It's hard

[Deleted member 8116]

100% some just can't or don't want to grasp the concept. The fans aren't "serious" or ravenous enough or there aren't many left. It's really not that hard to comprehend.

Yeah that’s it buddy. I must not grasp it. It doesn’t matter how it’s sliced, if through donors or whatever method you choose, they are unable to buyout a few years, my point is still that this program is unserious.

The buyout for a coach's contract is not just from donors. It also includes ticket sales, TV contracts, etc. Do we even know the details of the buyout clause i.e., how much, can it be negotiated down due to team success and so on?

I also didn’t reference larger schools. I referenced Kansas. Didn’t realize they were a football powerhouse in 2014..

 

[Deleted member 8116]

We got a taste of the good life back when Pitt BC Rutgers and PSU sucked and back when people had to be nearby to see their kids play and back when racists didn't want black QBs

It was nice, I think it should've been nicer, but whatever. it's over and we are screwed. 1991 is as far away from 2023 as the 1959 national championship was from 1991

we should do what other schools who are screwed do - hire someone weird and throw it all day and have fun once in a while

PSU had a black starting QB in the 70’s..

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Yeah that’s it buddy. I must not grasp it. It doesn’t matter how it’s sliced, if through donors or whatever method you choose, they are unable to buyout a few years, my point is still that this program is unserious.

The buyout for a coach's contract is not just from donors. It also includes ticket sales, TV contracts, etc. Do we even know the details of the buyout clause i.e., how much, can it be negotiated down due to team success and so on?

I also didn’t reference larger schools. I referenced Kansas. Didn’t realize they were a football powerhouse in 2014..

You're still wrong, it comes down to donor $ and donor base for this stuff

 

[Deleted member 8116]

You're still wrong, it comes down to donor $ and donor base for this stuff

It does not just come down to donors paying the buyout. That’s a big part of it sure, but it also comes down to the stuff previously mentioned.

 

[Millhouse]

PSU had a black starting QB in the 70’s..

Good for them

 

[Deleted member 8116]

Good for them

I agree. It’s good to see that. I was unaware of that as well.

 

[Cheriehoop]

PSU had a black starting QB in the 70’s..

Syracuse had their first black qb in 1937, Wilmeth Sidath-Singh and then Bernie Custis in 1948.

 

[orangecuse]

100% some just can't or don't want to grasp the concept. The fans aren't "serious" or ravenous enough or there aren't many left. It's really not that hard to comprehend.

It's a bit of condescension, IMO, to state that folks can't grasp the concept. I don't think it's that as much as what folks may chose to believe.

This isn't on direct point of course, but I'm reminded of a great scene in the movie "Zero Dark Thirty" where one of the CIA characters says to the other who has more power, authority, intel, etc., that he understands the risk of taking aggressive action, etc., but utters; "what is the risk of doing nothing?" "How do you live with that, if he is there?" Or, along those lines.

I realize 3 years of a buyout or 12 mil at 4 mil/yr. is a substantial amount of coin, but what is the cost of doing nothing? Or even the cost of waiting as long to this point that SU has? How is that measured from a comprehensive totality standpoint? The fall out of fans, lost support of the program, diminished revenue, etc. There certainly is a considerable amount of risk in doing nothing/what SU hasn't done to date too.

On an aside, no doubt SU doesn't have the alumni base, donor dollars, etc. as those big time programs. With that being the case, and not having that luxury, who cares what those schools can do, it doesn't apply to SU. That doesn't mean that SU has to be stuck and just sit there and eat it, they have the means if it truly mattered to them, and as others have suggested, if they took the highest level of collegiate football really serious.

Obviously, it's more critical for SU to get their hires right vs. other schools, and shouldn't make a habit of dipping into their other means that they have access to, etc. but they could do it.

For instance, it wasn't too long ago that SU was getting 5 mil or about that annually while in the Big East. They now get upwards of 40 mil, or 8 times that. Where is all that money? I can't imagine that SU's costs have gone up 8 times, in all probability it's likely a fraction of that. Even if costs doubled, that's still 4 times what the Big East payout was only a decade or so ago.

Since Dino's buyout (from what I've read here) is only currently in the 4 mil neighborhood, this would appear to be a no brainer at this point to just act, dismiss him already, and let the chips fall where they may.

I don't know...just my opinion.

Edit: It doesn't help either what the university implies (or attempts to imply) with some of their public takes/antics either. Like just last week when ADJW stated that the BC game was going to the largest crowd relative to actual ticket sales, etc. Everyone knew that that Dome would look like a ghost town so to speak and nowhere near fannies in the seat as Clemson, which was his implication. Folks could comprehend that just a well as the woe is me (SU) mantra relative to lack of funds, etc.

 

[Deleted member 8116]

If they go 4-8 or 5-7, is it guaranteed that they would fire him? I mean, they might as well let him have another year if they're financially struggling.

I’d like to see JW announce he returns next year no matter the outcome of the last 3 games. Really drum up that excitement for 2024.

 

[rrlbees]

It's a bit of condescension, IMO, to state that folks can't grasp the concept. I don't think it's that as much as what folks may chose to believe.

This isn't on direct point of course, but I'm reminded of a great scene in the movie "Zero Dark Thirty" where one of the CIA characters says to the other who has more power, authority, intel, etc., that he understands the risk of taking aggressive action, etc., but utters; "what is the risk of doing nothing?" "How do you live with that, if he is there?" Or, along those lines.

I realize 3 years of a buyout or 12 mil at 4 mil/yr. is a substantial amount of coin, but what is the cost of doing nothing? Or even the cost of waiting as long to this point that SU has? How is that measured from a comprehensive totality standpoint? The fall out of fans, lost support of the program, diminished revenue, etc. There certainly is a considerable amount of risk in doing nothing/what SU hasn't done to date too.

On an aside, no doubt SU doesn't have the alumni base, donor dollars, etc. as those big time programs. With that being the case, and not having that luxury, who cares what those schools can do, it doesn't apply to SU. That doesn't mean that SU has to be stuck and just sit there and eat it, they have the means if it truly mattered to them, and as others have suggested, if they took the highest level of collegiate football really serious.

Obviously, it's more critical for SU to get their hires right vs. other schools, and shouldn't make a habit of dipping into their other means that they have access to, etc. but they could do it.

For instance, it wasn't too long ago that SU was getting 5 mil or about that annually while in the Big East. They now get upwards of 40 mil, or 8 times that. Where is all that money? I can't imagine that SU's costs have gone up 8 times, in all probability it's likely a fraction of that. Even if costs doubled, that's still 4 times what the Big East payout was only a decade or so ago.

Since Dino's buyout (from what I've read here) is only currently in the 4 mil neighborhood, this would appear to be a no brainer at this point to just act, dismiss him already, and let the chips fall where they may.

I don't know...just my opinion.

Edit: It doesn't help either what the university implies (or attempts to imply) with some of their public takes/antics either. Like just last week when ADJW stated that the BC game was going to the largest crowd relative to actual ticket sales, etc. Everyone knew that that Dome would look like a ghost town so to speak and nowhere near fannies in the seat as Clemson, which was his implication. Folks could comprehend that just a well as the woe is me (SU) mantra relative to lack of funds, etc.

There were more there than Clemson.

 

[tipphill]

consult marrone on the next coach---not the bot, nor wildhack.

 

[Bayside44]

It's a bit of condescension, IMO, to state that folks can't grasp the concept. I don't think it's that as much as what folks may chose to believe.

This isn't on direct point of course, but I'm reminded of a great scene in the movie "Zero Dark Thirty" where one of the CIA characters says to the other who has more power, authority, intel, etc., that he understands the risk of taking aggressive action, etc., but utters; "what is the risk of doing nothing?" "How do you live with that, if he is there?" Or, along those lines.

I realize 3 years of a buyout or 12 mil at 4 mil/yr. is a substantial amount of coin, but what is the cost of doing nothing? Or even the cost of waiting as long to this point that SU has? How is that measured from a comprehensive totality standpoint? The fall out of fans, lost support of the program, diminished revenue, etc. There certainly is a considerable amount of risk in doing nothing/what SU hasn't done to date too.

On an aside, no doubt SU doesn't have the alumni base, donor dollars, etc. as those big time programs. With that being the case, and not having that luxury, who cares what those schools can do, it doesn't apply to SU. That doesn't mean that SU has to be stuck and just sit there and eat it, they have the means if it truly mattered to them, and as others have suggested, if they took the highest level of collegiate football really serious.

Obviously, it's more critical for SU to get their hires right vs. other schools, and shouldn't make a habit of dipping into their other means that they have access to, etc. but they could do it.

For instance, it wasn't too long ago that SU was getting 5 mil or about that annually while in the Big East. They now get upwards of 40 mil, or 8 times that. Where is all that money? I can't imagine that SU's costs have gone up 8 times, in all probability it's likely a fraction of that. Even if costs doubled, that's still 4 times what the Big East payout was only a decade or so ago.

Since Dino's buyout (from what I've read here) is only currently in the 4 mil neighborhood, this would appear to be a no brainer at this point to just act, dismiss him already, and let the chips fall where they may.

I don't know...just my opinion.

Edit: It doesn't help either what the university implies (or attempts to imply) with some of their public takes/antics either. Like just last week when ADJW stated that the BC game was going to the largest crowd relative to actual ticket sales, etc. Everyone knew that that Dome would look like a ghost town so to speak and nowhere near fannies in the seat as Clemson, which was his implication. Folks could comprehend that just a well as the woe is me (SU) mantra relative to lack of funds, etc.

If you think the SUAD is just sitting on unused millions you're wrong, just is what it is.

Dino will likely be let go and life will move on. Hopefully the next guy will be better.

People talk like this is a pro sports job, fire him to be first for the next great hope. It's not that at all.

 

[CousCuse]

If you think the SUAD is just sitting on unused millions you're wrong, just is what it is.

Dino will likely be let go and life will move on. Hopefully the next guy will be better.

People talk like this is a pro sports job, fire him to be first for the next great hope. It's not that at all.

How well the Syracuse football program does over the next 5 years is going to have a huge bearing on whether Syracuse makes the cut to stay in the top revenue conferences. If they get excluded, the revenue will drop down to less than 10 million dollars. At that point the athletic department won't be able to write big checks for all the sports scholarships to the university.

 

[orangecuse]

If you think the SUAD is just sitting on unused millions you're wrong, just is what it is.

Dino will likely be let go and life will move on. Hopefully the next guy will be better.

People talk like this is a pro sports job, fire him to be first for the next great hope. It's not that at all.

Of course, I don't think SU is sitting on it, that would be stupid as all get out. At minimum, they have placed the surplus from the ACC win fall into various investments, etc. Again, I realize that monies have been spent other staff positions, etc., in order to be more competitive and up to speed. However, I highly doubt that those expenditures, etc. have been on pace with the $35 plus annual win fall surplus, etc. from being in the ACC.

I don't think, at least reasonable folks, really talk like this is a pro sports job, but it's still very big business. I don't know how many other P5 level programs would act in the way in which SU has chosen to. Dino has been here for eight years, his peer record is 0-5 so far this year and 19-44 overall, that is a complete failure on every level. I think the writing has been on the wall for some time, and I think those other folks who have seen it this way as well, is what they're mostly dismayed about. As well as realizing that hope is not a strategy, and that how much repeatitive proof is needed before different action is taken.

If Syracuse University wants to play in the P5 world, then they should walk the walk too, and not project the well, we made our bed, now we just have to lie in it mindset. Oh, we don't have this, and we don't have that, we can't do this and we can't do that, yada, yada, yada. I'd bet that there's likely a large number of instutions out there that would be knocking at the door to be in Syracuse's shoes, get into a P5 conference and all that that brings, etc. vs. the can't do mantra tune that SU consistently seemingly sings.

I'm not sure how to intrepret your "just what it is" comment, other than it being very generic in nature relative to where all of that ACC money surplus win fall is, has gone, etc. Although, those words evidently do ring true relative to SU's leadership position and how it views their particular plight.