who have leadership traits (Kevyn Scott and Adam Harris are student athletes who will be successful in life), but who aren't going to be playing on Sundays. If you are playing kids who aren't ready for the roles (most of our LBs; some of our OL), you can't expect confidence or pep talks to carry the day. Coach has to wins some recruiting battles.

 

[Cuse2010]

Another way to phrase this -- DC3 was tough as nails and an NFL caliber running back; Hogue & Smith were two of the better linebackers at SU in the past 8 years. Hogue was good enough to win national player of the week twice. With that talent in the mix, we eked out some close low-scoring wins last year, but still faded in November.

Look, I think we have good guys who have leadership traits (Kevyn Scott and Adam Harris are student athletes who will be successful in life), but who aren't going to be playing on Sundays. If you are playing kids who aren't ready for the roles (most of our LBs; some of our OL), you can't expect confidence or pep talks to carry the day. Coach has to wins some recruiting battles.

I think I agree, but not just their ability, and just traits I am talking about guys that will lead them through the adversity and say follow me, I am not there but from when I played years ago that seems to be what is lacking a leader that says follow me, and holds the rest accountable without belittling