Let’s forget Talent and NIL for a minute

[cusefan88]

Yea I’m one that thinks, red knows basketball better than me. He knows how to coach better than me. Give him some time to figure it out. I certainly don’t wanna lose the recruits we have next year but…. After three quarters of the season, they still have no clue how to defend a screen and don’t move without the ball on offense. The most basic stuff. Things these players should already know coming out of high school and they aren’t doing it at all. I’m a die hard fan that dreads watching games now. Gotta make a change as soon as possible is my new feeling.

There is no recruit worth keeping if the coaching can't make players do basic things.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Everything you just said is Talent and NIL. You just made the argument for the polar opposite of your intention.

No I didn't. Case in point. JJ Starling is the worsT defensive player I have ever seen for someone with his footspeed.

 

[LAorange44]

Players love Red. They are making boatloads of cash with no consequences or accountability for losing.

 

[Red2003]

If I may add the missing word that no one has said yet. Leadership.

I don't even know who the Team captain is and it's mid February. Who's the guy? With the game on the line needing to just hit a free throw to win a game with 0.0 on the clock I wouldn't trust a single player.

-JJ does not have leadership qualities, he does not play defense either and is way too inconsistent.
-Bell the next closest thing to a veteran on this team with 75+ ACC Starts is a nightmare
-Eddie I thought could jump into that leadership role but most of the season He seems happy just to get the stats.
-Carlos is a deer in headlights
-Freshman should not need to be the leader over Jr's and Sr's with hundreds of NCAA starts. Freeman maybe more than others but we know how that went.
-The other portalers were brought in as role guys and are not leaders either.

The staff are #1 to blame, but #2 there is no guy in the locker room that has any confidence or motivation to hold his teammates accountable. They all need to get gone before tip next year.

 

[EnviroSciGuy]

Everything you just said is Talent and NIL. You just made the argument for the polar opposite of your intention.

Effort is talent and NIL? Huh????

 

[5OutFred]

It's mildly humorous that Hubert Davis' seat is warmer than Red's, coming off an NCAA 1 seed and previous national championship game appearance.

SU is contending to make the ACC tournament. Not a serious program right now.

 

[Red2003]

It's mildly humorous that Hubert Davis' seat is warmer than Red's, coming off an NCAA 1 seed and previous national championship game appearance.

SU is contending to make the ACC tournament. Not a serious program right now.

A decent Stanford beat UNC at Chapel Hill by 1, they were ready to fire him, We went to Stanford and started the game 25-2. No one even was shocked anymore, just usual for this team.

Not serious.

 

[Sbucketball]

It's mildly humorous that Hubert Davis' seat is warmer than Red's, coming off an NCAA 1 seed and previous national championship game appearance.

SU is contending to make the ACC tournament. Not a serious program right now.

Given what we heard about Red's first contract, I'd hate to see the extension if he made the championship game his first year.

Davis made tournament 2 of 4 years including one year making championship game and other year winning the ACC.

Mike Woodson at IU is another one -- made tournament 2 of 4 years and is getting chased out.

Coach Cal got chased out of Kentucky for not advancing his protected seed teams.

Kenny Payne had an abysmal record but got fired after 2 years.

Juwan Howard won the league and made the tournament, made the tournament again the next year, and then was fired for two seasons with no tournament.

SMU fired its coach after two years despite him winning 20 games his last year.

 

[LAorange44]

The school seems to be happy cashing ACC checks until the wheels fall off the conference only to be left behind proclaiming “who could have seen this coming!”

 

[Scooch]

Effort is talent and NIL? Huh????

Well, it is now.

So many people were dead wrong about the talent level of this team back in August that it has to be NIL now. But it wasn't then.

It's very confusing. Just trust them.

 

[Millhouse]

I've said this before: it's not that we're losing, it's that we look like an AAU team doing it.

JW has to see that. Slim chance JW has confidence Red can turn it around and next year is more than treading water to tick a year off the contract.

If Red turns it around to become a TOP coach in college, which is what this program deserves, it would be so miraculous they'd make a move out of it starring Denzel.

This is it exactly
They have to show me that they have any idea what to do fundamentally
I'm open to the idea that NIL is something that needs to be addressed
But this offense where people stand around is separate from that
This defense where everyone keeps going under screens
Basic stuff
It's so obvious he's gotta go but they have a nobody with no leverage a ridiculous contact

What was red going to do if they low-ball him? Go to rutgers-newark?

 

[Grbac]

I think Red is trying but they obviously don’t respect him enough to listen and execute. That’s a huge problem.
He says I’ve told them over and over. Brother they have tuned you out. You have lost the locker room. You aren’t Him. They can see it.

You think a guy like Pitino comes in and they don’t listen. He would have this roster atleast above 500 right now.

These kids aren’t disabled. They have the physical talent to play good defense. Just not the pride and motivation to. It’s the intangibles that needs to be drilled into them. Effort, toughness, pride, attitude, hustle, etc etc.

 

[Dcuse]

No I didn't. Case in point. JJ Starling is the worsT defensive player I have ever seen for someone with his footspeed.

Isn't that desire? Isn't that on the player?

 

[PauliePeppas]

I have ZERO faith in Wildhack

 

[Cusefan0307]

Isn't that desire? Isn't that on the player?

Why did Joe Girard leave here and instantly get more in shape and become a better defensive player?

 

[Dcuse]

Effort is talent and NIL? Huh????

It's not?? Huh??

 

[hoopsupstate]

Defense if “want to!”

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Well, it is now.

So many people were dead wrong about the talent level of this team back in August that it has to be NIL now. But it wasn't then.

It's very confusing. Just trust them.

I do wonder

IF Freeman was healthy and

IF JJ didn't get hurt and

IF we had a better point guard than Carlos

how much more competitive we'd be.

I think we'd still have issues but I do think we'd be more middle pack ACC. That's not the goal, but it's better than where we are now.

Similar to last season where IF we had Jesse as our 5 I think we could have made the tournament.

Coaching is holding us back but talent gaps at key positions are a factor.

And I say that recognizing that Red is ultimately responsible for that.

 

[Scooch]

I do wonder

IF Freeman was healthy and

IF JJ didn't get hurt and

IF we had a better point guard than Carlos

how much more competitive we'd be.

I think we'd still have issues but I do think we'd be more middle pack ACC. That's not the goal, but it's better than where we are now.

Similar to last season where IF we had Jesse as our 5 I think we could have made the tournament.

Coaching is holding us back but talent gaps at key positions are a factor.

And I say that recognizing that Red is ultimately responsible for that.

I think that's fair. It is hard to say definitively how many wins the injuries to Starling and Freeman have cost us.

We were 6-8 in the games Freeman played this season, including some bad losses to ND and G'town.

Meanwhile we were 4-3 in the games where Starling and Freeman played together, including a loss to FSU.

So maybe we'd be a couple games better with those guys fully healthy?

I won't give them any breaks for the PG situation. The staff owns that. They targeted a kid from GA, even hired his college coach, and he went to UGA for $200K more. That's just a bad evaluation and a worse close on the deal, IMHO.

 

[RichmondCuse]

We have a team full of players who can't or won't play defense. No intensity, no toughness and no mindset. Your words.

Isn't that the definition of a talent issue?

I have no idea what we're teaching these guys in practice, but it's pretty obvious they're not doing it.

If I send you to the store to buy me a six-pack of Amstel Light, and you come back with Keystone Light, is that a talent issue or a coaching issue?

You're either coaching it or allowing it to happen.

 

[hoopsupstate]

I think that's fair. It is hard to say definitively how many wins the injuries to Starling and Freeman have cost us.

We were 6-8 in the games Freeman played this season, including some bad losses to ND and G'town.

Meanwhile we were 4-3 in the games where Starling and Freeman played together, including a loss to FSU.

So maybe we'd be a couple games better with those guys fully healthy?

I won't give them any breaks for the PG situation. The staff owns that. They targeted a kid from GA, even hired his college coach, and he went to UGA for $200K more. That's just a bad evaluation and a worse close on the deal, IMHO.

Watching Georgia play tells us that LaFew is not a point guard either. I question Bethea as a point guard too. He’s talented, but struggled dribbling the ball last night against Carlos.

 

[Scooch]

And none of that excuses the horrific loss last night. Not at all, in any way.

Miami owned the last 9 full minutes of that game. Tied at 61 with 9:13 left, and they beat us 30-23 the rest of the way and never trailed.

And it wasn't some fluke. We outrebounded them, were basically even in turnovers, made only 2 fewer threes... they just beat us. Straight up beat us because our defense is horrific.

 

[Scooch]

Watching Georgia play tells us that LaFew is not a point guard either. I question Bethea as a point guard too. He’s talented, but struggled dribbling the ball last night against Carlos.

Well, in fairness, we don't recruit point guards. We bring in combo guards and then are puzzled when none of them are John Stockton.

It is pretty funny that Leffew averaged a whopping 3.9 assists/game last year as a senior on a MAAC team. But he was totally going to distribute like Luka at SU. Even Carlos had 6.3 at Hofstra.

 

[NineOneSeven]

It sucks Freeman got hurt, if nothing else (quite literally) I was looking forward to seeing him develop.

This is simple to me. It’s talent AND coaching. Need better players to help mask meh coaching but lesser talent needs to be coached up to consistently compete.

How do upsets happen so much in the tournament? Almost always a team of lesser talent being coached up in a system that leads to effective results. And of course a little luck.

I see too many flawed all-around basketball players (lol Chris Bell? Come on people) being instructed by a guy who doesn’t seem to know what to do, too much of the time. This is what happens when that happens.

 

[phil77]

One of two problems and both lead to a problem with Red. It can't be anything else

-One he is coaching well and getting everything across crystal clear the entire team understands him everyone is on the same page AND THE TEAM JUST REFUSES TO LISTEN. This means from day 1 the team had 0 respect for RED as a head coach. This is his hand-picked team and they don't respect his coaching or leadership. Big negative against Red.

-Two he is trying to coach but he can't relay his thoughts or what he wants his players to do in a way his players all understand which leads to constant confusion. IF THIS IS THE PROBLEM THEN RED SHOULD RETIRE NOW. He can never get this back. He may be a nice guy and a recruiter and can connect on a personal level but if he can't get the technical side of coaching translated to his players then he will never be a head coach. This is also why first-time head coaches often start at lower levels so they learn how to do this.

Both are massive RED FLAGS and are something that I don't think Red can turn around in one off-season.