Defending the Spread Offense

[Hoov50]

To start off with, many of you know that I am coach myself, and have had the opportunity to learn from some excellent high school and college coaches. I can tell you first hand that coming up with a scheme to defend a spread offense is a difficult task, which is a major reason why so many teams are moving to the spread at every level of football. With that being said, over Coach Shafer´s tenure both as our DC and now HC, we have consistently looked clueless defending teams that use spread offenses.

Even in games we have won against spread teams we have been torched in at least one aspect of the game (either on the ground or through the air). I don't understand how we don't seem to learn from past experiences. Each time we face a team running the spread it seems like we have never seen it before. I can deal with losing to a South Florida, if our guys are in the right position, but just can't make a play. But on Saturday at times it seemed like USF was running against the air. There were times when our players just didn't make plays, the double reverse pass and the 3rd and forever screen pass come to mind, but most times we seemed clueless defending USF.

If our coaching staff isn't able to defend, or in many games even slow down, teams who run a spread offense, we need to start looking in other directions, at least in regards to defensive coaching. More and more teams are moving toward these types of spread offenses so we need to be able to defend them.

 

[Millhouse]

To start off with, many of you know that I am coach myself, and have had the opportunity to learn from some excellent high school and college coaches. I can tell you first hand that coming up with a scheme to defend a spread offense is a difficult task, which is a major reason why so many teams are moving to the spread at every level of football. With that being said, over Coach Shafer´s tenure both as our DC and now HC, we have consistently looked clueless defending teams that use spread offenses.

Even in games we have won against spread teams we have been torched in at least one aspect of the game (either on the ground or through the air). I don't understand how we don't seem to learn from past experiences. Each time we face a team running the spread it seems like we have never seen it before. I can deal with losing to a South Florida, if our guys are in the right position, but just can't make a play. But on Saturday at times it seemed like USF was running against the air. There were times when our players just didn't make plays, the double reverse pass and the 3rd and forever screen pass come to mind, but most times we seemed clueless defending USF.

If our coaching staff isn't able to defend, or in many games even slow down, teams who run a spread offense, we need to start looking in other directions, at least in regards to defensive coaching. More and more teams are moving toward these types of spread offenses so we need to be able to defend them.

practicing against a spread offense run by someone with a brain in his head might help our defense defend against it

 

[Full_Rebar]

The 3 play 80 yard drive was the perfect example of the poor defense. Cut a 24-3 deficit to 24-17 and then USF just coasted down the field to push it back to two scores.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Much like kung fu, there is no defense against the spread offense.

 

[RF2044]

Great post, Hoov. I don't expect to have an impregnable defense--there's some validity to OiG's tongue-in-cheek post above. But to look inept every time we face a spread offense is frustrating, when many of the elements are in place for the defense to be adequate.

It has to change. Enough is enough.

 

[Millhouse]

Great post, Hoov. I don't expect to have an impregnable defense--there's some validity to OiG's tongue-in-cheek post above. But to look inept every time we face a spread offense is frustrating, when many of the elements are in place for the defense to be adequate.

It has to change. Enough is enough.

you change the way gary patterson did

 

[OrangeinBoston]

Great observation. The wide receiver screens run by USF drove me absolutely wild. Why can't we defend these? When we have tried to run these in the past, we got nothing. When USF ran them, we were helpless. I can only hope Shafer and Bullough are all over these this week, because I can imagine we will see a steady diet of this play on Saturday until we prove we can stop it.

 

[Hoov50]

Great post, Hoov. I don't expect to have an impregnable defense--there's some validity to OiG's tongue-in-cheek post above. But to look inept every time we face a spread offense is frustrating, when many of the elements are in place for the defense to be adequate.

It has to change. Enough is enough.

I agree, I don't expect to completely shut down teams who run the spread. When we play against spread teams our philosophy is; "They are going to make the occasional big play, but we have to limit their big plays." Against teams that run the spread/read option there are simple ways to dictate who carries the ball. When gameplanning we identify who the better runner is and make sure they don't get the ball in the option. When I watch SU's defense "defend" the read option, it looks like they don't understand the concept at all. If you are going to have your DL continue to read the hip and close down when the OL blocks away, then you sure as heck better have another player on the second level who is responsible for the other offensive player. Why force the QB to pull and keep the ball to the outside when you don't have anyone responsible for him?! I know that college offenses are much more complex than high school spread offenses, but if we can teach our 15-18 year old kids in one week how to dictate who carries the ball it seems like college players and coaches could do the same with more resources (coaches, time, films) at their disposal.

 

[RF2044]

Great observation. The wide receiver screens run by USF drove me absolutely wild. Why can't we defend these? When we have tried to run these in the past, we got nothing. When USF ran them, we were helpless. I can only hope Shafer and Bullough are all over these this week, because I can imagine we will see a steady diet of this play on Saturday until we prove we can stop it.

That used to drive me nuts during both of our bubble screen phases. We had the double edged sword of not being able to execute them or slow the opposition down when they ran them. Awesome.

 

[TheCusian]

Holgerson timidly raises hand.

 

[Millhouse]

That used to drive me nuts during both of our bubble screen phases. We had the double edged sword of not being able to execute them or slow the opposition down when they ran them. Awesome.

when your offense is too stupid to understand when and why teams throw bubbles, your defense only practices against an offense too stupid to count

 

[upperdeck]

so how did we shut down WV so many games ? is is the scheme or the players? Im sure its a simple thing to defend since the whole big 12 is clueless how to do it most games. How did TCU go from a team with a great D to allowing 50 a game in a matter of a few years

 

[Millhouse]

so how did we shut down WV so many games ? is is the scheme or the players? Im sure its a simple thing to defend since the whole big 12 is clueless how to do it most games. How did TCU go from a team with a great D to allowing 50 a game in a matter of a few years

rattle geno smith. he's very rattleable

 

[RF2044]

when your offense is too stupid to understand when and why teams throw bubbles, your defense only practices against an offense too stupid to count

Sadly, that pretty much hits the nail right on the head.

 

[Hoov50]

so how did we shut down WV so many games ? is is the scheme or the players? Im sure its a simple thing to defend since the whole big 12 is clueless how to do it most games. How did TCU go from a team with a great D to allowing 50 a game in a matter of a few years

We sacked Geno Smith a bunch of times, probably a combination of scheme and players, but being able to shut down one spread offense obviously doesn't mean we know how to shut down others.

There is a difference between saying something is easy to defend and expecting that a defense at least looks like they understand basic concepts. I don't claim the spread is easy to defend, if it was teams wouldn't be changing to that offense at the rate they are, however there are ways to slow it down and we, apparently, don't know any of those ways.

If you look at TCU, their defensive statistics started to take a hit when they sped up their offense. Quick scores do equal points, but it also equals less rest time for your defense and more opportunities for your opponents to score.

 

[Full_Rebar]

so how did we shut down WV so many games ? is is the scheme or the players? Im sure its a simple thing to defend since the whole big 12 is clueless how to do it most games. How did TCU go from a team with a great D to allowing 50 a game in a matter of a few years

WVU didn't run a complex scheme. I think Syracuse did a good job of taking away Austin and then making Geno have to go to his 2nd read...and he wasn't a threat to run the ball.

 

[Millhouse]

WVU didn't run a complex scheme. I think Syracuse did a good job of taking away Austin and then making Geno have to go to his 2nd read...and he wasn't a threat to run the ball.

chandler jones having his best games against them helped a lot

 

[Crusty]

Most of the last decade our secondary has been slow and small. We can't play press or even man very well. That leaves us vulnerable to spread offenses.

 

[JoeSU]

Most of the last decade our secondary has been slow and small. We can't play press or even man very well. That leaves us vulnerable to spread offenses.

I'm not an Xs and Os expert like some here, but it seems that the multiple blitz packages we like to employ is a double-edge sword. If we send 5 or 6 to blitz and fail to get to the QB (or at least pressure him into an errant throw), it leaves fewer defenders in pass coverage. This leaves us especially vulnerable out on the flanks, where USF killed us. It also often leaves our DBs out on an island in single coverage, which is a difficult task.

 

[Orangello]

Most of the last decade our secondary has been slow and small. We can't play press or even man very well. That leaves us vulnerable to spread offenses.

Combined with receivers on the other team who can actually execute and hold blocks against our undersized DB's and LB's who play close to the LOS to defend the run and often over commit on the run fake, you have a bad defense against the spread.

 

[K Otto XLIV]

Current D coaches grew up playing against pro set or option Os and used the 4-3 against it. They need to evolve. But since their bread and butter is the 4-3 they are against it. Using a 4-3 is find if you have NFL or SEC talent as the players can take on the difficult responsibilities, particularly at OLB and in the secondary. You cannot expect the types of kids SU can bring in make those plays.

The one team we had success against is WV. When we played them we would use a DE or quick DT at NT with 2 speed rushers at DE. We would use 2 MLBs and 2 SSs in an OLB/SS hybrid. Then we had 2 FS and 2 CBs. It was essentially a 3-2-6 D. I rather see SU use this as our base D than a 4-3. It would make things more difficult vs the Pitts and BCs of the world but it would also make things a lot easier vs everyone else.

 

[SUskibum]

I think there is a distinction between spread to run and spread to throw offenses.

IMO we struggle vs the spread to run/bubble (count the players) but have succeeded against the spread to pass. Seems like we often get QB disruption before the downfield pass can be executed but the run/bubble option does not take long to get off which nullifies our greatest strength (pressure).

:noidea:

 

[Crusty]

I think there is a distinction between spread to run and spread to throw offenses.

IMO we struggle vs the spread to run/bubble (count the players) but have succeeded against the spread to pass. Seems like we often get QB disruption before the downfield pass can be executed but the run/bubble option does not take long to get off which nullifies our greatest strength (pressure).

:noidea:

Who is a spread to run offense?

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Who is a spread to run offense?

Oregon I think is the proto type

 

[SUskibum]

Who is a spread to run offense?

I haven't done the math, but if you added up runs and screens (RB and bubble) for USF I would bet that would account for 65-75% of their total offensive yardage, but that is just my naked eye. I count bubbles and rb screens as runs even though they show up as pass. Thats why I used "spread to run/bubble"

I am not saying I am right, I am just throwing it out there...