Here's one way to deal with an unsatisfactory performance ...

[Newhouser]

How would that be the only factor? You need great players and at least a good coach. I’m saying Hurley is a good coach. There are probably 50 good coaches floating around out there in D1.

I hope we find one of them.

 

[Brooky03]

There’s a reason “work smarter, not harder” is a cliche.

My HS coach was hyper-disciplined, to the point we’d practice the national anthem in preseason. He’d play it from a boom box, we’d have to stand up straight in a line with our helmet under left arm, right arm over heart. It always took a couple of tries with a lap around the field for whatever we screwed up. He never had a losing season and had multiple undefeated ones.

So you have a HS school coach who was old school and lost a lot. I had an old school coach who won a lot. It’s almost like evidence of my observation that people focus on the outward manifestations when inward mentality is what really matters.

So someone saying “Hurley having practices early isn’t what really matters!” is correct. But the bottom line is he’s a winner. Syracuse hasn’t been in a decade. He’s doing something we haven’t in ages.

I’d be interested in your speculation as to how my old school coach might have been different from yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him. Because identifying that correctly tells us both why Hurley has won two championships, and what we need to be looking for in our next coach. A good starting point is acknowledging that Hurley has done something special and noteworthy - he’s won two national championships. That at least gets you past the “There’s nothing special about Hurley!” loser mentality that has infected so many Syracuse fans.

To answer your question about the old school coaches, he was probably good and your teams probably had good/great players.

Is that hard to follow?

 

[Brooky03]

Since he has one more chip than JB, is JB than only a decent coach if Hurley is only a good coach?

Good job trolling in this thread, though. A for effort.

What?

 

[Cusefan95]

This whole discussion is a reminder that humans aren't rational creatures, we're rationalizing one. A lot of fans can't assess anything or anyone they don't like rationally, and just rationalize their hatred of a coach they don't like. Its sad.

Here's why the early practice doesn't matter, and does matter - and why just having an early practice isn't a key to success...but it is part of the keys to success. My hard nosed old school coach created a culture - we were going to be the most disciplined team in the state. We were going to make other teams beat themselves. Making us practice standing for the national anthem was part of that culture. The reason it worked is because the team bought into it. Part of why we bought into it was he was truly committed to it and sold that vision to the team every year; one of my most vivid memories is him running a lap when he screwed something up. I have absolutely no recollection of what it was - but it clearly communicated nobody was above the law. We obviously had good players, there's a minimum level of talent required to win at any level - but sustained success came from an established culture. If some other coach saw that we practiced standing for the national anthem and just started doing it without creating a culture and getting buy-in first - the players would be standing there confused trying to figure out why they were doing something so irrelevant.

I don't know exactly what Hurley's sales pitch was to the team about an early practice was - but them posting about it on social media is an evidence they bought into it. If I had to guess it was something like "Adapt and Overcome" - no matter what challenges get in our way, we'll find a way to achieve our goal. Does them talking about and posting about an early morning practice look stupid to some outside observers? Especially ones who don't understand anything I've posted above? Sure. My high school football team practicing the national anthem was pretty stupid and pointless out of the context of culture as well.

I'm less interested in defending Hurley than in making this point: WHAT THE HELL IS OUR CULTURE!?!?!?!?!? Early in his career JB had a culture of offensive creativity. He transitioned to the 2-3 Zone and defensive focus. At the end it was "CYO Dad coaching his kids"...unshockingly, that wasn't something a whole lot of kids wanted to sign up for, and didn't lead to a lot of wins. I can't even identify a culture on the team now...maybe "at least we show up physically, and sometimes mentally too"?

My greatest hope is we hire a guy to replace Red who so does such a good job establishing a culture that he can do something other fans mock or minimize - like scheduling an early practice to beat a snowstorm and have it work because it reinforces the culture. My greatest fear is we hire a guy who starts scheduling early morning practices to beat a snowstorm because he saw Hurley do it without bothering to create a culture and get team buy-in first.

 

[Cusefan95]

To answer your question about the old school coaches, he was probably good and your teams probably had good/great players.

Is that hard to follow?

You continue to do a phenomenal job not answering the actual question. Its almost like you know you can't do it honestly, so you just won't. The question WAS NOT - why did my old school coach win.
The question WAS: How my old school coach might have been different from yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him. If you want to try to sell the idea that the talent at your school magically and sustainably improved just as the new guy took over - go ahead. But nobody should take that seriously because its obvious nonsense to avoid acknowledging something you really, really, really don't want to.

 

[Jeremy L.]

There is a guy I know who is very successful in the fitness and supplement field. For the last 25+ years, he’s worked out at 4:30am along with a group of 10-12 people. Every single day. The only time he will skip a workout is if he’s in the hospital or has a serious injury that keeps him out.

His motto has always been “I don’t do anything special, I just don’t miss.” The consistency every day at that time allows him to focus all of his energy into each workout, because as he says, nobody is getting up at 4:30 am to talk business or life with him.

Point being, Hurley’s message was probably more about consistency. Snow storm or not, we aren’t missing a practice to throw us off of our momentum and routine. And that consistency breeds success in all aspects in life.

That’s something I really don’t see in this Syracuse basketball program

 

[Brooky03]

You continue to do a phenomenal job not answering the actual question. Its almost like you know you can't do it honestly, so you just won't. The question WAS NOT - why did my old school coach win.
The question WAS: How my old school coach might have been different from yours, and similar to the guy who replaced him. If you want to try to sell the idea that the talent at your school magically and sustainably improved just as the new guy took over - go ahead. But nobody should take that seriously because its obvious nonsense to avoid acknowledging something you really, really, really don't want to.

I don’t know what you want me to acknowledge. Honestly, I don’t.

This thread wanted to give Hurley credit, in a roundabout way, for being a coach who touts hard work and doing things harder and faster and stronger, yada, yada. Aside from him being a salesman who likes to put on a show, I merely pointed out that that style of coaching is not inherently valuable, which I don’t consider a controversial opinion. What that does not mean is that a coach who is supposedly ‘old school’ like that is a good or bad coach. The idea that coach so-and-so is a hard butt who demands accountability and coach so-and-so is successful, therefore being a hard butt is admirable and the reason for coach so-and-so’s success (so should be emulated) is the idea I’m arguing against because I don’t think the logic follows.

 

[donniesyracuse]

This whole discussion is a reminder that humans aren't rational creatures, we're rationalizing one. A lot of fans can't assess anything or anyone they don't like rationally, and just rationalize their hatred of a coach they don't like. Its sad.

Here's why the early practice doesn't matter, and does matter - and why just having an early practice isn't a key to success...but it is part of the keys to success. My hard nosed old school coach created a culture - we were going to be the most disciplined team in the state. We were going to make other teams beat themselves. Making us practice standing for the national anthem was part of that culture. The reason it worked is because the team bought into it. Part of why we bought into it was he was truly committed to it and sold that vision to the team every year; one of my most vivid memories is him running a lap when he screwed something up. I have absolutely no recollection of what it was - but it clearly communicated nobody was above the law. We obviously had good players, there's a minimum level of talent required to win at any level - but sustained success came from an established culture. If some other coach saw that we practiced standing for the national anthem and just started doing it without creating a culture and getting buy-in first - the players would be standing there confused trying to figure out why they were doing something so irrelevant.

I don't know exactly what Hurley's sales pitch was to the team about an early practice was - but them posting about it on social media is an evidence they bought into it. If I had to guess it was something like "Adapt and Overcome" - no matter what challenges get in our way, we'll find a way to achieve our goal. Does them talking about and posting about an early morning practice look stupid to some outside observers? Especially ones who don't understand anything I've posted above? Sure. My high school football team practicing the national anthem was pretty stupid and pointless out of the context of culture as well.

I'm less interested in defending Hurley than in making this point: WHAT THE HELL IS OUR CULTURE!?!?!?!?!? Early in his career JB had a culture of offensive creativity. He transitioned to the 2-3 Zone and defensive focus. At the end it was "CYO Dad coaching his kids"...unshockingly, that wasn't something a whole lot of kids wanted to sign up for, and didn't lead to a lot of wins. I can't even identify a culture on the team now...maybe "at least we show up physically, and sometimes mentally too"?

My greatest hope is we hire a guy to replace Red who so does such a good job establishing a culture that he can do something other fans mock or minimize - like scheduling an early practice to beat a snowstorm and have it work because it reinforces the culture. My greatest fear is we hire a guy who starts scheduling early morning practices to beat a snowstorm because he saw Hurley do it without bothering to create a culture and get team buy-in first.

I hope we get someone who is hard-nosed and locks the gate or something.

 

[AZOrange]

Can't quite put your finger on the keister?

Sounds like someone needs to work on flexibility. More stretching!

 

[RandygoCuse]

Didn’t John Chaney / Temple back in the day routinely have these very early AM practices ?

Yes, I thought of that too when I read this article. He wanted the players to have free time after class to study.