Interesting how Bullough has gone from goat to hero.

[Crusty]

Interesting how Chuck Bullough has gone from being a stupid unqualified defensive coordinator after suffering three blowout last year to the only competent coach on the staff who some are worried will be lured away.

It is a cautionary tale about jumping to conclusions about coaching ability. We all tend to do it to varying degrees. It's college football and changes in OC/DC come with new systems, verbiage and a learning curve of a couple of years. Just no way around it.

Unfortunately, we are probably going to have to go through the same thing with Lester next season. He will install his own system with its own verbiage and will have its own learning curve.

We are all just going to have to live with that reality. Hopefully, the improvement in recruiting will start to show up on the field next year giving us all something to hang our hope on.

 

[TheCusian]

Interesting how Chuck Bullough has gone from being a stupid unqualified defensive coordinator after suffering three blowout last year to the only competent coach on the staff who some are worried will be lured away. It is a cautionary tale about jumping to conclusions about coaching ability. We all tend to do it to varying degrees. It's college football and changes in OC/DC come with new systems, verbiage and a learning curve of a couple of years. Just no way around it. Unfortunately, we are probably going to have to go through the same thing with Lester next season. He will install his own system with its own verbiage and will have its own learning curve. We are all just going to have to live with that reality. Hopefully, the improvement in recruiting will start to show up on the field next year giving us all something to hang our hope on.

I'm expecting serious improvement. If only because we finished +100 in offense nationally. What if we were simply average? What if our defense is roughly the same?

Is that enough to keep Shafer? 6 to 8 wins?

 

[Crusty]

I'm expecting serious improvement. If only because we finished +100 in offense nationally. What if we were simply average? What if our defense is roughly the same?

Is that enough to keep Shafer? 6 to 8 wins?

Yes, marginal improvement will be no improvement at all. We need to get back to the middle of the pack.

 

[MadNY3]

Here's the truth: I'm a meathead like the rest of them.

Give me wins more often than losses.

Debate everything else and enjoy.

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

I have to admit I was very down on Bullough last season. Let's see what he does with a very very young defense next year before we make a final decision. There are going to be basically 1o new starters on defense next season. Hodge and Franklin have each only started a few games. If Bullough can keep the games competitive next year then he is doing a great job. If the team wins six games next season I will be satisfied.

 

[RMH44]

I have to admit I was very down on Bullough last season. Let's see what he does with a very very young defense next year before we make a final decision. There are going to be basically 1o new starters on defense next season. Hodge and Franklin have each only started a few games. If Bullough can keep the games competitive next year then he is doing a great job. If the team wins six games next season I will be satisfied.

Thompson, Hodge, Franklin and Johnson have all started games. The more important point is that we're returning a large number of players that have significant playing experience.

My biggest concern on D is in the secondary.

 

[Crusty]

Thompson, Hodge, Franklin and Johnson have all started games. The more important point is that we're returning a large number of players that have significant playing experience.

My biggest concern on D is in the secondary.

That is my concern as well. I think we have helped ourselves there in these past two classes. We have been trying to get bigger and faster in the secondary and I think we are on own way.

 

[Alsacs]

Seriously who is scared to lose Bullough? I don't care if he goes to Michigan State or elsewhere. He is running Scott Shafer's defense and I don't think his recruiting is top 3 on the coaching staff. If Bullough leaves SS replace him with another member of the band that will run his defense the way he wants it run.

Our offense was so bad it makes a mediocre defense look great. Everybody already knew this team won 8 of the 10 games under SS because the defense shut our opponents down.

Bullough's defense didn't stop Notre Dame, Florida State, Villanova. that well this year. They did an adequate job not great.

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

Thompson, Hodge, Franklin and Johnson have all started games. The more important point is that we're returning a large number of players that have significant playing experience.

My biggest concern on D is in the secondary.

Yes they have all "started" games but none have been full time starters. Thompson and Johnson have been rotational players. I disagree that there are a large number of players who have significant experience. At least two linebackers will have very minimum in game experience. Both safeties will incredibly inexperienced. Please don't take this to mean I am down on these guys as players. From a physical standpoint I think they may be better than the guys they're replacing. My point was more to see if the staff has them prepared for the first game. If they are ready to go on day one then I will give Bullough a lot of credit.

 

[anomander]

I have to admit I was very down on Bullough last season. Let's see what he does with a very very young defense next year before we make a final decision. There are going to be basically 1o new starters on defense next season. Hodge and Franklin have each only started a few games. If Bullough can keep the games competitive next year then he is doing a great job. If the team wins six games next season I will be satisfied.

Bullough has absolutely no excuse not to have another great defense. While we do lose starters, I would argue that some would be addition by subtraction. I was all for Thompson and Johnson starting over Welsh/Robinson this year. The interior DL (Williams,Raymon,Coleman) while they may not have started have a ton of game experience. Linebackers have Franklin and Hodge, and some more athletic youngsters waiting their turn. Whigham returns at corner, and opposite him could either be Morgan, or if they chose to go with 1 of the 3 Freshman (Cordy, Dowels, Hudson) that I have heard they were extremely high on (and reason for dropping Robinson from the 2014 recruiting class). At safety I think they end up moving Morgan back there to give the back end some experience. Plus you have Scissum who has game experience, and some talented young guys. Some of Shafers recruits are going to be needed to provide depth, but if they are as good as everyone feels they are, myself included, then the defense has no excuse to take a step back. I do think people have got a little carried away with how great Bullough has been. He has righted the ship, and has been solid since his disasterous start, but a lot of that I credit to Shafer, since this is basically his defense. There were still games where the defense was handled. Next year while the group may be younger, it should be the most athletic defense we have had in a while. Let's not start building in excuses in cases things go wrong. We should expect nothing less then what we did this year on that side of the ball.

 

[Crusty]

Seriously who is scared to lose Bullough? I don't care if he goes to Michigan State or elsewhere. He is running Scott Shafer's defense and I don't think his recruiting is top 3 on the coaching staff. If Bullough leaves SS replace him with another member of the band that will run his defense the way he wants it run.

Our offense was so bad it makes a mediocre defense look great. Everybody already knew this team won 8 of the 10 games under SS because the defense shut our opponents down.

Bullough's defense didn't stop Notre Dame, Florida State, Villanova. that well this year. They did an adequate job not great.

No, he is not running Shafer's defense. Similar in philosophy but that's it.

 

[nzm136]

Interesting how Chuck Bullough has gone from being a stupid unqualified defensive coordinator after suffering three blowout last year to the only competent coach on the staff who some are worried will be lured away.

It is a cautionary tale about jumping to conclusions about coaching ability. We all tend to do it to varying degrees. It's college football and changes in OC/DC come with new systems, verbiage and a learning curve of a couple of years. Just no way around it.

Unfortunately, we are probably going to have to go through the same thing with Lester next season. He will install his own system with its own verbiage and will have its own learning curve.

We are all just going to have to live with that reality. Hopefully, the improvement in recruiting will start to show up on the field next year giving us all something to hang our hope on.

For the record, I have zero fear of Bullough leaving. I really don't care. I would actually strongly prefer that he gets canned and either HCSS does his job and uses the money freed up to get a decent OC, or he is replaced by someone who is really, really good at recruiting. I think that both our offense and defense would improve in both scenarios.

 

[PhatOrange]

Bullough has absolutely no excuse not to have another great defense. While we do lose starters, I would argue that some would be addition by subtraction. I was all for Thompson and Johnson starting over Welsh/Robinson this year. The interior DL (Williams,Raymon,Coleman) while they may not have started have a ton of game experience. Linebackers have Franklin and Hodge, and some more athletic youngsters waiting their turn. Whigham returns at corner, and opposite him could either be Morgan, or if they chose to go with 1 of the 3 Freshman (Cordy, Dowels, Hudson) that I have heard they were extremely high on (and reason for dropping Robinson from the 2014 recruiting class). At safety I think they end up moving Morgan back there to give the back end some experience. Plus you have Scissum who has game experience, and some talented young guys. Some of Shafers recruits are going to be needed to provide depth, but if they are as good as everyone feels they are, myself included, then the defense has no excuse to take a step back. I do think people have got a little carried away with how great Bullough has been. He has righted the ship, and has been solid since his disasterous start, but a lot of that I credit to Shafer, since this is basically his defense. There were still games where the defense was handled. Next year while the group may be younger, it should be the most athletic defense we have had in a while. Let's not start building in excuses in cases things go wrong. We should expect nothing less then what we did this year on that side of the ball.

Just because you were all for Thompson and Johnson starting over Welsh/Robinson this year doesn’t mean diddly. And don't expect Johnson to get moved back outside as we have an extreme need at DT and he's going nearly 290 lbs now.

Welsh and Micah Robinson were solid consistent performers. They got the most run because they were the best players.

Robinson finished 8th on the team in tackles with 42.

Behind
Lynch – 97
Davis – 71
Eskridge – 68
Kelly – 61
Desir – 57
Franklin – 44
Reddish – 43

So he’s within 2 tackles of being 6th on the team. For a DEnd playing on a defense that asks the LB’s to make all the tackles the 42 is pretty good. 6 TLF, 2 sacks, 5 breakups and 2 hurries.

Welsh finishes 31 tackles, 7 TFL (tied for 3rd), 3 BU, 1 Hurry

Isaiah Johnson played in all 12 games and had the worst stats of any DLineman – that includes williams, Raymon, Coleman and Sloan. Everyone except Donnie Simmons.

Yyou’re saying “Bullough has absolutely no excuse not to have another great defense.” Just remember, look at the above statistics, Syracuse is losing 7 of their top 8 tacklers AND Crume – their best DT. I think they'll perform but losing best DT, best LB, best CB, best SafetIES, the 'no excuse' and 'great defense' is probably a stretch.

Youre also penciling in two DTs who missed most of the year with injuries, one serious.

 

[anomander]

Just because you were all for Thompson and Johnson starting over Welsh/Robinson this year doesn’t mean diddly. And don't expect Johnson to get moved back outside as we have an extreme need at DT and he's going nearly 290 lbs now.

Welsh and Micah Robinson were solid consistent performers. They got the most run because they were the best players.

Robinson finished 8th on the team in tackles with 42.

Behind
Lynch – 97
Davis – 71
Eskridge – 68
Kelly – 61
Desir – 57
Franklin – 44
Reddish – 43

So he’s within 2 tackles of being 6th on the team. For a DEnd playing on a defense that asks the LB’s to make all the tackles the 42 is pretty good. 6 TLF, 2 sacks, 5 breakups and 2 hurries.

Welsh finishes 31 tackles, 7 TFL (tied for 3rd), 3 BU, 1 Hurry

Isaiah Johnson played in all 12 games and had the worst stats of any DLineman – that includes williams, Raymon, Coleman and Sloan. Everyone except Donnie Simmons.

Yyou’re saying “Bullough has absolutely no excuse not to have another great defense.” Just remember, look at the above statistics, Syracuse is losing 7 of their top 8 tacklers AND Crume – their best DT. I think they'll perform but losing best DT, best LB, best CB, best SafetIES, the 'no excuse' and 'great defense' is probably a stretch.

Youre also penciling in two DTs who missed most of the year with injuries, one serious.

Just more built in excuses. And if you couldn't see that Thompson was far better then both Welsh and Robinson then I suggest you find a new hobby.

 

[PhatOrange]

Just more built in excuses. And if you couldn't see that Thompson was far better then both Welsh and Robinson then I suggest you find a new hobby.

Thompson should be at DE but needed to play inside because of the dearth of DT depth and you're penciling in DT as being fine next year. Robinson was FIRST in tackles of ALL defensive lineman. But i know in your great arm chair analysis he should have played behind a sophomore that was MIA all year.

'more built in excuses'...thats comical. The expectation you're setting for the defense is unrealistic. Might as well say Boeheim should have a great year this year, everything else is just an excuse.

 

[anomander]

Thompson should be at DE but needed to play inside because of the dearth of DT depth and you're penciling in DT as being fine next year. Robinson was FIRST in tackles of ALL defensive lineman. But i know in your great arm chair analysis he should have played behind a sophomore that was MIA all year.

'more built in excuses'...thats comical. The expectation you're setting for the defense is unrealistic. Might as well say Boeheim should have a great year this year, everything else is just an excuse.

You realize that every program losses people every year? Just like Syracuse isn't the only one who experiences injuries, they also experience graduation. It's hard to believe I know, but it happens.

 

[sufandu]

Interesting how Chuck Bullough has gone from being a stupid unqualified defensive coordinator after suffering three blowout last year to the only competent coach on the staff who some are worried will be lured away.

It is a cautionary tale about jumping to conclusions about coaching ability. We all tend to do it to varying degrees. It's college football and changes in OC/DC come with new systems, verbiage and a learning curve of a couple of years. Just no way around it.

Unfortunately, we are probably going to have to go through the same thing with Lester next season. He will install his own system with its own verbiage and will have its own learning curve.

We are all just going to have to live with that reality. Hopefully, the improvement in recruiting will start to show up on the field next year giving us all something to hang our hope on.

I have to say I was all over him last year. I like the improvement I saw this year.

 

[PhatOrange]

You realize that every program losses people every year? Just like Syracuse isn't the only one who experiences injuries, they also experience graduation. It's hard to believe I know, but it happens.

I do realize that, which means most everybody has up and down seasons.

Are you saying we should be able to reload?

 

[CIL]

Just more built in excuses. And if you couldn't see that Thompson was far better then both Welsh and Robinson then I suggest you find a new hobby.

I think the younger guys may be more talented than some of the departing seniors, like Ron Thompson as you mentioned. However, you are literally losing THOUSANDS of repetitions on that side of the ball. I fully expect that this defense will have lots of growing pains, some blown coverages in the secondary, and plenty of mental errors. We will most likely take a step back before taking a few forward.

 

[anomander]

I do realize that, which means most everybody has up and down seasons.

Are you saying we should be able to reload?

Do you want me to go down a list?

BC is losing Tyler Murphy, Josh Bordner, Shakim Phillips, and 4 offensive lineman

FSU is losing Jameis Winston, Rashod Greene, Karlos Williams, Nick O'Leary, and at least 2 offensive lineeman

Louisville is losing Michael Dyer, Dominique Brown, DeVante Parker, Gerald Christian, Eli Rogers just from their skill position

Clemson is losing Adam Humphries, Cole Stoudt, and 3 offensive lineman.

Wake is losing Orville Reynolds, EJ Scott, and Matt James

NCST is basically returning their whole offense so maybe they should be favored to win the division.

Besides FSU is everyone else expected to reload? I don't see any of the schools feeling sorry for us because we lost some kids due to graduation. Everyone has been all gung-ho on our recruiting, I would expect some of these kids to be able to step up their 2nd year into the program? People can't have it both ways.

 

[TheCusian]

Do you want me to go down a list? BC is losing Tyler Murphy, Josh Bordner, Shakim Phillips, and 4 offensive lineman FSU is losing Jameis Winston, Rashod Greene, Karlos Williams, Nick O'Leary, and at least 2 offensive lineeman Louisville is losing Michael Dyer, Dominique Brown, DeVante Parker, Gerald Christian, Eli Rogers just from their skill position Clemson is losing Adam Humphries, Cole Stoudt, and 3 offensive lineman. Wake is losing Orville Reynolds, EJ Scott, and Matt James NCST is basically returning their whole offense so maybe they should be favored to win the division. Besides FSU is everyone else expected to reload? I don't see any of the schools feeling sorry for us because we lost some kids due to graduation. Everyone has been all gung-ho on our recruiting, I would expect some of these kids to be able to step up their 2nd year into the program? People can't have it both ways.

Agree but this started as a DT discussion - and DT and OL rarely are ready out of the gate as freshman.

Sometimes you end up with gaps that need filling - JUCO or moving guys over to get the production you want.

Even the big boys end up with holes when a guy doesn't pan out or their is a transfer.

We might be feeling that gap where Marrone's young guys are not panning out and the young guys are good but not quite ready yet.

Expecting perfection in development is a an exercise in futility.

 

[PhatOrange]

Do you want me to go down a list?

BC is losing Tyler Murphy, Josh Bordner, Shakim Phillips, and 4 offensive lineman

FSU is losing Jameis Winston, Rashod Greene, Karlos Williams, Nick O'Leary, and at least 2 offensive lineeman

Louisville is losing Michael Dyer, Dominique Brown, DeVante Parker, Gerald Christian, Eli Rogers just from their skill position

Clemson is losing Adam Humphries, Cole Stoudt, and 3 offensive lineman.

Wake is losing Orville Reynolds, EJ Scott, and Matt James

NCST is basically returning their whole offense so maybe they should be favored to win the division.

Besides FSU is everyone else expected to reload? I don't see any of the schools feeling sorry for us because we lost some kids due to graduation. Everyone has been all gung-ho on our recruiting, I would expect some of these kids to be able to step up their 2nd year into the program? People can't have it both ways.

BC and Wake will stink next year and LVille will struggle.