if it's good enough for gary patterson, it's good enough for us

[Millhouse]

does the run and stop the run crowd stop to notice that even gary patterson, the all time wet dream defense first coach, has embraced up tempo wide open passing?
------------
"With no bowl game on the horizon, Patterson immediately went about overhauling his offensive coaching staff, beginning with demotions for co-offensive coordinators Jarrett Anderson (now the offensive line coach) and Rusty Burns (now in charge of outside receivers). For their replacements, Patterson looked to a pair of in-state rivals for assistants with roots in the Air Raid: Doug Meacham, who had just spent his first season as the primary play-caller at Houston after eight years on Mike Gundy’s staff at Oklahoma State, and Sonny Cumbie, a Texas Tech assistant who, as the Red Raiders’ starting quarterback in 2004, had engineered a 70-35 blowout over Patterson’s team. In the spring, TCU recruited Johnny Manziel’s former backup at Texas A&M, Matt Joeckel, who had two years under his belt in an Air Raid system and would be eligible to play immediately as a graduate transfer. Patterson, the old defensive hand, was all in on a system that placed little or no value on establishing the run, winning time of possession, or occasionally easing up on the throttle for the sake of the defense."
-------------
http://grantland.com/the-triangle/t...olution-gary-patterson-trevone-boykin-big-12/

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Hey, listen, some of us like being miles behind the rest of what everyone else is doing that's working, thank you very much.

 

[TheCusian]

does the run and stop the run crowd stop to notice that even gary patterson, the all time wet dream defense first coach, has embraced up tempo wide open passing? ------------ "With no bowl game on the horizon, Patterson immediately went about overhauling his offensive coaching staff, beginning with demotions for co-offensive coordinators Jarrett Anderson (now the offensive line coach) and Rusty Burns (now in charge of outside receivers). For their replacements, Patterson looked to a pair of in-state rivals for assistants with roots in the Air Raid: Doug Meacham, who had just spent his first season as the primary play-caller at Houston after eight years on Mike Gundy’s staff at Oklahoma State, and Sonny Cumbie, a Texas Tech assistant who, as the Red Raiders’ starting quarterback in 2004, had engineered a 70-35 blowout over Patterson’s team. In the spring, TCU recruited Johnny Manziel’s former backup at Texas A&M, Matt Joeckel, who had two years under his belt in an Air Raid system and would be eligible to play immediately as a graduate transfer. Patterson, the old defensive hand, was all in on a system that placed little or no value on establishing the run, winning time of possession, or occasionally easing up on the throttle for the sake of the defense." ------------- http://grantland.com/the-triangle/t...olution-gary-patterson-trevone-boykin-big-12/

I think the crowd you speak of is like 2-3 posters deep...

And I'm not one of them. I want what works, with the recruits we can get.

 

[suloyalfan]

I think the crowd you speak of is like 2-3 posters deep...

And I'm not one of them. I want what works, with the recruits we can get.

Agreed. I am also not one of them and just want what works with the players we have.

Regardless of what we want to call it, what works is a solid offensive line (which we have - though injuries may derail that down the stretch), talent at RB (which we have with really 5 good RBs), talent at QB (which we're still not sure about), talent at WR (which it seems we have to some degree), and a play caller to utilize them (which we're not sure of).

Last time we had those things (2012 with senior year Nassib and company) we average 30.2 ppg. Last year without those ingredients, and again this year, we've average about 20 ppg.

 

[Millhouse]

Agreed. I am also not one of them and just want what works with the players we have.

Regardless of what we want to call it, what works is a solid offensive line (which we have - though injuries may derail that down the stretch), talent at RB (which we have with really 5 good RBs), talent at QB (which we're still not sure about), talent at WR (which it seems we have to some degree), and a play caller to utilize them (which we're not sure of).

Last time we had those things (2012 with senior year Nassib and company) we average 30.2 ppg. Last year without those ingredients, and again this year, we've average about 20 ppg.

why did patterson change his offense then?

 

[Orangello]

why did patterson change his offense then?

Baylor, Okie State, Texas Tech, and West Virginia

 

[Millhouse]

Baylor, Okie State, Texas Tech, and West Virginia

if everyone in the conference runs a similar offense, you don't have as much to lose practicing against your own offense

dregs like kansas should try to be stanford or GT, run something teams will have no idea how to mimic.

 

[SoBristol]

I would be all for an aerial circus -- when we have a very capable QB and some speedy receivers to fit the scheme. Might also help to have interior linemen who can block for screens.

There is dreaming (wish we had a better pass-first offense) and there is the reality (we better try to mix a lot of PTG and AAM to keep defenses honest or Long will get killed).

 

[OrangePA]

does the run and stop the run crowd stop to notice that even gary patterson, the all time wet dream defense first coach, has embraced up tempo wide open passing?
------------
"With no bowl game on the horizon, Patterson immediately went about overhauling his offensive coaching staff, beginning with demotions for co-offensive coordinators Jarrett Anderson (now the offensive line coach) and Rusty Burns (now in charge of outside receivers). For their replacements, Patterson looked to a pair of in-state rivals for assistants with roots in the Air Raid: Doug Meacham, who had just spent his first season as the primary play-caller at Houston after eight years on Mike Gundy’s staff at Oklahoma State, and Sonny Cumbie, a Texas Tech assistant who, as the Red Raiders’ starting quarterback in 2004, had engineered a 70-35 blowout over Patterson’s team. In the spring, TCU recruited Johnny Manziel’s former backup at Texas A&M, Matt Joeckel, who had two years under his belt in an Air Raid system and would be eligible to play immediately as a graduate transfer. Patterson, the old defensive hand, was all in on a system that placed little or no value on establishing the run, winning time of possession, or occasionally easing up on the throttle for the sake of the defense."
-------------
http://grantland.com/the-triangle/t...olution-gary-patterson-trevone-boykin-big-12/

Stanford?

 

[OrangePA]

USC? Alabama?

 

[Millhouse]

USC? Alabama?

yes i am aware that there are teams not running the air raid

 

[Chip]

yes i am aware that there are teams not running the air raid

Stanford is really the anomaly, as they are private, they don't have the giant stadium or rabid fan base. They do happen to be located in a talented football state, and that whole university prestige, incredible campus, etc.

But they also don't have the sustained level of success doing what they're doing. If you include the 8 win season of 2009, it's a 5 year run. This year, they are 5-3 and there are really no easy games left. Maybe Cal, but it's a weird rivalry game and Cal's offense is clicking. So you even wonder if they start another down cycle, and whether or not they could use that same style to work their way back up again.

 

[dollarbill44]

How many teams have won a NC with the Air Raid? We are about building championships here at SU, not gimmicks.

 

[Upstate]

Baylor, Okie State, Texas Tech, and West Virginia

Gimmick systems that have won nothing in the past how many years?

 

[Millhouse]

thank you dollarbill and upstate

 

[Millhouse]

Stanford is really the anomaly, as they are private, they don't have the giant stadium or rabid fan base. They do happen to be located in a talented football state, and that whole university prestige, incredible campus, etc.

But they also don't have the sustained level of success doing what they're doing. If you include the 8 win season of 2009, it's a 5 year run. This year, they are 5-3 and there are really no easy games left. Maybe Cal, but it's a weird rivalry game and Cal's offense is clicking. So you even wonder if they start another down cycle, and whether or not they could use that same style to work their way back up again.

a 5 year run with 3 of those years being an all time great QB

we can't run this or that offense because you need talent, we need to be like stanford even though they had the best qb ever

there will always be a stanford for the meatheads to cherry pick. when stanford falls off, there'll be somebody

i'm sure there were threads in years past from meatheads about how we need to be tough like TCU and the great patterson

 

[Millhouse]

tcu was 99th in att/game in 2010, 95th in 2011, 7th this year

is patterson making a mistake? is he a soft, gimmick guy?

 

[Millhouse]

stanford is less stanfordy

http://www.si.com/college-football/2014/10/31/oregon-stanford-preview

 

[javadoc]

tcu was 99th in att/game in 2010, 95th in 2011, 7th this year

is patterson making a mistake? is he a soft, gimmick guy?

I see from the article that they lead the nation in PPG, which was the first question I had. I guess if you tend to score more points than everyone else, all you have to do is field a pedestrian defense to win.

Could we run what they are running right now, with our existing personnel this year? Assume that everyone was healthy.

If not, how do you make the transition?

 

[Millhouse]

I see from the article that they lead the nation in PPG, which was the first question I had. I guess if you tend to score more points than everyone else, all you have to do is field a pedestrian defense to win.

Could we run what they are running right now, with our existing personnel this year? Assume that everyone was healthy.

If not, how do you make the transition?

we need to get rid of this presumption that air raid teams need good personnel

these nut cases that came up with it at obscure backwater schools didn't do it because of all their talent.

their qb stunk last year. same guy. all of a sudden he's really good. i don't think it's a coincidence

at some point you need to decide what you want to do and just do it.

to continue with the national title nonsense that dollarbill brought upwhere are all these teams winning national titles by just fitting offenses to their personnel and figuring it out as they go?

 

[javadoc]

we need to get rid of this presumption that air raid teams need good personnel

these nut cases that came up with it at obscure backwater schools didn't do it because of all their talent.

their qb stunk last year. same guy. all of a sudden he's really good. i don't think it's a coincidence

at some point you need to decide what you want to do and just do it.

to continue with the national title nonsense that dollarbill brought upwhere are all these teams winning national titles by just fitting offenses to their personnel and figuring it out as they go?

You did not answer the question. Can we make it work with our obscure backwater offensive personnel?

 

[Upstate]

Call me crazy, but I really liked what Marrone's offensive scheme. I'm not sure what it would have morphed into with what would have come recruiting-wise, it seems as if he was really open to letting a QB who has some legs run. Nassib wasn't a great runner, but still got to take the ball 5-6 times a game. Wonder what he'd have done with this Offense.

 

[Millhouse]

You did not answer the question. Can we make it work with our obscure backwater offensive personnel?

yes of course

 

[qdawgg]

Might also help to have interior linemen who can block for screens.

The problem with our screens is that the O-line doesn't come out to block on the screens we run, not that they aren't capable. We throw out wide to 1 WR receiving and 1 WR blocking, against 2 DB's and a LB or Safety. If we threw more screens in the right situations where the WR ducked inside to catch the ball on the run, while a FB or TE was blocking along with an O-linemen then we could better analyze whether the screen would work with our personal.

 

[javadoc]

yes of course

So next question, in all seriousness. Could we run something like it out of our existing playbook? I don't know how the routes that the WR's run in that offense compare to what we are seeing from our guys right now. Have you seen anything that looked like it? I'm assuming that it's more than simply the number of times you throw.