Is it safe to say Villanova

[orangenauburn]

Benefitted the most from our sanctions?

Roster full of kids we probably would have added had there been scholarships available.

Also, once FBI is done, will they maintain these wins? Weren't they mentioned in a few reports?

 

[HOFCeluck]

Benefitted the most from our sanctions?

Roster full of kids we probably would have added had there been scholarships available.

Also, once FBI is done, will they maintain these wins? Weren't they mentioned in a few reports?

They were a top ten team in 2014. They probably would be rolling regardless.

 

[corpjet]

I know lot of people here don't like him but I think Jay Wright is a heck of a coach and has done a remarkable job at Nova.

If Hop doesn't come back here I would take Jay Wright in a heartbeat when JB retires (if he would come).

 

[jdubs30]

I love the way Nova plays and Jay Wright is as good as anyone in the country.

I do wonder why no one ever talks about him not developing pros. It’s a negative for us that we send guys to the NBA every year, but aren’t as successful as people think they should be, then all we hear is that we can’t develop kids.

Jay Wright has been at Nova for 17 years and has only produced 6 draft picks. And outside of Kyle Lowry, there’s not much ( Randy Foye was solid). Lowry declared as a sophomore. 4 of the other guys were seniors. Michael Bradley declared as a junior but that was Jays first year, so can you even count that as his draft pick?

I don’t get why that’s never mentioned. We send guys to the league every year and get killed for it yet Nova never sends anyone and it’s nevdd brought up

 

[wallacecuse]

I know lot of people here don't like him but I think Jay Wright is a heck of a coach and has done a remarkable job at Nova.

If Hop doesn't come back here I would take Jay Wright in a heartbeat when JB retires (if he would come).

I said this two years ago to all the the people who said they wanted SUs next coach to have an NC before he got here...why would he leave if he can win an NC there? Especially now. Makes no sense from his perspective.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I love the way Nova plays and Jay Wright is as good as anyone in the country.

I do wonder why no one ever talks about him not developing pros. It’s a negative for us that we send guys to the NBA every year, but aren’t as successful as people think they should be, then all we hear is that we can’t develop kids.

Jay Wright has been at Nova for 17 years and has only produced 6 draft picks. And outside of Kyle Lowry, there’s not much ( Randy Foye was solid)

I don’t get why that’s never mentioned. We send guys to the league every year and get killed for it yet Nova never sends anyone and it’s nevdd brought up

Yeah, that's weird.

 

[cuse10]

Not sanctions. From the Big East imploding on itself and having six teams leave, all of whom were competitive and regularly near the top of the league.

 

[HoustonCuse]

I love the way Nova plays and Jay Wright is as good as anyone in the country.

I do wonder why no one ever talks about him not developing pros. It’s a negative for us that we send guys to the NBA every year, but aren’t as successful as people think they should be, then all we hear is that we can’t develop kids.

Jay Wright has been at Nova for 17 years and has only produced 6 draft picks. And outside of Kyle Lowry, there’s not much ( Randy Foye was solid). Lowry declared as a sophomore. 4 of the other guys were seniors. Michael Bradley declared as a junior but that was Jays first year, so can you even count that as his draft pick?

I don’t get why that’s never mentioned. We send guys to the league every year and get killed for it yet Nova never sends anyone and it’s nevdd brought up

The media (especially sports media) has an extremely primitive approach to things, probably because they know the audience has the attention span and cognitive skills of an insect. So each team, scenario, or issue gets boiled down to one or two simplistic tropes based an preconceived ideas or prevailing group think.

In the case of Villanova it’s:
- Jay Wright’s good looks and expensive clothes
- Hard working, gym rat, blue collar players
- Team first basketball, fundamentals
- Feel good tone

In the case of Syracuse it’s:
- Boeheim is a curmudgeon, whiner, negative
- Program has every advantage in the world and doesn’t deserve anything that could be considered a “break”
- The zone (sometimes negative sometimes positive but always as a gimmick or using it to somehow get away with something)
- Negative tone

There are nuggets of truth to some of the bullet points for both teams but generally just driven by group think like I said. Neither list truly describes anything meaningful or fundamentally enlightening about either program.

 

[orangecuse]

I love the way Nova plays and Jay Wright is as good as anyone in the country.

I do wonder why no one ever talks about him not developing pros. It’s a negative for us that we send guys to the NBA every year, but aren’t as successful as people think they should be, then all we hear is that we can’t develop kids.

Jay Wright has been at Nova for 17 years and has only produced 6 draft picks. And outside of Kyle Lowry, there’s not much ( Randy Foye was solid). Lowry declared as a sophomore. 4 of the other guys were seniors. Michael Bradley declared as a junior but that was Jays first year, so can you even count that as his draft pick?

I don’t get why that’s never mentioned. We send guys to the league every year and get killed for it yet Nova never sends anyone and it’s nevdd brought up

Well, in my opinion, it's obvious and the same reason why John Calipari gets the credit. It really has not much at all to do with the coach, than the player themselves. What did the Syracuse coaches specifically do to get Ennis drafted in the first round, or Malachi for that matter? Lydon? The list can go on. Other than simply allowing these players to show "THEIR" skills/skill set that made them attractive to the NBA people. Their particular builds, length, etc. are also significant, which again, how did these coaches affect that fixed attribute? The coaches certainly can get credit for bringing them here, but one year, and two in some instances at SU isn't what launches these guys, it's THEIR own skills, growth/physical attributes, years of playing organized ball at high levels, etc. being the proximate cause.

 

[Lucid]

I said this two years ago to all the the people who said they wanted SUs next coach to have an NC before he got here...why would he leave if he can win an NC there? Especially now. Makes no sense from his perspective.

Unless he truly wants to duke it out (no pun intended) with the big dogs in the ACC every year? I doubt it.

 

[Townie72]

The media (especially sports media) has an extremely primitive approach to things, probably because they know the audience has the attention span and cognitive skills of an insect. So each team, scenario, or issue gets boiled down to one or two simplistic tropes based an preconceived ideas or prevailing group think.

In the case of Villanova it’s:
- Jay Wright’s good looks and expensive clothes
- Hard working, gym rat, blue collar players
- Team first basketball, fundamentals
- Feel good tone

In the case of Syracuse it’s:
- Boeheim is a curmudgeon, whiner, negative
- Program has every advantage in the world and doesn’t deserve anything that could be considered a “break”
- The zone (sometimes negative sometimes positive but always as a gimmick or using it to somehow get away with something)
- Negative tone

There are nuggets of truth to some of the bullet points for both teams but generally just driven by group think like I said. Neither list truly describes anything meaningful or fundamentally enlightening about either program.

And yet, the group of people with the attitudes about SU that you listed, consider themselves to be "fans". They are not, IMO. They are instead chronic whiners filled with an incontrollable urge (Tens of thousands of Posts) to share their opinions.

 

[Eric15]

In the case of Syracuse it’s:
- Boeheim is a curmudgeon, whiner, negative

With the exception of a few outliers like Gottlieb, I feel like Boeheim is adored by the national media. When they talk about him being a curmudgeon (which he totally is) it's generally in a light-hearted, complimentary way.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

Well, in my opinion, it's obvious and the same reason why John Calipari gets the credit. It really has not much at all to do with the coach, than the player themselves. What did the Syracuse coaches specifically do to get Ennis drafted in the first round, or Malachi for that matter? Lydon? The list can go on. Other than simply allowing these players to show "THEIR" skills/skill set that made them attractive to the NBA people. Their particular builds, length, etc. are also significant, which again, how did these coaches affect that fixed attribute? The coaches certainly can get credit for bringing them here, but one year, and two in some instances at SU isn't what launches these guys, it's THEIR own skills, growth/physical attributes, years of playing organized ball at high levels, etc. being the proximate cause.

JB and the SU staff have done a great job identifying and recruiting under the radar “high ceiling” guys and getting them to the NBA. Guys like MCW, Jerami Grant and Tyler Lydon. Those guys were all skinny, lanky, underdeveloped kids when they committed to SU. In their time and SU they developed into first round picks. While I do give credit to the athletes themselves, you can’t completely discount the SU staff as a conduit to their path to the NBA.

It’s kind of what college basketball coaches are supposed to do: identify talented high school players, recruit them to come to their school, develop and win with them while their in school, get them to the NBA, or get them a degree so they have a skills to develop a career after basketball.

JB has a long track record (40+ year track record) of doing exactly that. I can’t see how anyone would say he doesn’t deserve credit for the success of his athletes both during and after their time at SU.

 

[cliftonparksufan]

With the exception of a few outliers like Gottlieb, I feel like Boeheim is adored by the national media. When they talk about him being a curmudgeon (which he totally is) it's generally in a light-hearted, complimentary way.

Go listen to Gottlieb's interview with JAB from Friday that I posted. It was a love fest. College basketball people aren't happy with Bazley setting this precedent. CBB has enough issues. It sure doesn't need players committing and then going to the G league after the recruiting cycle has basically ended.

In the interview they even discuss the photo of JAB sleeping at an AAU event that we have all seen.

 

[Madbiker]

Benefitted the most from our sanctions?

Roster full of kids we probably would have added had there been scholarships available.

Also, once FBI is done, will they maintain these wins? Weren't they mentioned in a few reports?

I doubt it. Most don't fit JB's plan for the zone and they all shoot too well to fit at Cuse.

 

[Madbiker]

The media (especially sports media) has an extremely primitive approach to things, probably because they know the audience has the attention span and cognitive skills of an insect. So each team, scenario, or issue gets boiled down to one or two simplistic tropes based an preconceived ideas or prevailing group think.

In the case of Villanova it’s:
- Jay Wright’s good looks and expensive clothes
- Hard working, gym rat, blue collar players
- Team first basketball, fundamentals
- Feel good tone

In the case of Syracuse it’s:
- Boeheim is a curmudgeon, whiner, negative
- Program has every advantage in the world and doesn’t deserve anything that could be considered a “break”
- The zone (sometimes negative sometimes positive but always as a gimmick or using it to somehow get away with something)
- Negative tone

There are nuggets of truth to some of the bullet points for both teams but generally just driven by group think like I said. Neither list truly describes anything meaningful or fundamentally enlightening about either program.

If the media likes a coach (because he is a generally good guy and most importantly is good to them, gives interviews, isn't nasty, snarky) they give him great positive press and build him up. If the media doesn't like a coach everything they say has a negative bent or is outright nasty. It's been that way 4 ever. We know which side JB falls on.

 

[pfister1]

Change this to Nova benefited most from Syracuse's move to the ACC and I think you may be right.

Nova has really elevated its profile as the Kings of the reshuffled Big East. I think that has helped them in recruiting and in all facets of improving their program. To the extent that they have successfully recruited guys that we wanted, it isn't because of sanctions, it is because they went head to head with us and took them (although I don't think there are really that many guys that we competed with them for).

SU has focused on positioning its athletic department to support its football program, in many ways to the detriment of its hoops program. Nova has focused on positioning its athletic department to support its basketball program.

When you discuss the general stature of the two programs we may soon have to acknowledge that Nova has 3 National Championships to our 1.

 

[BuffOrange]

I love the way Nova plays and Jay Wright is as good as anyone in the country.

I do wonder why no one ever talks about him not developing pros. It’s a negative for us that we send guys to the NBA every year, but aren’t as successful as people think they should be, then all we hear is that we can’t develop kids.

Jay Wright has been at Nova for 17 years and has only produced 6 draft picks. And outside of Kyle Lowry, there’s not much ( Randy Foye was solid). Lowry declared as a sophomore. 4 of the other guys were seniors. Michael Bradley declared as a junior but that was Jays first year, so can you even count that as his draft pick?

I don’t get why that’s never mentioned. We send guys to the league every year and get killed for it yet Nova never sends anyone and it’s nevdd brought up

I'm not sure exactly why (Boeheim, Newhouse?) but we have the most lopsided [Everyone hates us/Titles] ratio in North American sports. The only one close I can think of is the Toronto Maple Leafs (not counting Cups when there was 3 teams).

With the exception of a few outliers like Gottlieb, I feel like Boeheim is adored by the national media. When they talk about him being a curmudgeon (which he totally is) it's generally in a light-hearted, complimentary way.

You're talking about mostly game broadcast guys who are never critical of anyone ever because that's how they keep their jobs.

 

[orangecuse]

JB and the SU staff have done a great job identifying and recruiting under the radar “high ceiling” guys and getting them to the NBA. Guys like MCW, Jerami Grant and Tyler Lydon. Those guys were all skinny, lanky, underdeveloped kids when they committed to SU. In their time and SU they developed into first round picks. While I do give credit to the athletes themselves, you can’t completely discount the SU staff as a conduit to their path to the NBA.

It’s kind of what college basketball coaches are supposed to do: identify talented high school players, recruit them to come to their school, develop and win with them while their in school, get them to the NBA, or get them a degree so they have a skills to develop a career after basketball.

JB has a long track record (40+ year track record) of doing exactly that. I can’t see how anyone would say he doesn’t deserve credit for the success of his athletes both during and after their time at SU.

Malachi and MCW were Mickey D kids. I did say he gets the credit for identifying the talent, even in instances where a guy is not so highly rated (elite type status) like Ennis, Lydon, etc. I just am debating how much "development" is truly warranted from coaches vs. their own talent, work ethic, etc. Some tweaking/enhancement to their skill set, absolutely, but the foundation was already laid prior to their arrival on campus. These guys are only under the coaches wings for a short, time, October-March. If you leave SU, especially after just one season (again, a few short months under a coaches wings), I'm just not buying that the coach(coaching) is the main reason or proximate cause of it, but more due to the aforementioned. Does it look good for the coach and the program, it most certainly does, and SU should promote and market that for all it's worth. Now, if we are talking program type guys and four year types, then absolutely more credit is warranted, but that's a horse of a different color.

 

[Orangefan1]

Villanova benefited most from the realignment

 

[rrlbees]

If the media likes a coach (because he is a generally good guy and most importantly is good to them, gives interviews, isn't nasty, snarky) they give him great positive press and build him up. If the media doesn't like a coach everything they say has a negative bent or is outright nasty. It's been that way 4 ever. We know which side JB falls on.

JB is on the good side with the national media. Guy does more TV than any other coach I see during the NCAA’s.

 

[SWC75]

I have said 'Villanova' many times and nothing bad has ever happened to me because of it.

 

[Alsacs]

JB is Arsene Wenger.
Arsenal has been competitive every year and finished top 4 20 years in a row.
Which is good enough for Champions League.
The Gunners only have 1 EPL title though 2003.

Both are legends and basically are their teams.

 

[HOFCeluck]

Who in the media is critical of JB?

Gottlieb I guess? Of course they act like BFFs when he's on his radio show.

Bomani Jones? Is The Right Time even on the air anymore?

 

[bpo57]

They were a top ten team in 2014. They probably would be rolling regardless.

Yeah I don't see the connection.