JB says Dion is unguardable

[orangefan13]

There are going to be nights when Triche will only get one basket off the dribble outside of fast breaks. But there isn't going to be a night when Dion gets less then three layups in the halfcourt.

What happens when our starters aren't getting it done. Then we put in Triche Southerland and CJ the defense buckles down on our shooters and plays fair alittle tighter? We will be SOL.
Neither Triche or James are great three point shooters off the dribble. James doesn't have the quickest release and sometimes his shot looks way off while others hes just unstoppable.

Makes more sense to have a shooter, a dribble attacker, and a midrange specialist like CJ come off the bench. Just bring alittle bit of everything off the bench. That will frustrate anyone all year long.
If there is one thing I am sure of if A guy like Scoop can create off some early isolation game in and out, then putting Dion in after him makes our isolation even better as the game goes on.
That just adds insult to injury game in and out.

I also feel we don't need Dion to take over we just need him to do what hes doing. This teams well roundedness and unselfishness is a strength. Starting Dion puts him in a run the offense through him role rather then a tempo changer role. And you don't sit guys you run the offense through you play them 32 mpg. That plays out of our unselfish look and could make Dion tired during comebacks and close games. Games where we need his spark on both ends (pressing and tight D also) with 10 minutes left.

But I don't doubt Dion is good enough to run the offense for 32 mpg game. And that is a SCARY thought.


IMO though this is a REALLY GOOD DEBATE.

 

[Cusefan0307]

If anything dion should start over scoop not triche, but there is no need to change roles when have not lost. All three guards have played key roles in different games and all 3 guards have had games they have not been good in. Basically it's to close to call and that is why we are having the debate in the first place. They have played equal minutes and are the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th leading scores on the team.

 

[orangefan13]

Also I feel Triche is not a solid second scoring option that is why he had so much trouble early in the year when Melo and Scoop weren't rolling. I feel he is more of a third option. Like a Duany Rautins like Role. What made rautins so dangerous was he was our third scoring option. A big reason the loss of AO killed us that year. Typically you look for your second option to be more of a isolation scorer which Triche isn't yet.

Putting Triche in the starting lineup makes him a reliable upperclass third option. Playing him with CJ and Southerland at the end of the first half will play away from our strengths though. Teams will just play our shooters tighter. If anythign though it could atleast wear them out some going into halftime.

 

[SaintTristan]

Complacency is a plague. The argument that we shouldnt change things up because we have not lost is quite frankly ed.

We have not played a single team that will make the sweet 16. we are doing well, but have not done much yet other than what we should have done.

Triche and Scoop have earned the starting spots we're undefeated with them as starters.

So I guess RAK has earned his starting spot too because we are undefreated with his few mins a game? ouch.

 

[omniorange]

Complacency is a plague. The argument that we shouldnt change things up because we have not lost is quite frankly ed.

We have not played a single team that will make the sweet 16.

*cough*Florida*cough*

Cheers,
Neil

 

[SaintTristan]

*cough*Florida*cough*

lol - the team that lost to rutgers? cough*they *suck*cough

 

[otto123]

Also I feel Triche is not a solid second scoring option that is why he had so much trouble early in the year when Melo and Scoop weren't rolling. I feel he is more of a third option. Like a Duany Rautins like Role. What made rautins so dangerous was he was our third scoring option. A big reason the loss of AO killed us that year. Typically you look for your second option to be more of a isolation scorer which Triche isn't yet.

Putting Triche in the starting lineup makes him a reliable upperclass third option. Playing him with CJ and Southerland at the end of the first half will play away from our strengths though. Teams will just play our shooters tighter. If anythign though it could atleast wear them out some going into halftime.

That's why Waiters SHOULD start we need another scorer next to KJ to get us going in games earlier.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Tristan forgot the Florida game cause dion went something like 1 for 9 with 4 pts

 

[omniorange]

lol - the team that lost to rutgers? cough*they *suck*cough

I seem to recall a championship team that lost to Rutgers during the regular season back in 2003.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[CorduroyG]

lol - the team that lost to rutgers? cough*they *suck*cough

I seem to recall a certain team in 2003 that lost to a stuff rutgers team that went on to do some great things

 

[CorduroyG]

hahaha wow thats freaky

 

[moqui]

That's why he should start the man has earned it

and the guy who is 83-13 as a starter hasn't?

 

[Cusefan0307]

Tristan seriously what is your issue with bt. Everyone has had their opportunity at the end of games. Scoop and dion at nc state and providence. Dion and bt during Stanford and v tech. Brandon and scoop against Florida. It is going to be that way all year,get used to it, nobody is going to play 30min. Calling bt a free throw specialist is just dumb. He's shooting 43 percent from 3. He's got a higher assist to turnover ratio than dion. I get it dion is talented. I like dion. He could start,but he is not going to. This debate is going to go on all year. You are acting like dion never makes a mistake. Scoop, Brandon, and dion are all going to take turns being the most important player that night.

 

[otto123]

and the guy who is 83-13 as a starter hasn't?

The guy who hasn't gotten us passed the sweet 16?

 

[moqui]

The guy who hasn't gotten us passed the sweet 16?

well, if that is going to be your standard, then I guess you want to bench everyone who has matriculated the last 8 years

 

[SaintTristan]

well, if that is going to be your standard, then I guess you want to bench everyone who has matriculated the last 8 years

no one is saying anyone should be benched. Thats silly.

Some are saying that we should start our best players. and anyone with any knowledge of this game knows that includes DW and means Triche should become a very solid 6th or 7th man off the bench.

triche is a role player. DW is a star. Both are essential parts to a winning team. we are lucky to be having debates like this. JB is an enviable position.

 

[OrangeMuskyFish]

I think the guy that said early on in the thread that JB is mostly just trying to keep the peace was dead on.

I think much more noticeable than Triche sitting at the end, was that MCW never got back in. This kid gets better and better every game, and I still think that when the tournament rolls around, this kid is going to get his shot to play 20 minutes a game. It's a bit conspiracy theory-ish, but I think JB wants to keep him under wraps as much as possible.

 

[SaintTristan]

This kid gets better and better every game, and I still think that when the tournament rolls around, this kid is going to get his shot to play 20 minutes a game. It's a bit conspiracy theory-ish, but I think JB wants to keep him under wraps as much as possible.

Not sure if JB is trying to keep him underwraps or what, but I will say this - I can't recall the last player who is game to game improvement was so obvious. MCW is doing his homework.

 

[orangepassion]

As long Dion's playing good minutes, why does it matter when during the game he plays them? Would we better than undefeated if Dion was starting? The only thing starting Dion for Triche would do is possibly hurt Triche's confidence. I don't need Dion needs the confidence boost.

 

[Dcuse]

I think the guy that said early on in the thread that JB is mostly just trying to keep the peace was dead on.

I think much more noticeable than Triche sitting at the end, was that MCW never got back in. This kid gets better and better every game, and I still think that when the tournament rolls around, this kid is going to get his shot to play 20 minutes a game. It's a bit conspiracy theory-ish, but I think JB wants to keep him under wraps as much as possible.

Two things: How long have you been an SU fan? Boeheim doesn't coach to keep peace. He coaches to win. If feelings are hurt,it's Hopkins,Autrey,McNamara and Sims to the rescue.

2. MCW-20 minutes a game when tournament time rolls around- How much money you got?

 

[MyMeloMyMan]

and the guy who is 83-13 as a starter hasn't?

3 time world champion Dickie Simpkins agrees...

 

[JoeSU]

The layup with the soft kiss high, high off the glass when PC was making a run was a thing of beauty.

I thought it was Pearl-esque.

 

[orangefan13]

I think the reasons Triche should start outweight the reasons Dion should start. Just my two cents.
I haven't thought of everything but I feel the reasons stated earlier weighed more towards Triche starting.

And it has nothing to do with who deserves it or is the better player but whats best for the team.
Now if Melo and Scoop weren't geting it done then I would start Dion with triche, but we probably would drop out of the top 3 if that was the case.

 

[pfister1]

While everyone is playing well, we are winning games handily, everyone appears satisfied with their roles and the chemistry seems to be terrific why would you change the starting lineup before something forced you to?

Team chemistry can be a funny thing; very important but hard to capture and easy to upset. To the extent that Dion's play continues to surpass that of Scoop and/or Brandon that can be dealt with through the allocation of his minutes without "demoting" a more experienced veteran.

 

[JoeSU]

That's why he should start the man has earned it

The emphasis on who "starts"is very "CYO-league". I honestly think the players care far more about minutes and being on the floor at crunch time than they do about who happens to be sent out for the opening tip (another aspect of the game which has lost any meaning). Waiters would not get any more recognition if he started.

As for who plays and the substitution pattern, I have been watching JB coach, and listened to him explain his coaching decisions (with disdain), since he took over the team. Trust me - all he cares about is winning. He's not trying to "keep someone under wraps", "keep the peace", or plays other head games. Which players are on the floor at any juncture of the game is based entirely on what the particular situation calls for - the score, skill set that is needed, whether a player is having a good night, what the opposition is giving us, the foul situation, how the guys on the floor compliment each other, etc. In a sense, he reminds me of the way Earl Waver used to platoon his outfielders to maximize their collective productivity.

Case in point: the other night Scoop and Waiters were on the floor at the end because they're our best ball handlers, despite the fact that Triche had a great game. If the score was closer, I would expect to see Triche on the floor, even if he had a crappy game to that point, because the other team would be fouling us and he's out best FT shooter.