DeVito efficiency

[adab1217]

Hey gang, stumbled across this from Twitter from an analytics/data viz guy.

It's a chart that measures the QBs overall PFF grade with his overall efficiency numbers in the offense. DeVito ranks slightly above average nationally per PFF individually, but the offense he leads is the worst in the country. Reflects very poorly on the talent and performance around him this year.

Teams below the trend line have supported their QB less, compared to teams above it, who have made their QB better. No team is further below the line than SU.

I add to this post that if anyone wants to reach out with tips/story ideas, my PMs are open, or I can be found via email anthonydabbundo1826@gmail.com

 

[Redrum]

Hmmmm crickets

 

[SuRaider307]

Hey gang, stumbled across this from Twitter from an analytics/data viz guy.

It's a chart that measures the QBs overall PFF grade with his overall efficiency numbers in the offense. DeVito ranks slightly above average nationally per PFF individually, but the offense he leads is the worst in the country. Reflects very poorly on the talent and performance around him this year.


View attachment 189783

Teams below the trend line have supported their QB less, compared to teams above it, who have made their QB better. No team is further below the line than SU.

I add to this post that if anyone wants to reach out with tips/story ideas, my PMs are open, or I can be found via email anthonydabbundo1826@gmail.com

First time seeing this breakdown as a graphic. Its displaying what the Film/ my eyes have been seeing. It doesn't surprise me as I have said all along.. TD is the least of our worries on O right now. i have pointed out some things he can work on and areas for growth but overall.. he has not got a lot of support from his "supporting cast" within the offense.. and yes you can include the OC in that as well

 

[FloridaFan]

I’d say something but I’m dumb with math. Can I get a layman’s terms on what this means? Tommy doing ok but the team is bad?

 

[All4SU]

It’s a really interesting representation. As I’ve said before, TD needs the time that a functional OL provides, and WRs to catch the ball. Hopefully we can get there.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

1. What does this mean in English?

2. It is impossible to completely quantify statistically whether or not the QB, RB, WR, TE, OL fulfilled the play as designed. One would need to know everyone's assignment and then judge (human decision) where to blame.

3. Tommy's issue have never been throwing the football. He issue is not pulling the trigger or being able to decide where the ball goes. When he throws the ball he is very good statistically. But you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

3. Tommy's issue have never been throwing the football. He issue is not pulling the trigger or being able to decide where the ball goes. When he throws the ball he is very good statistically. But you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Yeah, it's management, not talent, that's always been the problem.

 

[GoSU96]

SU is next to last in RZ TD%, 60th in RZ attempts, 3rd from last in RZ scoring percentage, last in sacks allowed, 73rd in tackles for a loss allowed.

74th in total rushing and 75th in yds per carry while being 37th in rushing attempts.

They are 61st in long scrimmage plays.

All that starts and ends with the OL. Too many negative plays, no push on the line, no time to execute and generate explosive plays.

 

[RandomGuy]

2. It is impossible to completely quantify statistically whether or not the QB, RB, WR, TE, OL fulfilled the play as designed. One would need to know everyone's assignment and then judge (human decision) where to blame.

Exactly. BUT it does quantify the overall offense as a whole.

For instance. PFF has our oline position grades backwards. They've assigned blame to one position, where the other is position is the root cause. A mistake is a mistake though, so that portion of the grade reflects on the entire unit.

Throw all that other stuff in? And its just a best guess. I'd assert that a more QB friendly scheme would have risen the entirety of all grades.

 

[SWC75]

It also reflects the play calling.

And much of Tommy's efficiency comes from his refusal to throw the ball on a scramble, although above average efficiency when he's asked to throw long so much and mostly to the sideline is kind of impressive.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Exactly. BUT it does quantify the overall offense as a whole.

For instance. PFF has our oline position grades backwards. They've assigned blame to one position, where the other is position is the root cause. A mistake is a mistake though, so that portion of the grade reflects on the entire unit.

Throw all that other stuff in? And its just a best guess. I'd assert that a more QB friendly scheme would have risen the entirety of all grades.

Isn't a position grade a number assigned by human judgement? How exactly is that a statistic?

Just looking at the chart it seems to say our O stinks and our QB is average. I don't think anyone would disagree with either.

IMO it is extremely difficult to use statistical analysis in football and even more difficult in the college game. For example a good OC will make mediocre players decent. Good players will make a mediocre OC decent. A decent OC with decent players will be decent. The three outputs will all be the same but it is nearly impossible to use stats to breakdown which is which.

 

[orangepassion]

But how much of our problems guarding the 3 are on Buddy Boeheim?

 

[Millhouse]

Hey gang, stumbled across this from Twitter from an analytics/data viz guy.

It's a chart that measures the QBs overall PFF grade with his overall efficiency numbers in the offense. DeVito ranks slightly above average nationally per PFF individually, but the offense he leads is the worst in the country. Reflects very poorly on the talent and performance around him this year.


View attachment 189783

Teams below the trend line have supported their QB less, compared to teams above it, who have made their QB better. No team is further below the line than SU.

I add to this post that if anyone wants to reach out with tips/story ideas, my PMs are open, or I can be found via email anthonydabbundo1826@gmail.com

No idea what the actual stats are. Without knowing what they're doing, what can you do with it

 

[Millhouse]

1. What does this mean in English?

2. It is impossible to completely quantify statistically whether or not the QB, RB, WR, TE, OL fulfilled the play as designed. One would need to know everyone's assignment and then judge (human decision) where to blame.

3. Tommy's issue have never been throwing the football. He issue is not pulling the trigger or being able to decide where the ball goes. When he throws the ball he is very good statistically. But you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

Thing is though that he's not really that good per pass for whatever reason. It's a lot worse when you add in sacks.

I know in the nfl , sacks follow qbs, it's will proven by now, but a line can only be so bad in the nfl. In college, you can't just assume that.

 

[djorange1989]

SU is next to last in RZ TD%, 60th in RZ attempts, 3rd from last in RZ scoring percentage, last in sacks allowed, 73rd in tackles for a loss allowed.

74th in total rushing and 75th in yds per carry while being 37th in rushing attempts.

They are 61st in long scrimmage plays.

All that starts and ends with the OL. Too many negative plays, no push on the line, no time to execute and generate explosive plays.

you make all this sound so negative. Oh, yeah, it is.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Thing is though that he's not really that good per pass for whatever reason. It's a lot worse when you add in sacks.

I know in the nfl , sacks follow qbs, it's will proven by now, but a line can only be so bad in the nfl. In college, you can't just assume that.

Would love to see a passing chart for him and what his numbers are short, medium, long on the left, middle, and right. I wonder if the impression that I get is reality or just a perception.

 

[sutomcat]

Hmmmm crickets

This makes great sense to me. To be well supported as a QB, you need a good running game, an OL that can pass block, receivers that can get open and receivers that can catch the ball.

I think we have deficiencies in all these areas.

On the positive side, it looks like we have found a RB who can be consistently successful running the ball. I think the run blocking of the OL, even as currently composed, is decent.

I think have the guys on the team right now to be decent, or even quite good at pass blocking (and maybe very good at run blocking). Just need them to get healthy. That doesn't appear likely until next season.

Hoping we can ride out this season with the guys we have, coach them up some to get them better, and identify and develop receivers for next year.

Queeley appears to be emerging on the outside. He has been a pleasant surprise.
Benson is clearly a talented player who can and should get more touches.

Hackett needs to be targeted more, even if he is not coming back (please come back). Nykeim looks healthy again and has been much better this season. Not sure he is well suited to playing inside but he can contribute on the outside. Will he come back for a bonus year?

A priority for the rest of this season is to find a reliable backup RB and at least one solid slot receiver. Another option on the outside would also be nice.
Lutz and Pena have to be neck and neck in practices.

Sharod Johnson, Courtney Jackson, Justin Barron and maybe Isaiah Jones seem closest to breaking into the WR rotation. I have a feeling Barron is going to be the next guy to emerge but I would like to base that on more than a couple of plays.

C'mon guys...this is a great chance to establish yourself. Someone step up!

 

[TheCusian]

I haven't been running stats and seeing where we stack up for a reason. It's self-evident.

<insert boilerplate>Tommy is only a part of the issue as he can hold the ball and gets the yips, the OL play and injuries the biggest reason, RBs sitting out, new OC and no spring ball didn't help, and WR's drops add up. I think with no OL injuries, a full spring/fall camp, and our full complement of RBs we are probably a mid P5 O.</boilerplate>

 

[All4SU]

Is there any help in the horizon for the OL this season? Injured player returning? One of the young guys being ready “enough” to get some play?

 

[RandomGuy]

IMO it is extremely difficult to use statistical analysis in football and even more difficult in the college game. For example a good OC will make mediocre players decent. Good players will make a mediocre OC decent. A decent OC with decent players will be decent. The three outputs will all be the same but it is nearly impossible to use stats to breakdown which is which.

I agree with all of that- except when its the coach that assigns the statistical grade. PFF is doing their best to recreate that.

Obviously, when they grade Hackett as the top pass blocking TE in the country? They are correct...lol. (hint. They did)

Easy to see a good catch/throw/tackle/block. Same for missed tackle,drops, etc... After that its a crapshoot, but still an honest reflection of the whole. 30 more called intermediate routes? Maybe we aren't having this conversation.

 

[SWC75]

I agree with all of that- except when its the coach that assigns the statistical grade. PFF is doing their best to recreate that.

Obviously, when they grade Hackett as the top pass blocking TE in the country? They are correct...lol. (hint. They did)

Easy to see a good catch/throw/tackle/block. Same for missed tackle,drops, etc... After that its a crapshoot, but still an honest reflection of the whole. 30 more called intermediate routes? Maybe we aren't having this conversation.

I've always thought that the coaches should issue public grades for the positions that get stats. Their performance shouldn't be anonymous. The fans wind up judging them by a handful of plays they remember, usually when they screw up.

 

[Redrum]

1. What does this mean in English?

2. It is impossible to completely quantify statistically whether or not the QB, RB, WR, TE, OL fulfilled the play as designed. One would need to know everyone's assignment and then judge (human decision) where to blame.

3. Tommy's issue have never been throwing the football. He issue is not pulling the trigger or being able to decide where the ball goes. When he throws the ball he is very good statistically. But you miss 100% of the shots you don't take.

U can’t pull the trigger when u have 3 guys maybe 4 out on routes vs 7/8 defenders in 2 seconds and that’s half our plays . Did u see last week one play liberty rushes 3 which they did a lot and Rex had like 5 seconds finally a guy breaks open and it’s dropped /slashed broken up . That’s what’s supposed to happen
Your 5/6 men are supposed to give you all day to find a guy vs all that coverage . That’s how bad it’s been . Did u hear the announcer during the duke game ? No way 3 guys get in that fast . It’s like beating a dead horse
And please don’t under estimate the wrong choice routes that leave him befuddled
I could go on for days . We got injury ravaged
2 years in a row on the O line it’s bad bad bad luck . We need 22 O lineman next year Clemson had 20 we have 15

Isn't a position grade a number assigned by human judgement? How exactly is that a statistic?

Just looking at the chart it seems to say our O stinks and our QB is average. I don't think anyone would disagree with either.

IMO it is extremely difficult to use statistical analysis in football and even more difficult in the college game. For example a good OC will make mediocre players decent. Good players will make a mediocre OC decent. A decent OC with decent players will be decent. The three outputs will all be the same but it is nearly impossible to use stats to breakdown which is which.

even seeing it in black and white u don’t get it
You have no idea how many issues there are besides those listed that I’m not going to get crucified for airing . Did u know he leads the country in throws aways dating back to last year ? Could be 30 more sacks or poor descions leading to picks . Sure he could save a few by throwing it away instead of a 1or 2 yard sack if that makes u feel better but TBH he already throws a ridiculous

Is there any help in the horizon for the OL this season? Injured player returning? One of the young guys being ready “enough” to get some play?

adams and bliech will be very good guards
Vet needs to add 20 lbs he gets pushed back a lot , Servais is hurt will he be back idk
Burgeron is solid needs to clean up penalties
We have a injured un proven underbelly
And promising newbies next class but won’t be ready bottom line need 2 tackles and a center that are proven (2) I’m catching that ball and there’s nothing you can do about it wrs . Pretty please

 

[GoSU96]

U can’t pull the trigger when u have 3 guys maybe 4 out on routes vs 7/8 defenders in 2 seconds and that’s half our plays . Did u see last week one play liberty rushes 3 which they did a lot and Rex had like 5 seconds finally a guy breaks open and it’s dropped /slashed broken up . That’s what’s supposed to happen
Your 5/6 men are supposed to give you all day to find a guy vs all that coverage . That’s how bad it’s been . Did u hear the announcer during the duke game ? No way 3 guys get in that fast . It’s like beating a dead horse
And please don’t under estimate the wrong choice routes that leave him befuddled
I could go on for days . We got injury ravaged
2 years in a row on the O line it’s bad bad bad luck . We need 22 O lineman next year Clemson had 20 we have 15

even seeing it in black and white u don’t get it
You have no idea how many issues there are besides those listed that I’m not going to get crucified for airing . Did u know he leads the country in throws aways dating back to last year ? Could be 30 more sacks or poor descions leading to picks . Sure he could save a few by throwing it away instead of a 1or 2 yard sack if that makes u feel better but TBH he already throws a ridiculous

adams and bliech will be very good guards
Vet needs to add 20 lbs he gets pushed back a lot , Servais is hurt will he be back idk
Burgeron is solid needs to clean up penalties
We have a injured un proven underbelly
And promising newbies next class but won’t be ready bottom line need 2 tackles and a center that are proven (2) I’m catching that ball and there’s nothing you can do about it wrs . Pretty please

thanks

 

[ElwoodJBlues]

I hope the hype around Anthony Red and Bleich translates to the field next year. If Tommy has the ability to be a pure pocket passer, I think the outcome is a 100% change.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

U can’t pull the trigger when u have 3 guys maybe 4 out on routes vs 7/8 defenders in 2 seconds and that’s half our plays . Did u see last week one play liberty rushes 3 which they did a lot and Rex had like 5 seconds finally a guy breaks open and it’s dropped /slashed broken up . That’s what’s supposed to happen
Your 5/6 men are supposed to give you all day to find a guy vs all that coverage . That’s how bad it’s been . Did u hear the announcer during the duke game ? No way 3 guys get in that fast . It’s like beating a dead horse
And please don’t under estimate the wrong choice routes that leave him befuddled
I could go on for days . We got injury ravaged
2 years in a row on the O line it’s bad bad bad luck . We need 22 O lineman next year Clemson had 20 we have 15

even seeing it in black and white u don’t get it
You have no idea how many issues there are besides those listed that I’m not going to get crucified for airing . Did u know he leads the country in throws aways dating back to last year ? Could be 30 more sacks or poor descions leading to picks . Sure he could save a few by throwing it away instead of a 1or 2 yard sack if that makes u feel better but TBH he already throws a ridiculous

adams and bliech will be very good guards
Vet needs to add 20 lbs he gets pushed back a lot , Servais is hurt will he be back idk
Burgeron is solid needs to clean up penalties
We have a injured un proven underbelly
And promising newbies next class but won’t be ready bottom line need 2 tackles and a center that are proven (2) I’m catching that ball and there’s nothing you can do about it wrs . Pretty please

Will agree to disagree. The ball has come out faster for Rex vs UNC, Pitt, Duke, and Liberty. We haven't seen him holding the ball. Same thing happened last year with Welch. Why is our sack rate half when the other QBs are in? If that is play calling then the coaches should be calling better plays to help the OL out when Tommy is in.