i think I can talk myself into giving Shafer more time

[TheCusian]

Maybe this guy has some eligibility left...

Dungey is going to be the guy.

 

[K Otto XLIV]

It's a crap shoot, but it's the time of year for optimism. Plus I like some of the things I'm hearing:

1. the players like the new system and are comfortable running it;
2. the new system's installed and being worked on .. as opposed to being "spoon fed" over time (death knell);
3. I'm hearing the staff mention "west coast", which I understood to mean short passing (TE's) and ball control, using a variety of receivers (WR's, TE's and backfield). This has the advantage of getting the H-back position involved and (short passes) doesn't require a super-accurate QB (which we don't have).
4. I'm also hearing "option", which again, seems to fit our personnel. We have a mobile QB who can read and then run or pitch. Both of these offensive philosophies take advantage of having an experienced QB, and limited time in the pocket;
5. And I'm hearing that the staff is going to "pound the rock" (per SS). This takes advantage of one of the more experienced OL's we've had in recent memory.

We won't know until we see it.

3. I hear West Coast and I think timing and accuracy. Those don't describe Hunt. We hear how the HB is Austinesque yet most of the passes WV threw to Austin were at the LOS. We have been told those bubble screens were taken out of the playbook.

4. I think we can run the zone read with success. What I don't want to see is Hunt running down the LOS trying to go around the D. That isn't the type of runner he is. Based on Elmhurst and the end of last year, that is what Lester is looking to do.

5. I really think we needed this last year. For whatever reason we never tried to pound the ball under Lester last season. We did it against FSU and had our best O game by far. He rode PTG that game. The rest of the year seemed like Lester was trying to outsmart himself.

 

[Briancuse]

it should be obvious that this is total speculation but there's my disclaimer

marrone was a miserable guy who hated recruiting and probably belly ached a lot about how hard it was. shafer might've believed everything marrone said about it, why wouldn't he?

so he hires mcdonald as a hail mary recruiting whiz. obviously a mistake.

so whether or not lester is the right guy at offensive coordinator, shafer can at least tell coyle that he knows the type of offense he wants to run multiple pro-style hybrid blah blah and that his original mistake is not one that will be repeated. you fire a guy for errors that will keep happening

this year might stink because of the defense but you'd have to be stupid if that's the reason you fire shafer. we're going to have down years on defense once in a while, they're the exception

coyle likes multiple offenses, maybe he doesn't need to see that much this year. 5 wins, a competently crappy offense that isn't unusual in its crappiness. shafer can make mcdonald (and marrone) the fall guys and it's somewhat believable

90% of coaches are miserable guys. This year is the make of break year for me, back-back losing seasons aren't acceptable for me. I am tired of going into a season hoping for 7 wins, I miss the days when we were ranked, and competing for conference titles.

 

[reedny]

We won't know until we see it.

3. I hear West Coast and I think timing and accuracy. Those don't describe Hunt. We hear how the HB is Austinesque yet most of the passes WV threw to Austin were at the LOS. We have been told those bubble screens were taken out of the playbook.

4. I think we can run the zone read with success. What I don't want to see is Hunt running down the LOS trying to go around the D. That isn't the type of runner he is. Based on Elmhurst and the end of last year, that is what Lester is looking to do.

5. I really think we needed this last year. For whatever reason we never tried to pound the ball under Lester last season. We did it against FSU and had our best O game by far. He rode PTG that game. The rest of the year seemed like Lester was trying to outsmart himself.

3. True, WC is timing, but short passes are harder to defend and don't require the OL to hold off the rush for 4-5 seconds. I don't see Hunt throwing down the sideline like last year (ala Austin). Instead, I think the coaches would like to get the ball to Parris and Moore (or maybe to the H-back) on short routes. TE's certainly fit that concept, and it's preferable to have bigger guys catching the ball in traffic. If the D'ers play up, we finally have wide-outs (Ishmael/Estime) who can stretch the field and make them pay.
4. Agree ... Hunt is good at exploiting angles, not beating a LB to the edge. Since we can't afford him to be injured, and he's decent at zone-read (option), I would like to see some pitches to either the slot or the RB. We have some talent and versatility at the slot this year ... I'm optimistic that Hunt can pitch the ball to Estime in space or even pass down field out of it.
5. Sure. Our OL is loaded with experience. So the run game has to be part of the mix, but we need to have creditable option and passing games to keep the Defenses from stacking the box.

 

[Chip]

I don't buy that the budget is an issue. On paper Marrone's staff was a lot more experienced and thus should have commanded higher salaries. So with a Big East budget Marrone could get guys here but Shafer with an ACC budget could not? That doesn't make much sense.

Marrone sb > Shafer
McDonald sb > Hackett
Shafer sb > Bullough
Anselmo sb > Lester
Wheatley sb = Smith
Moore sb > Acosta
Adkins sb > Adam
Daoust (Shafer) sb > Daoust (Marrone)
Morrison sb = Lea
Henderson sb > Reed

So that is 6 guys who sb higher on Marrone's staff, 2 guys who sb higher on Shafer's staff, and 2 guys who should be even. So we sb spending less despite having what sb a larger budget.

I get that, but analysis aside, who knows what Gross told him? I agree it's a longshot that the guy who spends millions on tennis coaches kept the football OC budget close to the vest.

But if you're Coyle, you want to know the whole story. And if that story tells you Shafer could have spent more on an experienced guy, but stuck with an inexperienced Lester to follow up an inexperienced disaster of McDonald, then Lester's (and Shafer's) leash for struggles won't be all that long.

 

[Chip]

all depends on what coyle expects from the offense. they could improve a lot and still be awful. will coyle credit the improvement or will he just say, sorry, you're still awful

I do think he'll give Lester a fresh look and will chalk up 2014 as a disaster for a variety of reasons.

He has 3 OL that are 5th year seniors with plenty of experience. He has another OL whose a 4th year junior with considerable experience. I don't know what to think about this walkon thing, so I'll just talk about 80% of the OL. Philips, Estime, Ishmael, all young, but have experience and I think their talent compares well to the large middle of the pack of ACC teams. RBs should be good enough. QB is a 5th year senior.

I think his expectations might be higher than people think given all of that. If you believe that the end of last year was due to an awkward OC transition combined with an unusually high number of injuries, then you should expect considerable improvement this year.

 

[TheCusian]

I do think he'll give Lester a fresh look and will chalk up 2014 as a disaster for a variety of reasons. He has 3 OL that are 5th year seniors with plenty of experience. He has another OL whose a 4th year junior with considerable experience. I don't know what to think about this walkon thing, so I'll just talk about 80% of the OL. Philips, Estime, Ishmael, all young, but have experience and I think their talent compares well to the large middle of the pack of ACC teams. RBs should be good enough. QB is a 5th year senior. I think his expectations might be higher than people think given all of that. If you believe that the end of last year was due to an awkward OC transition combined with an unusually high number of injuries, then you should expect considerable improvement this year.

Yep. That's exactly why I have high hopes.

 

[Jeepers]

90% of coaches are miserable guys. This year is the make of break year for me, back-back losing seasons aren't acceptable for me. I am tired of going into a season hoping for 7 wins, I miss the days when we were ranked, and competing for conference titles.

I hear ya. If we don't get at least 5 wins this year, I think I'm done. It's a bit different mentality with a new AD, so I'm willing to take a risk on a change sooner.

If we struggle against RI and have another breakdown (like Hunt did last year in the opener) I'm gonna lose it.

 

[Full_Rebar]

The fall guy should be Gross. His wasteful spending pushed the timeline of a true IPF back 5 years (after his promise to Marrone) and is what ultimately hurt recruiting more than sour-puss St. Doug. He didn't like recruiting, but he didn't get in the way when it came to his staff on the road (remember he's the same guy who trusted Shafer's calls on Shamarko, Sharpe, Eskridge, P. Thomas, etc).

If we had an AD who realized money needed to be spent on football and not hiring his own personal tennis pro at 300k per year, maybe we'd be looking at a little more talent on the roster.

 

[SUFaninNJ]

IMO, if you've already got an exit strategy as a fan in place based on the team's won/loss record this year, you might as well just save yourself the time and potential heartache and get out now. The rest of us will push through without you. I hear Rutgers welcomes fans to hop on their bandwagon. According to their coach they're NY's real college team anyway.

 

[Millhouse]

IMO, if you've already got an exit strategy as a fan in place based on the team's won/loss record this year, you might as well just save yourself the time and potential heartache and get out now. The rest of us will push through without you. I hear Rutgers welcomes fans to hop on their bandwagon. According to their coach they're NY's real college team anyway.

Huh?

 

[reedny]

I do think he'll give Lester a fresh look and will chalk up 2014 as a disaster for a variety of reasons.

He has 3 OL that are 5th year seniors with plenty of experience. He has another OL whose a 4th year junior with considerable experience. I don't know what to think about this walkon thing, so I'll just talk about 80% of the OL. Philips, Estime, Ishmael, all young, but have experience and I think their talent compares well to the large middle of the pack of ACC teams. RBs should be good enough. QB is a 5th year senior.

I think his expectations might be higher than people think given all of that. If you believe that the end of last year was due to an awkward OC transition combined with an unusually high number of injuries, then you should expect considerable improvement this year.

I'm expecting considerable improvement from the offense, and as a result, close to the same performance by a much younger D (that will be on the field a lot less).

 

[Jake]

Every year we fret over the defensive losses and every year we end up being decent since shafer arrived.

I'm not that concerned. It would help the defense if the offense could stay on the field.

 

[SUFaninNJ]

Huh?

Not you. A couple of posters noted that they are ready to jump ship as a fan if the team doesn't win x amount of games this year. I'm totally onboard with you, Millhouse!

 

[orangenauburn]

I just drank a thirty rack of Miller Lite Orange Kool-Aid:

Offense is Top 40 this year and D remains top 50

9-4 and we finally develop an Offensive identity

... and go ...

 

[K Otto XLIV]

Every year we fret over the defensive losses and every year we end up being decent since shafer arrived.

I'm not that concerned. It would help the defense if the offense could stay on the field.

I think people overrate our D anyway. We have been pretty much middle of the pack statistically vs our conference peers the last 6 years. IMO 2011 and 2012 were sub par Ds. I also think that the last 2 years we have struggled to start the year. Overall last year's D was our best. So there likely would be a drop in production. IMO our D this year will come down to the secondary. Thankfully we start off with a light schedule so the D should be up to the task by conference play when we need them.

2014- we were good vs the run, preventing long passes and runs, getting off the field on 3rd down, and preventing TDs once in the redzone. We were bad vs the pass and getting pressure on the QB.

PPG middle 1/3 of ACC
YPG middle 1/3
QBR bottom 1/3
20P 1st
YPC top 1/3
20R top 1/3
Sacks bottom 1/3
TFL middle 1/3
TOs middle 1/3
RZTD top 1/3
3D top 1/3


2013- we were good at getting to the QB and preventing long pass plays. We were bad vs the run and at preventing TDs in the redzone.

PPG middle 1/3 of ACC
YPG middle 1/3
QBR middle 1/3
20P top 1/3
YPC bottom 1/3
20R middle 1/3
Sacks top 1/3
TFL middle 1/3
TOs middle 1/3
RZTD bottom 1/3
3D middle 1/3

2012- we were good at preventing long runs, TFL, and creating TOs. We were bad against both the pass and run (strangely cuz of TFL), as well as giving up long pass plays and at getting to the QB.

PPG middle 1/3 of Big East
YPG middle 1/3
QBR bottom 1/3
2oP bottom 1/3
YPC bottom 1/3
20R top 1/3
Sacks Last
TFL top 1/3
TOs top 1/3
RZTD middle 1/3
3D middle 1/3

2011- we were good at preventing long pass plays and at preventing TDs in the redzone. We were bad vs the pass and had trouble getting off the field on 3rd down.

PPG middle 1/3 of Big East
YPG middle 1/3
QBR bottom 1/3
20P 1st
YPC middle 1/3
20R middle 1/3
Sacks middle 1/3
TFL middle 1/3
TOs middle 1/3
RZTD 1st
3D bottom 1/3

2010- we were good at preventing long pass plays. We were bad at TFL and at giving up long runs.

PPG middle 1/3 of Big East
YPG middle 1/3
QBR middle 1/3
20P top 1/3
YPC middle 1/3
20R bottom 1/3
Sacks middle 1/3
TFL tied for last
TOs middle 1/3
RZTD middle 1/3
3D middle 1/3

2009- we were good overall in yards, vs the run, and getting to the QB. We were bad at giving up points, against the pass, at creating TOs, and preventing TDs in the redzone.

PPG last in Big East
YPG top 1/3
QBR bottom 1/3
YPC 1st
Sacks top 1/3
TFL middle 1/3
TOs bottom 1/3
RZTD bottom 1/3
3D middle 1/3

 

[Jeepers]

Not you. A couple of posters noted that they are ready to jump ship as a fan if the team doesn't win x amount of games this year. I'm totally onboard with you, Millhouse!

We're talking about the coaching, not the team. Geez.

 

[Millhouse]

Every year we fret over the defensive losses and every year we end up being decent since shafer arrived. I'm not that concerned. It would help the defense if the offense could stay on the field.

This year is the right year to fret. I always fret about offense. I'm worried about a 2002 replay

 

[brandokc]

Coyle stated that he listens to his coaches in order to provide what they need to succeed. If HCSS sold a bill of goods that proves out he will be given more support. If it doesn't he gave Coyle the rope to hang him with.

If there is improvement and HCSS asks for more money to hire a better position coach/coaches then he will get it.
If we stagnate then Coyle will start looking at the list he had stuffed in his blazer when he gave his welcome speech.

Let's all pull for HCSS as he is a good man and making an honest effort to produce not only good football but good men.
If the team doesn't perform, then thank your lucky stars that there is a new sheriff in town.

 

[kcsu]

Coyle is as good an AD as could ever been hired for our program at this point. He is not ego driven and i truly believe he understands his role which as a good CEO is to provide direction and resources to his managers. This guy is already made he doesnt need to put is mark on anything by hiring his guy. If Shafer gets it done i believe that Coyle will be thrilled. Shafer is an exceptional D coach i dont think that anyone can argue that. He has shown that he can recruit. He runs a clean program and the players and those around him seem to truly like and respect him. If he can pull the O together i believe that he is going to be here for a very long time and i hope so. If he fails it will not be because of Coyle wanting his own guy. Im really pulling for him and expect 6 wins and a bowl and extension this year

 

[OttoinGrotto]

We have a mobile QB who can read and then run or pitch..

I think that's to be determined. Hasn't been a whole lot of "read" on the field with Hunt at the helm. At least I hope not, otherwise he's really, really bad at making reads.

 

[KellySyracuse]

Football...FRIDAY!!!!

Please let the football gods rain down on SU this year. My heart isn't ready for a repeat of 2014

 

[TheCusian]

I think that's to be determined. Hasn't been a whole lot of "read" on the field with Hunt at the helm. At least I hope not, otherwise he's really, really bad at making reads.

He ran the zone read down Marylands throat last year. Read the coverage? Yep. Running? No worries.

 

[zjscuse]

Don't really know where to post this ... Haven't posted anything in a really really long time .. But with all that said just wanna thank you guys for how awesome most of you are with your passion and insight into the program .. My daily routine as soon as I wakeup till I got o bed is first syracusefan. Com then nunesmagician. Finally the asylum aka Syracuse. Com every single day I avidly read your posts and enjoy almost every single one of them .. What I don't enjoy is the negative posts that are were at world's end . yes the Robert Washington decommit really sucked but I mean come on guys how can you recruit a minor and not at all talk to his parents (even if there a coach or not) I know for a damn fact that if my son was going to any college for a sport I would want to be in contact with the staff no matter what. George McDonald was trying to run an offense that fit square pegs into a round whole . are roster (from marrone, hackett) was built for a west coast run north , south football. If your running the gun read option you have to have a team that is crazy discipline. It's just to much complication for just ANY team to run and I think that most people don't understand that . watching that Rutgers vs nc bowl game last year made me realize if you don't have the right personnel and discipline .. How stupid of a strategy that offense is. nc looked like a confused team, I don't know much about there program but I could see that they were trying to run a lot of those complicated plays and it made me realize if your not a team like Georgia tech that has recruited for that offense over many season and have crazy discipline in that offense, its just honestly a crap shoot . I have a lot of optimism about this season and its mostly because we are going to run an offense similar to what we excell at. I love coach Shafer, he's just such a great guy and has so much passion. I really really want to see him have a dynasty at this school. As I will say I am prolly the youngest poster on this board (21) but I pledge to continue the honor and try my best to spread the loyalty and enthusiasm this program deserves .. GO CUSE!!!! (side note) All I know for sure is that are basketball program has the best fan base and that's because us new yorkers are stubborn and expect to win all the time if we can get back to consistency (like iv said a million times)us fans could once again. Become a formidable Allie as the 12th man. Iv watched some of those games from the 80's and 90's and the atmosphere those videos show are insane!! I dream of a day like that again!! but it will only happen with consistency which IS achievable.. Im a lil worried how young are defense is but we have the talent there. If we can atleast have a middle of the pack offense this season we will see a bowl

 

[Alsacs]

IMO, if you've already got an exit strategy as a fan in place based on the team's won/loss record this year, you might as well just save yourself the time and potential heartache and get out now. The rest of us will push through without you. I hear Rutgers welcomes fans to hop on their bandwagon. According to their coach they're NY's real college team anyway.

Let's give SS a lifetime contract based on this. Nobody who is a fan has an exit strategy on the program. SS is 10-15 he has to get closer to .500 as he was hired to continue momentum from 23-23 and not to go backwards. Please don't try saying criticism of SS is abandonment of being an SU fan.