I finally got around to reading Bleeding Orange

[Frozen]

Thoughts:

<It's been mentioned before, but I am shocked that JB and Bernie were not friends off the court, especially when you consider that they lived so close to each other and have worked together for so long.

<One passage that really confused me was on page 237, regarding the recruitment of Andy Rautins. JB writes:

"When we visited with Andy, I told him there was no guarantee he would make it. Despite his obvious shooting ability, I saw a low D1 prospect, not a Big East player. Providence had recruited him a little bit, but it was mostly schools like Siena and Niagara. But Andy wanted to come, so we gave him a scholarship. "

Why would JB offer a scholarship if he did not think AR was a high-major talent? The part about "but Andy wanted to come" is very odd to me. Just a confusing bit of writing there.

<The lady who gave a lot of money to help build the Melo Center -- I think her name was Joy Hargenstein -- was very heartwarming. Good to see our fans contribute money to help the program, and to see JB show his appreciation.

 

[bozophobe]

Yeah. Boeheim did make a fairly emphatic statement in which he didn't (at that point in time) consider anybody to be a close friend of his who doesn't live in Lyons, New York. That may have been aimed at all the sportscasters and journalists who are always saying what great friends he is with (insert any coach's name) just because they ate together a couple of times at an Italian restaurant somewhere. In general, he clarified the difference between close friends and close professional colleagues.

And that whole era (the few years leading up to the 2003 championship) has long intrigued me. Did Boeheim himself inform Fine of the vacancy on his street, or was it someone else? Around that time, Fine had been promoted to Associate Head Coach, but the distribution of coaching duties felt off, somehow, in hindsight. Boeheim didn't elaborate on this or many other things, which is understandable given the length of his career (and then-extremely fresh controversy), and how long the book would have to be.

Regarding Andy, wasn't this a time where S.U. needed to keep up the team's overall academic performance? Not saying that's the case, and I have no clue what Andy's grades were in school. Maybe it was just a loyalty to Leo thing. The team would have had plenty of scholarship players, anyway, and Boeheim wasn't averse to adding a project player now and then.

 

[realorange]

<The lady who gave a lot of money to help build the Melo Center -- I think her name was Joy Hargenstein -- was very heartwarming. Good to see our fans contribute money to help the program, and to see JB show his appreciation.

Our own CTO

 

[OttoMets]

Thoughts:

<It's been mentioned before, but I am shocked that JB and Bernie were not friends off the court, especially when you consider that they lived so close to each other and have worked together for so long.

...

Why would JB offer a scholarship if he did not think AR was a high-major talent? The part about "but Andy wanted to come" is very odd to me. Just a confusing bit of writing there.

...

1.) Loved the book, but there were some obvious instances in which Boeheim was playing defense against criticism (Bernie and especially NCAA sanctions). Those passages were a little clumsy.
2.) Boeheim says things. Boeheim's a loyal guy who will do a favor, and Andy wasn't a sure thing, but he's not deliberately offering scholarships to people who aren't Big East players. Just a little more hyperbole on his part.

 

[joct]

1.) Loved the book, but there were some obvious instances in which Boeheim was playing defense against criticism (Bernie and especially NCAA sanctions). Those passages were a little clumsy.
2.) Boeheim says things. Boeheim's a loyal guy who will do a favor, and Andy wasn't a sure thing, but he's not deliberately offering scholarships to people who aren't Big East players. Just a little more hyperbole on his part.

If I remember, Leo was quoted around that time, as saying he told JB "if you don't think he's good enough, don't take him. Only take him if you think he is good enough. Don't just take him as a legacy. JB then confirmed he was a legit recruit". I think it was something like that.

I'm thinking this passage in the book was JB trying to praise Andy by saying how hard he worked, and how much he improved over the years to become the player he was. That's the story I think he was trying to tell, so I think he overdid the low-grade recruit angle, so I think that came across a little awkward. There's been a few other recruits he's taken over the years that weren't flooded with high-end offers, he trusts his own judgement.

 

[OttoMets]

If I remember, Leo was quoted around that time, as saying he told JB "if you don't think he's good enough, don't take him. Only take him if you think he is good enough. Don't just take him as a legacy. JB then confirmed he was a legit recruit". I think it was something like that.

I'm thinking this passage in the book was JB trying to praise Andy by saying how hard he worked, and how much he improved over the years to become the player he was. That's the story I think he was trying to tell, so I think he overdid the low-grade recruit angle, so I think that came across a little awkward. There's been a few other recruits he's taken over the years that weren't flooded with high-end offers, he trusts his own judgement.

Bingo. When Boeheim's driving at a point, often a positive point, he sometimes (often) takes creative license to set it up.

 

[stuckinbig11]

When reading the book, you have to dig deeply into JB's psyche to fathom his intentions for making various statements. I doubt that they are just random thoughts.

 

[suttree]

<The lady who gave a lot of money to help build the Melo Center -- I think her name was Joy Hargenstein -- was very heartwarming. Good to see our fans contribute money to help the program, and to see JB show his appreciation.

Our own CTO

Maybe if she's been put in the witness protection program.

 

[NorSyr66]

Ironically I just finished this book about a month ago. Not many surprises but also found it very interesting to see that our CTO Joyce was the initial donor for the Melo Center.

 

[realorange]

Maybe if she's been put in the witness protection program.

Frozen may be getting like me trying to remember names.

 

[cuseinseattle]

If I remember, Leo was quoted around that time, as saying he told JB "if you don't think he's good enough, don't take him. Only take him if you think he is good enough. Don't just take him as a legacy. JB then confirmed he was a legit recruit". I think it was something like that.

I'm thinking this passage in the book was JB trying to praise Andy by saying how hard he worked, and how much he improved over the years to become the player he was. That's the story I think he was trying to tell, so I think he overdid the low-grade recruit angle, so I think that came across a little awkward. There's been a few other recruits he's taken over the years that weren't flooded with high-end offers, he trusts his own judgement.

I agree. That was the point. To show what a hardworking kid Andy was.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I'm glad Boeheim did it. I was at a coach clinic in Seattle in the 90's and Boeheim was there and we talked after he spoke. I asked him if he would write a book as I would love to read it and he said something along the lines of when people write these books it's because of their ego and they never say much or something along those lines. I'm glad he reconsidered. I read it when it first came out and should read it again.