High Tempo/High Energy

[SUFan44]

http://blog.syracuse.com/orangefootball/2012/08/syracuse_university_football_t_152.html

I think this offense would be well served to go no-huddle for extended stretches. There will be some mistakes, but I think with a fifth-year senior at the helm and his knowledge of the offense, accompanied by a center who is by all accounts very smart and knowledgeable. You can debate his size, but there's no question he understands what he should be doing and has a good grasp of what's going on.

Add to that two WRs who are also seniors and know hot routes, etc., this could be a huge weapon. It also takes the "thinking" element out of the equation a little bit. I think Ryan Nassib overthinks things sometimes. And the quicker tempo will allow for him to just focus on the game.

 

[MattyL]

We used an up-tempo offense at times last year, and I recall it worked rather well.

 

[OrangeMojo]

I'd definitely like to see them utilize no-huddle more/some. Especially if the defense is well rested and can handle coming back out quickly if they misfire on a series.

 

[RMH44]

I'd definitely like to see them utilize no-huddle more/some. Especially if the defense is well rested and can handle coming back out quickly if they misfire on a series.

Exactly! I think this year's D will be much better suited to be ready to play after a quick 3 and out than last year's D. Much deeper this go around.

 

[Ozcuse]

I liked the tempo of the offense in the first quarter against USC last year when Ryan was around 11/12 passing. Then Monty decided to stop playing around and we got smushed.

 

[Millhouse]

I liked the tempo of the offense in the first quarter against USC last year when Ryan was around 11/12 passing. Then Monty decided to stop playing around and we got smushed.

we shouldn't get too crazy about a field goal. it was a 12 play FG drive.

 

[PhatOrange]

oops

 

[reedny]

http://blog.syracuse.com/orangefootball/2012/08/syracuse_university_football_t_152.html

I think this offense would be well served to go no-huddle for extended stretches. There will be some mistakes, but I think with a fifth-year senior at the helm and his knowledge of the offense, accompanied by a center who is by all accounts very smart and knowledgeable. You can debate his size, but there's no question he understands what he should be doing and has a good grasp of what's going on.

Add to that two WRs who are also seniors and know hot routes, etc., this could be a huge weapon. It also takes the "thinking" element out of the equation a little bit. I think Ryan Nassib overthinks things sometimes. And the quicker tempo will allow for him to just focus on the game.

This is another good alternative to running smith up the gut (without a hole) into a stacked defense. Using the no-huddle will wear down opposing defenses because they'll have a harder time substituting to keep the box stacked and the DLine fresh.

 

[tep624]

we shouldn't get too crazy about a field goal. it was a 12 play FG drive.

It was the first drive of the game made at the coliseum by a visitor that was a huge underdog, taking the ball inside the USC 10. Even the USC fans I was smothered by at the game were pretty impressed with that drive.

 

[SmilinBob]

It was a very good drive and this year SU has to finish those types of drives with TD's.

If the O-Line can protect Nassib and he doesn't have to do that roll right to the te thing all year the offense should be ok. I'm fine with slow or fast and if this offense can control the tempo either way I'll be thrilled. The fast tempo is good but if you do some 3 and outs and are ahead you're just giving the ball back too quickly but whatever it takes for this team to score, I'm all for...count me in...I'm good to go.

 

[Millhouse]

It was the first drive of the game made at the coliseum by a visitor that was a huge underdog, taking the ball inside the USC 10. Even the USC fans I was smothered by at the game were pretty impressed with that drive.

we're really grasping at straws.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

we're really grasping at straws.

agreed, just score some -ing points and put a respectable offense out there, the offense has stunk for years, how many times can we talk about the WVU game, the pinstripe bowl, a driver versus USC, etc. It's probably 5% at best versus 95% of crap. Geeze

 

[sutomcat]

agreed, just score some -ing points and put a respectable offense out there, the offense has stunk for years, how many times can we talk about the WVU game, the pinstripe bowl, a driver versus USC, etc. It's probably 5% at best versus 95% of crap. Geeze

I agree vast improvement is needed on offense. Glad to hear they are at least practicing a fast tempo.

With Ashton and the things he can bring to the table, a few other playmakers other there on offense and the introduction of a fast tempo, it could be a little harder to defend against Syracuse this year. The good old days of 8 or 9 men in the box and only having to worry about 1 or 2 receivers on passing downs will hopefully be gone forever.

 

[Millhouse]

I agree vast improvement is needed on offense. Glad to hear they are at least practicing a fast tempo.

With Ashton and the things he can bring to the table, a few other playmakers other there on offense and the introduction of a fast tempo, it could be a little harder to defend against Syracuse this year. The good old days of 8 or 9 men in the box and only having to worry about 1 or 2 receivers on passing downs will hopefully be gone forever.

how much do you think it hurts the defense to go at a faster tempo?
last year
Offense 5.13 yards per play 814 plays.
Defense 5.45 yards per play 851 plays.

This is just for the sake of example

Let's assume that going up tempo means our offense is 5% better per play and we get 5% more plays.
Let's also assume that the opposing offense is 5% better in yards per play and number of plays.

You'd think that's a wash, right?

It's not. We're actually 47 yards worse off. Over the season, that's not much, I know that. But it's still worse off.

Do we have good reason to think that going up tempo helps our offense more than it hurts our defense?

 

[GoSU96]

how much do you think it hurts the defense to go at a faster tempo?
last year
Offense 5.13 yards per play 814 plays.
Defense 5.45 yards per play 851 plays.

This is just for the sake of example

Let's assume that going up tempo means our offense is 5% better per play and we get 5% more plays.
Let's also assume that the opposing offense is 5% better in yards per play and number of plays.

You'd think that's a wash, right?

It's not. We're actually 47 yards worse off. Over the season, that's not much, I know that. But it's still worse off.

Do we have good reason to think that going up tempo helps our offense more than it hurts our defense?

It only hurts if the defense can't get off the field on 3rd down and the defense doesn't have much depth. Hopefully those issues are improved this year. If not, they aren't going to go uptempo all that much, unless it is highly productive.

 

[anglerman]

how much do you think it hurts the defense to go at a faster tempo?
last year
Offense 5.13 yards per play 814 plays.
Defense 5.45 yards per play 851 plays.

This is just for the sake of example

Let's assume that going up tempo means our offense is 5% better per play and we get 5% more plays.
Let's also assume that the opposing offense is 5% better in yards per play and number of plays.

You'd think that's a wash, right?

It's not. We're actually 47 yards worse off. Over the season, that's not much, I know that. But it's still worse off.

Do we have good reason to think that going up tempo helps our offense more than it hurts our defense?

We have no idea they haven't played yet this year.

 

[Toga]

To me there are kind of two versions of quick tempo, both of which are no huddle. One involves getting plays off quickly while the other gets to the line quickly but uses most of the play clock while the QB surveys the situation. This at least allows you to keep the defense from getting in their desired package.

 

[Millhouse]

It only hurts if the defense can't get off the field on 3rd down and the defense doesn't have much depth. Hopefully those issues are improved this year. If not, they aren't going to go uptempo all that much, unless it is highly productive.

i don't think there's anything magical about third down. the way you get off the field better on third down is to just be better.

we actually converted more 3rd downs in conference than the defense allowed last year which is surprising. we weren't bad in either category in conference (thank you cfbstats.com)

which probably just goes back to big plays

 

[JoeSU]

If nothing else, an up-tempo offense should cut down on the maddening delay of game penalties when we try to shuffle-in players and plays from the coaching booth, through the sideline. It's success will rely on Nassib being able to make the right audibles at the LoS, and I have a lot of confidence in his ability to do this at this point in his career. And as Toga points out, it prevents the opposing D from making situational substitutions. All of these translate into increasing our big play potential.

 

[SUFan44]

how much do you think it hurts the defense to go at a faster tempo?
last year
Offense 5.13 yards per play 814 plays.
Defense 5.45 yards per play 851 plays.

This is just for the sake of example

Let's assume that going up tempo means our offense is 5% better per play and we get 5% more plays.
Let's also assume that the opposing offense is 5% better in yards per play and number of plays.

You'd think that's a wash, right?

It's not. We're actually 47 yards worse off. Over the season, that's not much, I know that. But it's still worse off.

Do we have good reason to think that going up tempo helps our offense more than it hurts our defense?

I also think depth is something that works to our advantage on D. If we do have 3 and outs with higher tempo offense, our depth on defense should (hypothetically speaking) be able to overcome at least part of the disadvantage.

I don't see a huge dropoff between our first unit and our second unit anywhere on D, except LB. And even then, we do have a couple of serviceable players.

 

[Scooch]

how much do you think it hurts the defense to go at a faster tempo?
last year
Offense 5.13 yards per play 814 plays.
Defense 5.45 yards per play 851 plays.

This is just for the sake of example

Let's assume that going up tempo means our offense is 5% better per play and we get 5% more plays.
Let's also assume that the opposing offense is 5% better in yards per play and number of plays.

You'd think that's a wash, right?

It's not. We're actually 47 yards worse off. Over the season, that's not much, I know that. But it's still worse off.

Do we have good reason to think that going up tempo helps our offense more than it hurts our defense?

Why would we assume the D is worse if the O plays faster?

 

[Millhouse]

Why would we assume the D is worse if the O plays faster?

fatigue (more plays, less time on the sideline).

and the worse your offense is bad to begin with (our situation), the more likely some 3 and outs get strung together. the worse the offense is the more likely it harms the defense as much if not more than it helps the offenses

i don't see many high speed offenses with really strong defenses. northwestern, oregon and baylor figure it helps their offense more than it hurts their defense. NW and baylor's defense was especially bad, oregon was pretty good regardless. maybe they'd have stunk anyway.

how many offenses that would otherwise be bad go no huddle?

 

[Scooch]

fatigue (more plays, less time on the sideline).

and the worse your offense is bad to begin with (our situation), the more likely some 3 and outs get strung together. the worse the offense is the more likely it harms the defense as much if not more than it helps the offenses

i don't see many high speed offenses with really strong defenses. northwestern, oregon and baylor figure it helps their offense more than it hurts their defense. NW and baylor's defense was especially bad, oregon was pretty good regardless. maybe they'd have stunk anyway.

how many offenses that would otherwise be bad go no huddle?

That's the conventional wisdom, but I've never seen it proven out. Guess that was my point. If we're in a thread that is contesting the notion that all offenses are better playing fast, I'll contest that all defenses must be worse if the O plays fast.

Personally I think "fatigue" is overrated as a cause of poor D. Maybe on the DL. But if your back 7 can't handle another, what, 10 plays a game?... I think you need a new S&C regime.

 

[javadoc]

how many offenses that would otherwise be bad go no huddle?

Good point. If you do have an offense that can score reliably, a fast tempo puts the opponent in a hole early, which can change the way they play offense and make it easier for your D to attack.

 

[Chip]

That's the conventional wisdom, but I've never seen it proven out. Guess that was my point. If we're in a thread that is contesting the notion that all offenses are better playing fast, I'll contest that all defenses must be worse if the O plays fast.

Personally I think "fatigue" is overrated as a cause of poor D. Maybe on the DL. But if your back 7 can't handle another, what, 10 plays a game?... I think you need a new S&C regime.

Generally agree. If your D comes off the field after a 14 play drive (probably moreso if the opponent scored on that drive), the offense going right to hurry up on the ensuing drive could be dangerous. One dropped pass on 3rd down and the D heads back out there, gets tough to expect much if you don't have 8 available DL, and some spare parts elsewhere on the defense.

But if the D is getting off the field after a normal drive (giving up 14 play drives isn't the norm), they should be fine going back out there. A regular huddling 3 and out gives them a few more breaths, but it's not like a halftime rest.

Increased depth is helpful either way. Seems like we have more of that this year. So let's play faster on O if we think that's what our players would be more comfortable with.