Here's one way to deal with an unsatisfactory performance ... | Syracusefan.com

Here's one way to deal with an unsatisfactory performance ...

CuseMan4 said:
I have no problem with this whatsoever. D1 basketball, it’s a business and professional job for these kids. They beat the snow storm and have a quick turnaround. Gotta get the work in. That’s the difference between a top notch program and an average program. No problem with it
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Of the list of things that differentiate a top notch program from an average program, PR stunts like this couldn’t possibly be in the top 10.
 
Brooky03 said:
Of the list of things that differentiate a top notch program from an average program, PR stunts like this couldn’t possibly be in the top 10.
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I think a lot of times people try to copy what successful people do outwardly without realizing the outward actions are the visible manifestations of internal mentality and philosophy. Just holding practice at 6AM isn’t going to make us successful - having a coach committed to grinding every day to be the best is required to be successful though. UConn has that kind of a coach right now. Syracuse hasn’t had that kind of a coach in over a decade.

And as much of a grating human being as Hurley is - I could live with a coach like that if we’re seeing banners raised like he has at UConn.
 
Cusefan95 said:
I think a lot of times people try to copy what successful people do outwardly without realizing the outward actions are the visible manifestations of internal mentality and philosophy. Just holding practice at 6AM isn’t going to make us successful - having a coach committed to grinding every day to be the best is required to be successful though. UConn has that kind of a coach right now. Syracuse hasn’t had that kind of a coach in over a decade.

And as much of a grating human being as Hurley is - I could live with a coach like that if we’re seeing banners raised like he has at UConn.
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UConn has a coach committed to cultivating that image. I have seen nothing from that program that indicates they operate fundamentally different from most programs in college basketball. There is no evidence to suggest Hurley is a harder working or more tenacious coach than most. A bigger jerk? Absolutely. Acutely aware of and interested in media attention? Of course.

He didn’t take a ragtag bunch of recruits to championships. The school committed resources and delivered talent. Nobody would argue he’s a bad coach, but his role in it is touted like HE made it happen, when there were a lot of outside factors at play.
 
sufandu said:
Pat Summitt was known for holding early practices the morning after a bad game when she thought her players needed a kick in the keister.
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But can’t quite put my finger on it.
 
CuseMan4 said:
I have no problem with this whatsoever. D1 basketball, it’s a business and professional job for these kids. They beat the snow storm and have a quick turnaround. Gotta get the work in. That’s the difference between a top notch program and an average program. No problem with it
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Football often has early practices, too. Not a big deal, IMO.
 
My HS had a football coach who was old school. No full practice film sessions. Practices were full pads, full contact every day of the week. Running sprints was a big part of practice. Fumbles, false starts, etc. in practice were punished with sprints or pushups. Late? Run. Talked back? Run. He had losing seasons like 80%+ of his career.

His replacement did film sessions, walkthrough practices, half pads most of the week, days off here and there. He was playing for a section title year 2.

This idea that dogmatic hard work for the sake of hard work is the path to success is a fun concept for children’s books.

And, to be very clear, this story about Hurley has much more to do with the APPEARANCE of hard work. I would bet a large sum of money that most teams facing late snowfall bumped up their practice time. He did nothing special or noteworthy but it’s being covered like he went above and beyond to get his team in the gym.
 
Brooky03 said:
UConn has a coach committed to cultivating that image. I have seen nothing from that program that indicates they operate fundamentally different from most programs in college basketball. There is no evidence to suggest Hurley is a harder working or more tenacious coach than most. A bigger jerk? Absolutely. Acutely aware of and interested in media attention? Of course.

He didn’t take a ragtag bunch of recruits to championships. The school committed resources and delivered talent. Nobody would argue he’s a bad coach, but his role in it is touted like HE made it happen, when there were a lot of outside factors at play.
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There’s ALWAYS outside factors. Always. It’s why in a SWOT analysis, there’s an “O” and a “T”.

Losers find ways to justify how they’re just like the winners and point to outside factors as the difference. Syracuse has been phenomenal at that recently. It’s why our program is now a loser program. It appears leadership focuses religiously on the “O” and the “T” while ignoring the internal factors we can control or influence. It will remain a loser program if we can’t acknowledge the reasons why the winners are winning - even if we don’t like the personality of the winner. Because it’s the deficiencies in the “S” and “W” that have been and continue to kill us.

If you can’t find any evidence that Hurley is harder working than most - it tells me a lot more about you than it does about Hurley. The evidence exists - you don’t want to admit it.
 
Brooky03 said:
My HS had a football coach who was old school. No full practice film sessions. Practices were full pads, full contact every day of the week. Running sprints was a big part of practice. Fumbles, false starts, etc. in practice were punished with sprints or pushups. Late? Run. Talked back? Run. He had losing seasons like 80%+ of his career.

His replacement did film sessions, walkthrough practices, half pads most of the week, days off here and there. He was playing for a section title year 2.

This idea that dogmatic hard work for the sake of hard work is the path to success is a fun concept for children’s books.

And, to be very clear, this story about Hurley has much more to do with the APPEARANCE of hard work. I would bet a large sum of money that most teams facing late snowfall bumped up their practice time. He did nothing special or noteworthy but it’s being covered like he went above and beyond to get his team in the gym.
Expand...

There’s a reason “work smarter, not harder” is a cliche.

My HS coach was hyper-disciplined, to the point we’d practice the national anthem in preseason. He’d play it from a boom box, we’d have to stand up straight in a line with our helmet under left arm, right arm over heart. It always took a couple of tries with a lap around the field for whatever we screwed up. He never had a losing season and had multiple undefeated ones.

So you have a HS school coach who was old school and lost a lot. I had an old school coach who won a lot. It’s almost like evidence of my observation that people focus on the outward manifestations when inward mentality is what really matters.

So someone saying “Hurley having practices early isn’t what really matters!” is correct. But the bottom line is he’s a winner. Syracuse hasn’t been in a decade. He’s doing something we haven’t in ages.

I’d be interested in your speculation as to how my old school coach might have been different from yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him. Because identifying that correctly tells us both why Hurley has won two championships, and what we need to be looking for in our next coach. A good starting point is acknowledging that Hurley has done something special and noteworthy - he’s won two national championships. That at least gets you past the “There’s nothing special about Hurley!” loser mentality that has infected so many Syracuse fans.
 
Cusefan95 said:
There’s ALWAYS outside factors. Always. It’s why in a SWOT analysis, there’s an “O” and a “T”.

Losers find ways to justify how they’re just like the winners and point to outside factors as the difference. Syracuse has been phenomenal at that recently. It’s why our program is now a loser program. It appears leadership focuses religiously on the “O” and the “T” while ignoring the internal factors we can control or influence. It will remain a loser program if we can’t acknowledge the reasons why the winners are winning - even if we don’t like the personality of the winner. Because it’s the deficiencies in the “S” and “W” that have been and continue to kill us.

If you can’t find any evidence that Hurley is harder working than most - it tells me a lot more about you than it does about Hurley. The evidence exists - you don’t want to admit it.
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What is your obsession with the ‘losers do x, y, z’ stuff? I’m not arguing Syracuse is on the same level as UConn. UConn is better.

Being a ‘loser’ has nothing to do with the analysis of what Hurley is and isn’t. Hurley is a good basketball coach. What he’s not is some kind of visionary or a guy running the show in any significantly different way than a myriad of other successful programs. He didn’t bring an exceptional culture to UConn. He didn’t take mediocre players and make them great. He had great players and won with great players. There is something to be said for that, but I will never understand the idea that we need to study how he does things like he reinvented the wheel.

Back to the topic that kicked all of this off, he moved a practice up to make sure the snow didn’t interfere. That is beyond a non-story and not some evidence of a noteworthy culture or work ethic. It would be the expectation of any good program.
 
Brooky03 said:
What is your obsession with the ‘losers do x, y, z’ stuff? I’m not arguing Syracuse is on the same level as UConn. UConn is better.

Being a ‘loser’ has nothing to do with the analysis of what Hurley is and isn’t. Hurley is a good basketball coach. What he’s not is some kind of visionary or a guy running the show in any significantly different way than a myriad of other successful programs. He didn’t bring a new culture to UConn. He didn’t take mediocre players and make them great. He had great players and won with great players. There is something to be said for that, but I will never understand the idea that we need to study how he does things like he reinvented the wheel.

Back to the topic that kicked all of this off, he moved a practice up to make sure the snow didn’t interfere. That is beyond a non-story and not some evidence of a noteworthy culture or work ethic. It would be the expectation of any good program.
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So the only key to success is having great players. Have that and you can win, don’t have that and you’ll lose.

Which means your old school coach lost because he had bad players, the guy who replaced him had great players, and their different approaches were completely and totally irrelevant? Right? Or you’re oversimplifying to avoid having to give Hurley any credit…I think that’s much closer to the truth.

My “obsession” is with the challenge a lot of Syracuse fans have with giving Hurley any credit. It reflects poorly on you and the others like you. He’s a good coach who does more than just recruit well because he has the resources to, and winning just magically results. Some of his we got into our current situation is a BOT that thought we had the resources and winning was just going to magically happen regardless of how long they let JB stick around or who he was replaced by.

So I repeat my earlier question, which you did a phenomenal job not answering - how do you think my old school coach might have been different than yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him?
 
Cusefan95 said:
So the only key to success is having great players. Have that and you can win, don’t have that and you’ll lose.

Which means your old school coach lost because he had bad players, the guy who replaced him had great players, and their different approaches were completely and totally irrelevant? Right? Or you’re oversimplifying to avoid having to give Hurley any credit…I think that’s much closer to the truth.

My “obsession” is with the challenge a lot of Syracuse fans have with giving Hurley any credit. It reflects poorly on you and the others like you. He’s a good coach who does more than just recruit well because he has the resources to, and winning just magically results. Some of his we got into our current situation is a BOT that thought we had the resources and winning was just going to magically happen regardless of how long they let JB stick around or who he was replaced by.

So I repeat my earlier question, which you did a phenomenal job not answering - how do you think my old school coach might have been different than yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him?
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How would that be the only factor? You need great players and at least a good coach. I’m saying Hurley is a good coach. There are probably 50 good coaches floating around out there in D1.
 
Brooky03 said:
How would that be the only factor? You need great players and at least a good coach. I’m saying Hurley is a good coach. There are probably 50 good coaches floating around out there in D1.
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Since he has one more chip than JB, is JB than only a decent coach if Hurley is only a good coach?

Good job trolling in this thread, though. A for effort.
 

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