Boy do I hate... | Syracusefan.com
.

Boy do I hate...

Lawrinson14

Lawrinson14

Master Image Editor
Joined
Oct 11, 2011
Messages
2,553
Like
8,202
The plethora of computer calculations/algorithms that have seemingly sprung up out of nowhere.

Kenpom
RPI
BPI
Synergy
etc, etc.

They are all a crock of crap. And now it is apparently mainstream to use them when assessing teams. Take this latest ESPN article about Pitt: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebask...weekend-homework-reconciling-pitt-perceptions. The 6th and 7th bullets immediately made me think "bullstuff"

I'll continue to trust my eyes to tell me whether a team, or player, is good or not. I don't need a computer to tell me.
 
Last edited:
I think, overall, these types of things make for a more educated fan, and end up rewarding smart coaches and players.

That said, they're misapplied all the time. All the time. Drives me nuts. Obviously I may have some anger management issues, but I remember reading an article about Cy Young rankings where one pitcher was ranked ahead of another using some insane hypothetical statistical scenario of what could happen as justification for the ranking. You know, instead of evaluating the merits of what actually happened.Oh Lord
 
The problem to me is that you have to look at each formula figure out what they measure and how they value each measurable in relationship to the rest of the measured values in said formula. Then you can see what is weighted the highest and understand what type of teams will generally be favored in said formula. :crazy: Ummm right basically way to much thinking and analyzing when its more fun to watch the games.

I find many of the values often used in these formula's to be very useful such as off and def efficiency which is pretty simple. These stats can really be helpful especially combined with say pace of play our shooting percentage off/def stats. When combined into a formula though its pretty much impossible to weight everything in a way that doesn't unevenly favor certain teams/coaches or certain types.
 
Syracuse is a good team, but as I said previously this year's team is like Greg Maddux and not Randy Johnson. We are the crafty ace that beats you with intelligence, grit, and good talent, but we don't have that 95mph fastball.

These Pitt idiots talking up their team are like last year when they beat nobody in the non-conference and got ranked and when the Big East rolled around finished 12-6. Pitt hasn't played a team with as much talent as Syracuse this season yet. Syracuse has played teams with similar talent to Pittsburgh. Dixon knows how to play against our zone, but this Pitt doesn't have that bigs that can kill on the glass. Jerami Grant, C.J. Fair, Rak Christmas/Baye Keita can clean up the glass and negate Pitt 2nd chance points. In the past Pitt's best offense against Syracuse has been a missed shot and offensive rebound put back. This Syracuse team can rebound the ball and unless Pitt kills us on the glass I don't think they will win.
 
The fact you can now take a bunch of variables and use basic functions to run regression analysis in excel with ease has created a bunch of " gurus" in a hurry. Most are armchair gurus who like statistics.
 
Alsacs said:
Syracuse is a good team, but as I said previously this year's team is like Greg Maddux and not Randy Johnson. We are the crafty ace that beats you with intelligence, grit, and good talent, but we don't have that 95mph fastball..
Expand...

That to some extent is what worries me about this team. We are a great team, but we're not a DOMINANT one. Will that hurt us later in the season?

Although as was shown last March, the Zone operating at a DOMINANT level will get us to the Final Four.
 
Alsacs said:
Syracuse is a good team, but as I said previously this year's team is like Greg Maddux and not Randy Johnson. We are the crafty ace that beats you with intelligence, grit, and good talent, but we don't have that 95mph fastball.

These Pitt idiots talking up their team are like last year when they beat nobody in the non-conference and got ranked and when the Big East rolled around finished 12-6. Pitt hasn't played a team with as much talent as Syracuse this season yet. Syracuse has played teams with similar talent to Pittsburgh. Dixon knows how to play against our zone, but this Pitt doesn't have that bigs that can kill on the glass. Jerami Grant, C.J. Fair, Rak Christmas/Baye Keita can clean up the glass and negate Pitt 2nd chance points. In the past Pitt's best offense against Syracuse has been a missed shot and offensive rebound put back. This Syracuse team can rebound the ball and unless Pitt kills us on the glass I don't think they will win.
Expand...

The closest thing we have to that 95 mph fastball is Trevor. CJ has show spurts of being unstoppable as well. I also think it can seem like we are missing that piece because we play a halfcourt style vs being built to go fast.
 
Lawrinson14 said:
The plethora of computer calculations/algorithms that have seemingly sprung up out of nowhere.

Kenpom
RPI
BPI
Synergy
etc, etc.

They are all a crock of crap. And now it it apparently mainstream to use them when assessing teams. Take this latest ESPN article about Pitt: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebask...weekend-homework-reconciling-pitt-perceptions. The 6th and 7th bullets immediately made me think "bullstuff"

I'll continue to trust my eyes to tell me whether a team, or player, is good or not. I don't need a computer to tell me.
Expand...
RPI is like the Model T of the field - great in its day but hopelessly outmoded
BPI is not really an algorithm. Bilas looks at all the various rankings to get a general survey of the field, then just ranks them according to his subjective opinion ooops . . . the BPI is an algorithm; I was confusing it with ESPN's Bilas Index.

Synergy Sports has a ton of detailed data and analysis, but it is proprietary and costs a lot to access, it really isn't the same thing as the others.

I like Pomeroy because it is a pretty elegant method - offensive efficiency minus defensive efficiency - but mostly because of the details he gives on specific aspects of offense and defense

but the best thing to do is use Ken Massey's cumulative rankings. at least for now; there are some flaws with Massey that someone will clean up some day.
 
Last edited:
HakAttack said:
That to some extent is what worries me about this team. We are a great team, but we're not a DOMINANT one. Will that hurt us later in the season?

Although as was shown last March, the Zone operating at a DOMINANT level will get us to the Final Four.
Expand...
Honestly only 2 teams have that 95 mph fastball. Kentucky and Kansas and that is because of their NBA talent. Luckily Kentucky has John Caliapri coaching and doesn't have an Anthony Davis type of talent, but Kansas scares me because of Embeed, Wiggins, Thorpe, Seldon Jr, Ellis, w/ Bill Self who has his share of What losses, but is a good coach.

Arizona is number 1 in America, but I consider them like Syracuse in that they are an ace, but don't have that 95 mph fastball.
 
Alsacs said:
Honestly only 2 teams have that 95 mph fastball. Kentucky and Kansas and that is because of their NBA talent. Luckily Kentucky has John Caliapri coaching and doesn't have an Anthony Davis type of talent, but Kansas scares me because of Embeed, Wiggins, Thorpe, Seldon Jr, Ellis, w/ Bill Self who has his share of What losses, but is a good coach.

Arizona is number 1 in America, but I consider them like Syracuse in that they are an ace, but don't have that 95 mph fastball.
Expand...

I think guard play will ultimately be Kansas undoing.
 
Alsacs said:
Honestly only 2 teams have that 95 mph fastball. Kentucky and Kansas and that is because of their NBA talent. Luckily Kentucky has John Caliapri coaching and doesn't have an Anthony Davis type of talent, but Kansas scares me because of Embeed, Wiggins, Thorpe, Seldon Jr, Ellis, w/ Bill Self who has his share of What losses, but is a good coach.

Arizona is number 1 in America, but I consider them like Syracuse in that they are an ace, but don't have that 95 mph fastball.
Expand...

doc beat me to the punch about guardplay with KU. Also KU is a team ripe to be picked early. Seems like Self's KU teams get knocked out early or go far. This looks like an early knockout squad. Embiid is impressive and Wiggins is getting better. With that said they play too loose at times for a team with the goods to be dominant defensively. As good as Embiid is you already can see him putting more effort on offense and not quite as much on D. I don't think he is in the Withey category in terms of shot blocking and overall post D.
 

Forum statistics

Threads
174,156
Messages
5,138,146
Members
6,107
Latest member
Loosecuse

Share this page

Online statistics

Members online
197
Guests online
1,761
Total visitors
1,958
Totals may include hidden visitors.


...
Top Bottom