JB and the free throw strategy

[CuseFaninVT]

We keep missing free throws, yet JB only sends one guy to the block. Why not try and get an offensive board?

I saw him send OB in as the second man only once. This makes no sense to me.

 

[Madbiker]

Maybe we should practice free throws more.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Need to bump this again. I really don't understand what we are doing out there. One time in the first half and OB is at the line. Only Marek was lined up. And of course OB missed his second shot and MD didn't even attempt to get the rebound. He actually ran back to get on defense as soon as OB released the ball.

And I get it, JB doesn't want to get beat. So put your 6'6" shooting guard or SF in there. Let them go get some of those boards, especially with the way that OB and the others have been shooting free throws.

 

[grant]

77.3
73.7
73.3
72.7

These are the percentages that our guards are shooting from the line. This is abysmal and if we cannot make free throws down the stretch, its going to end up being a disappointing end to the season. Not to mention Carey is only shooting 63.2% from the line. We have to be one of the worst FT shooting teams in the country. No doubt we are safely off of the bubble if some of these missed FT go in

 

[Nyccuse44]

Not saying I agree with JB’s strategy, but guessing it’s a combination of wanting to get the zone set up and not wanting the bigs to pick up silly over the back fouls.

Saw an old kenpom analysis about offensive rebounds on missed free throws and the % was in the low teens. In most games that likely translates to 1 or maybe 2 extra possessions.

Given UNC couldn’t miss, it likely wouldn’t have changed the outcome of this game.

I don’t recall seeing other teams consistently employing this strategy, but most other teams don’t play zone for 40 mins.

 

[MSOrange]

77.3
73.7
73.3
72.7

These are the percentages that our guards are shooting from the line. This is abysmal and if we cannot make free throws down the stretch, its going to end up being a disappointing end to the season. Not to mention Carey is only shooting 63.2% from the line. We have to be one of the worst FT shooting teams in the country. No doubt we are safely off of the bubble if some of these missed FT go in

Guards need to be at least 80% and forwards 75% - it's just killing us.

 

[CusefanATL]

We keep missing free throws, yet JB only sends one guy to the block. Why not try and get an offensive board?

I saw him send OB in as the second man only once. This makes no sense to me.

Here’s my thing...

And keep in mind we somewhat often have 0 at the line (across any situation FYI)

Why not always have 2 on the block for almost mental support. They don’t even have to try for a rebound but consistency is key. Let the players be as comfortable as possible. Instead of 1 on 4. Make it 3 on 4 to the shooters eyes.

Something is missing. Oshae can’t possibly regress from 80% on 6 FTs a game to 65% on 5 FTs a game. That’s nearly impossible. Yet bascially the whole team has regressed to a point.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Here’s my thing...

And keep in mind we somewhat often have 0 at the line (across any situation FYI)

Why not always have 2 on the block for almost mental support. They don’t even have to try for a rebound but consistency is key. Let the players be as comfortable as possible. Instead of 1 on 4. Make it 3 on 4 to the shooters eyes.

Something is missing. Oshae can’t possibly regress from 80% on 6 FTs a game to 65% on 5 FTs a game. That’s nearly impossible. Yet bascially the whole team has regressed to a point.

Completely agree. We will also have at least a couple rebounds just bounce to us randomly IF WE ACTUALLY have people in there. Maybe not every game, but once in a while. Especially the way they've been shooting.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Need to bump this again. I really don't understand what we are doing out there. One time in the first half and OB is at the line. Only Marek was lined up. And of course OB missed his second shot and MD didn't even attempt to get the rebound. He actually ran back to get on defense as soon as OB released the ball.

And I get it, JB doesn't want to get beat. So put your 6'6" shooting guard or SF in there. Let them go get some of those boards, especially with the way that OB and the others have been shooting free throws.

That is probably a blessing considering Marek loves going over the back. He fouled out. The last thing we need is him picking up one there. Getting offensive rebounds off free throws basically requires someone not to do their job. The likelihood we could do that and not have the refs call a foul on us for no reason is small. It is more frustrating that we can't hit free throws considering how much we work on it.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Maybe we should practice free throws more.

Good idea. Call into JAB's show and suggest that. We practice them like crazy and OB practices them like crazy. It is clearly psych thing at this point. He is not shooting and he is aiming.

 

[kuethstheman]

That is probably a blessing considering Marek loves going over the back. He fouled out. The last thing we need is him picking up one there. Getting offensive rebounds off free throws basically requires someone not to do their job. The likelihood we could do that and not have the refs call a foul on us for no reason is small. It is more frustrating that we can't hit free throws considering how much we work on it.

Avoiding fouls is the rationale JB has given, in the past.

 

[bpo57]

Need to bump this again. I really don't understand what we are doing out there. One time in the first half and OB is at the line. Only Marek was lined up. And of course OB missed his second shot and MD didn't even attempt to get the rebound. He actually ran back to get on defense as soon as OB released the ball.

And I get it, JB doesn't want to get beat. So put your 6'6" shooting guard or SF in there. Let them go get some of those boards, especially with the way that OB and the others have been shooting free throws.

That strategy makes zero sense but he's paranoid about not getting back. If it made any sense at least a few teams would copy. I'm not aware of anybody else doing that. And it's ironic cuz historically we're a very mediocre FT shooting team.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

That is probably a blessing considering Marek loves going over the back. He fouled out. The last thing we need is him picking up one there. Getting offensive rebounds off free throws basically requires someone not to do their job. The likelihood we could do that and not have the refs call a foul on us for no reason is small. It is more frustrating that we can't hit free throws considering how much we work on it.

What you are talking about is a player failing to respond to coaching. All need to do better

 

[721Comstock]

77.3
73.7
73.3
72.7

These are the percentages that our guards are shooting from the line. This is abysmal and if we cannot make free throws down the stretch, its going to end up being a disappointing end to the season. Not to mention Carey is only shooting 63.2% from the line. We have to be one of the worst FT shooting teams in the country. No doubt we are safely off of the bubble if some of these missed FT go in

Uh, that is FAR from abyssmal.

Sherm was a career < 70% FT shooter. 63% as a Sr.
Pearl was 72.9 for his career.
Jason Hart - 71% career.
Moten - 72%
Scoop was 69% (not so NICE ), including a mind-boggling 55% as a Sr.
Greg "Money" Monroe - 70%
MCW - 68%

GMac and Gillon were $ from the line. 89% & 86%
But they were the exceptions.

Some of our "good" FT shooting guards:
Red, Dion & Triche - 75%
Andy Rautins - 76%
Ennis - 77%
Cooney - 80%
Devo - 79%
Jonny - 78%

Anybody who was around for Cuse hoops during the 80's, does NOT think that ~73% from the FT line is "abyssmal".
Especially when 75-80% is pretty damn good by Syracuse (or most any teams') standards.

 

[cuseinseattle]

What you are talking about is a player failing to respond to coaching. All need to do better

I personally don't think not having players on the foul line makes a difference.

 

[cuseinseattle]

That strategy makes zero sense but he's paranoid about not getting back. If it made any sense at least a few teams would copy. I'm not aware of anybody else doing that. And it's ironic cuz historically we're a very mediocre FT shooting team.

University of Washington also does it. I know Pitt keeps people on the line. Jamie Dixon did it at the end of a tournament game against Butler a fews years back. I'm trying to remember what happened.

 

[JeremyCuse]

All I know is we have to shoot better from the line. Wether we have one or 4 people its maddening knowing that at best were probably going 1-2 at the line (assuming its a double bonus situation) and that Oshae has a better chance of being elected to congress then completing a three point play.

 

[kcsu]

Good idea. Call into JAB's show and suggest that. We practice them like crazy and OB practices them like crazy. It is clearly psych thing at this point. He is not shooting and he is aiming.

Are you sure there is an emphasis on it. Meaning you miss you run

 

[Fat tire 13]

Simple analysis

Last year we were 94th in FT percentage
This year we are 274th in FT percentage

It's pretty much the same team. And sure Buddy is better than Moyer at FTs

 

[Consigliere]

The amazing thing is that essentially the same team LED the ACC in FT% last year! Unbelievable regression.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Uh, that is FAR from abyssmal.

Sherm was a career < 70% FT shooter. 63% as a Sr.
Pearl was 72.9 for his career.
Jason Hart - 71% career.
Moten - 72%
Scoop was 69% (not so NICE ), including a mind-boggling 55% as a Sr.
Greg "Money" Monroe - 70%
MCW - 68%

GMac and Gillon were $ from the line. 89% & 86%
But they were the exceptions.

Some of our "good" FT shooting guards:
Red, Dion & Triche - 75%
Andy Rautins - 76%
Ennis - 77%
Cooney - 80%
Devo - 79%
Jonny - 78%

Anybody who was around for Cuse hoops during the 80's, does NOT think that ~73% from the FT line is "abyssmal".
Especially when 75-80% is pretty damn good by Syracuse (or most any teams') standards.

This is a great post.

The ft% guys "should" have myth is right there up with the number of bigs that "should" average ten rebounds a game. These things are never as common achievements as people think.

 

[bpo57]

University of Washington also does it. I know Pitt keeps people on the line. Jamie Dixon did it at the end of a tournament game against Butler a fews years back. I'm trying to remember what happened.

I've seen people do it at the end of games but not during the middle of the game.

 

[bpo57]

I personally don't think not having players on the foul line makes a difference.

I'd like to agree with you but I've watched too many of SU's opponents grab critical rebounds off their own missed FTs. I've seen that movie a couple of dozen times. And as stated before, wouldn't you expect more than one or two teams to do it if it makes so much sense?