Judge's ruling favors NCAA athletes seeking 2nd transfer

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[Sherman20]

What a joke. The NCAA has a right to
Implement NIL guardrails and transfer rules as they see fit. We cannot have college sports turn into the Wild West. It’s already bad enough.

 

[two3zone]

What a joke. The NCAA has a right to
Implement NIL guardrails and transfer rules as they see fit. We cannot have college sports turn into the Wild West. It’s already bad enough.

College sports is going to have to die for it to be what it used to be.

 

[Dcuse]

College sports is going to have to die for it to be what it used to be.

It’s well on it’s way. Just watch.

 

[bballbeadle]

College sports is going to have to die for it to be what it used to be.

And then after ashes have cooled, the Big East will rise like a phoenix in the wine dark sunrise to once again reign supreme and bring fire and locusts to the quaking world!

Oh, who am I kidding?

 

[lionf96]

These are student athletes. Want to put rules like this transfer rule, then you gotta share that TV money and properly pay them like the professionals they are. Don't put the burden of paying them on the fans because NIL is just side money.

 

[Fly Rodder]

College sports is going to have to die for it to be what it used to be.

I'm OK with that. College sports has been an exercise in ill gotten gains for a looooong time.

 

[Sherman20]

Yes, the NCAA should have made NIL and transfer reforms years ago. But federal judges shouldn’t be making decisions about college sports. Pro sports have contract restrictions and limits on free agency. We can’t have players transferring every year. There has to be some stability and limits on player movement. To gain that stability, the NCAA schools may have to create contracts and pay the players directly. All the constant player movement is already alienating many fans.

 

[cuseincincy]

I don't like federal judges or state attorney generals involving themselves in college athletics but the NCAA has brought it on themselves with their arbitrary partial rule enforcement. The NCAA opened the portal during covid and then without telling anyone they decided to start closing it down and enforcing some of their rules some of the time. Kids were transferring all over unchecked and then the NCAA decided if its your 2nd transfer we are going to make you have a degree before you can go to another school. Unless, you can submit a reason we approve of like health reasons or any other reason they deem adequate. Two problems here...1) Having a degree is not and never has been (to my knowledge) a requirement to play college basketball. 2) The evaluation of reasons deemed adequate is completely arbitrary and unchecked. Some D-wad in Indianapolis is making that decision and deciding what to decide on.

To be clear, I am not in favor of the current wild wild west situation. But the NCAA needs to make sure people are aware when they decide to change how and when they are evaluating transfers. The sit a year rule that has always been in place serves no one. It is purely a deterrent. Announce, "Hey! We are going to begin enforcing these transfer rules again as of X date." That never happened and they had allowed the expectation that transfers were essentially open and unchecked. They allowed players, and schools, to make these decisions based on an assumption that the current atmosphere was not changing. And then this year the NCAA decided to start telling some kids no. After they had uprooted their lives and made their life decision based on an assumption that things would remain the same.

University of Cincinnati a great example. They brought in 2 transfer centers each on their 3rd school. Initially both were denied eligibility. Then both appealed and were denied. Then the Ohio AG sent a letter to the NCAA and suddenly Azziz Bandaogo (Akron/Utah Valley St) is declared eligible right before Thanksgiving. But Jamille Reynolds (UCF/Temple) is/was still ineligible. Why? Because someone at the NCAA decided that his reason (mental health) was not adequate. Is mental health an easy "excuse"? Possibly. But it's impossible to adequately refute and discount. Reynolds is a St Pete kid, went to UCF and then transferred to Temple. His 1st week at Temple he had a gun pulled on him in while leaving a restaurant and then also had a friend of his robbed while meeting to workout and also someone he knew in Philly was killed. He "didn't feel safe" but the NCAA determined that was not a valid mental health concern. That arbitrary enforcement is what drew the attention of the state AG's.

For now, the NCAA needs to (and has announced they won't enforce the sit out year. Now they need to determine what they do want to enforce and announce it with adequate lead time to implement it and not negatively impacted decisions already made that significantly impact individual lives.

 

[Hoo's That]

These are student athletes. Want to put rules like this transfer rule, then you gotta share that TV money and properly pay them like the professionals they are. Don't put the burden of paying them on the fans because NIL is just side money.

OK. Which men's sports get cut because there's less money since the women's sports are pretty safe because of Title IX?

 

[Sherman20]

I don't like federal judges or state attorney generals involving themselves in college athletics but the NCAA has brought it on themselves with their arbitrary partial rule enforcement. The NCAA opened the portal during covid and then without telling anyone they decided to start closing it down and enforcing some of their rules some of the time. Kids were transferring all over unchecked and then the NCAA decided if its your 2nd transfer we are going to make you have a degree before you can go to another school. Unless, you can submit a reason we approve of like health reasons or any other reason they deem adequate. Two problems here...1) Having a degree is not and never has been (to my knowledge) a requirement to play college basketball. 2) The evaluation of reasons deemed adequate is completely arbitrary and unchecked. Some D-wad in Indianapolis is making that decision and deciding what to decide on.

To be clear, I am not in favor of the current wild wild west situation. But the NCAA needs to make sure people are aware when they decide to change how and when they are evaluating transfers. The sit a year rule that has always been in place serves no one. It is purely a deterrent. Announce, "Hey! We are going to begin enforcing these transfer rules again as of X date." That never happened and they had allowed the expectation that transfers were essentially open and unchecked. They allowed players, and schools, to make these decisions based on an assumption that the current atmosphere was not changing. And then this year the NCAA decided to start telling some kids no. After they had uprooted their lives and made their life decision based on an assumption that things would remain the same.

University of Cincinnati a great example. They brought in 2 transfer centers each on their 3rd school. Initially both were denied eligibility. Then both appealed and were denied. Then the Ohio AG sent a letter to the NCAA and suddenly Azziz Bandaogo (Akron/Utah Valley St) is declared eligible right before Thanksgiving. But Jamille Reynolds (UCF/Temple) is/was still ineligible. Why? Because someone at the NCAA decided that his reason (mental health) was not adequate. Is mental health an easy "excuse"? Possibly. But it's impossible to adequately refute and discount. Reynolds is a St Pete kid, went to UCF and then transferred to Temple. His 1st week at Temple he had a gun pulled on him in while leaving a restaurant and then also had a friend of his robbed while meeting to workout and also someone he knew in Philly was killed. He "didn't feel safe" but the NCAA determined that was not a valid mental health concern. That arbitrary enforcement is what drew the attention of the state AG's.

For now, the NCAA needs to (and has announced they won't enforce the sit out year. Now they need to determine what they do want to enforce and announce it with adequate lead time to implement it and not negatively impacted decisions already made that significantly impact individual lives.

This is also a complete changing the rules within the current season. Some coaches, including Red, likely decided not to pursue two-time transfers like Bandaogo or Efton Reid (now at Wake) or that center from Oklahoma State because they believed they wouldn’t get a two-time transfer exception and were looking for a player who would be available immediately. It’s totally changed the calculus mid stream and put some schools at an advantage while others were trying to play by the rules.

 

[Brooky03]

Want to control players? Pay them.

That’s it. Pay them a wage, then you get to tell them what they can and can’t do.

Market factors will decide what wage is appropriate without bankrupting schools or the NCAA. A luxury tax system would even the playing field to some extent, too.

Eliminate scholarships. Make the base pay equivalent to the cost of tuition and room and board.

 

[djcon57]

Yes, the NCAA should have made NIL and transfer reforms years ago. But federal judges shouldn’t be making decisions about college sports. Pro sports have contract restrictions and limits on free agency. We can’t have players transferring every year. There has to be some stability and limits on player movement. To gain that stability, the NCAA schools may have to create contracts and pay the players directly. All the constant player movement is already alienating many fans.

Based on what?

It's alleged the rule's waiver process violated federal antitrust law. Why wouldn't they have a say in the process?

 

[Fly Rodder]

Yes, the NCAA should have made NIL and transfer reforms years ago. But federal judges shouldn’t be making decisions about college sports. Pro sports have contract restrictions and limits on free agency. We can’t have players transferring every year. There has to be some stability and limits on player movement. To gain that stability, the NCAA schools may have to create contracts and pay the players directly. All the constant player movement is already alienating many fans.

I get the sentiment, but the NCAA has had 75 years (or more) to figure out what to do about their college sports being a money making machine. Their plan for 75 years (or more) has been to keep cashing their checks and exploiting college athletes while saying that there's no problem. It took a federal judge, the ninth circuit of federal judges, and the Supreme Court to upend the apple cart and get the NCAA to realize that they were and had been breaking federal law.

Apparently the NCAA can't govern themselves, so here we are.

 

[jncuse]

Sometimes I wonder if the NCAA has been more reasonable from 2000-2015 if things would be where they are now. Had allowed one "free" transfer, allowed some compensation, had a system where kids couldn't get Calhouned out at the end of a year for reasons not related to academics or behavior.

But when they continued to use the "Student" athletes excuse to their own full benefit, the NCAA set the ball rolling where people rightfully challenged things -- and now the ball has gone too far.

But as people have said - if the NCAA set up a system where the kids were fairly compensated by the school themselves it would solve a lot of things.

I will say this though - with NIL you are getting more of the better 3,4 or 5 years sticking around in the NCAA instead of jumping to the NBA or other pro-leagues. Unfortunate that they transfer around though.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I will say this though - with NIL you are getting more of the better 3,4 or 5 years sticking around in the NCAA instead of jumping to the NBA or other pro-leagues. Unfortunate that they transfer around though.

Yea unfortunately it's a wash if they just hop from team to team.

 

[pwong]

I mean he’s not wrong, once NIL got involved its a job not “student athletes”

 

[Hoo's That]

I get the sentiment, but the NCAA has had 75 years (or more) to figure out what to do about their college sports being a money making machine. Their plan for 75 years (or more) has been to keep cashing their checks and exploiting college athletes while saying that there's no problem. It took a federal judge, the ninth circuit of federal judges, and the Supreme Court to upend the apple cart and get the NCAA to realize that they were and had been breaking federal law.

Apparently the NCAA can't govern themselves, so here we are.

2023-75=1948 There was no money to be made in college sports back then,

Some money started to show up with the national contract with ABC for college football and NCAA HQ had total control over it and which teams made appearances. In 1984, once the Supreme Court took control over TV away from NCAA HQ and gave it to the schools, the real money that we see now stated making its first appearance. I imagine arguments could be made that it really got going in the 90s. The schools (which really are the NCAA) still want the sit-out transfer rule, so they didn't pass any changes to it without being coerced. If the lack of consistency re: hardship transfers is the reason for this ruling then the easiest solution is just get rid of them. One free undergraduate transfer and that's it. Isn't that mean, cruel, and heartless? Yeah, and ...

 

[Hoo's That]

Sometimes I wonder if the NCAA has been more reasonable from 2000-2015 if things would be where they are now. Had allowed one "free" transfer, allowed some compensation, had a system where kids couldn't get Calhouned out at the end of a year for reasons not related to academics or behavior.

{snip}

This happens all the time at every school. There are 85 scholarships in football. That's 17 apiece for the 5 classes that make up most every team. There are 13 scholarships for basketball, There is some redshirting, but not as widespread as in football, so 3 recruits a year. Most schools recruit more than the average numbers each year, so somebody is being forced out over and above people who leave of their own volition.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[lionf96]

OK. Which men's sports get cut because there's less money since the women's sports are pretty safe because of Title IX?

You'll have to ask the university what sports they are going to remove because football and basketball players are no longer student athletes.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

We can’t have players transferring every year. There has to be some stability and limits on player movement.

Why? The mission of the colleges and universities, of which their athletic departments are a part, is education, not sports.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

OK. Which men's sports get cut because there's less money since the women's sports are pretty safe because of Title IX?

The scholarships have to be equal.

 

[Toga]

Latest development

NCAA, states seek to extend restraining order letting transfer athletes play through the spring

The NCAA and a coalition of states have jointly asked a federal court to extend a small window for multiple-transfer athletes to compete through at least the winter and spring

buffalonews.com

 

[lionf96]

Why? The mission of the colleges and universities, of which their athletic departments are a part, is education, not sports.

That's not the reality. Football and basketball are about making money. All this conference realignment and all those rules that they imposed on the athletes that were not in place for regular students proves that.

Now they are being forced to give athletes freedom, it's not because they are suddenly thinking about their quality education.