let this be our offense this year

[Alsacs]

Why I am not optimistic was that it took 3 years for that Elmhurst offense to click like a machine in 2012 and that offense had the D-3 POY Scottie Williams.

If we have to be patient with Lester this program is going to continue to be mediocre.

 

[Alsacs]

Care to point me to what you were reading? I'd like to see if I get the same reaction.

http://dailyorange.com/2015/04/tim-...1st-full-season-as-sus-offensive-coordinator/

http://sujuiceonline.com/2015/06/15/what-can-we-expect-from-tim-lesters-offense-at-syracuse/

Lester’s offenses at Elmhurst were not overly prolific, only once averaging over 30 points per game after taking out points for special teams and defensive scores. Like their FBS counterparts, top offenses in Division III roll up 40 or 50 points on a weekly basis, so Lester was not running a wide-open, explosive attack.

http://www.d3football.com/teams/Elmhurst/2011/index

 

[CIL]

That offense has a lot of Rich Rod in it.

 

[CIL]

http://dailyorange.com/2015/04/tim-...1st-full-season-as-sus-offensive-coordinator/

http://sujuiceonline.com/2015/06/15/what-can-we-expect-from-tim-lesters-offense-at-syracuse/

Lester’s offenses at Elmhurst were not overly prolific, only once averaging over 30 points per game after taking out points for special teams and defensive scores. Like their FBS counterparts, top offenses in Division III roll up 40 or 50 points on a weekly basis, so Lester was not running a wide-open, explosive attack.

http://www.d3football.com/teams/Elmhurst/2011/index

You do realize that Elmhurst was pretty bad before his arrival, don't you? In his last season there the fewest amount of points they scored was 24, and they went over 30 in 10 out of 12 games. I'd take that.

EDIT: They did only score 10 in a game they lost.

 

[PhatOrange]

Lester’s offenses at Elmhurst were not overly prolific, only once averaging over 30 points per game after taking out points for special teams and defensive scores. Like their FBS counterparts, top offenses in Division III roll up 40 or 50 points on a weekly basis, so Lester was not running a wide-open, explosive attack.

Regarding their FBS counterparts rolling up 40 or 50 points on a weekly basis, were their special team's and defensive scores also taken out of their totals?

 

[Alsacs]

You do realize that Elmhurst was pretty bad before his arrival, don't you? In his last season there the fewest amount of points they scored was 24, and they went over 30 in 10 out of 12 games. I'd take that.

EDIT: They did only score 10 in a game they lost.

I would take 25ppg, but that 2012 offense was the culmination of 4 year buildup. Lester is getting 4 years to build up his offense here and we won't have the equivalent of the D-3 POY in his offense this year. Our player will be better than the D-3 POY, but not in context to advantage he had on D-3 defenses.

 

[Alsacs]

Regarding their FBS counterparts rolling up 40 or 50 points on a weekly basis, were their special team's and defensive scores also taken out of their totals?

Yes. They were.
This site accounts for Def TDs.
http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/27

 

[CIL]

I would take 25ppg, but that 2012 offense was the culmination of 4 year buildup. Lester is getting 4 years to build up his offense here and we won't have the equivalent of the D-3 POY in his offense this year. Our player will be better than the D-3 POY, but not in context to advantage he had on D-3 defenses.

You are reading waaaay to much into this. I played d3 football. Coached at the HS and collegiate levels. There is very little NFL style in Lester's offense.

 

[TheCusian]

someday we'll hire an offensive coach where he knows and we know right off the bat what he's going to do without having to interpret radio interviews even marrone didn't figure it out until a couple years later.

We know his system. You can watch it on YouTube. Have you watched any of them yet? Please tell me you have before railing on him for the last 6 months...

 

[Millhouse]

We know his system. You can watch it on YouTube. Have you watched any of them yet? Please tell me you have before railing on him for the last 6 months...

in both 2011 and 2012, they had 1 WR in their top 4 in receptions.

that concerns me. hybrid players are fine, i'm fine with throwing to running backs when they're great (thurman thomas years were fun for me) but if only 1 WR is getting the ball when you throw 25-30 times a game, you're not going to be very explosive.

 

[Millhouse]

You are reading waaaay to much into this. I played d3 football. Coached at the HS and collegiate levels. There is very little NFL style in Lester's offense.

then he should talk about college offenses he likes. he is trying to get away from Cubit

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

in both 2011 and 2012, they had 1 WR in their top 4 in receptions.

that concerns me. hybrid players are fine, i'm fine with throwing to running backs when they're great (thurman thomas years were fun for me) but if only 1 WR is getting the ball when you throw 25-30 times a game, you're not going to be very explosive.

Sounds like an offense built around the players he had.

 

[TheCusian]

in both 2011 and 2012, they had 1 WR in their top 4 in receptions.

that concerns me. hybrid players are fine, i'm fine with throwing to running backs when they're great (thurman thomas years were fun for me) but if only 1 WR is getting the ball when you throw 25-30 times a game, you're not going to be very explosive.

Did you watch? You may not like what you see - but at least you'll have a better frame of reference (rather than a radio interview). Just my 2 cents.

 

[Millhouse]

Sounds like an offense built around the players he had.

by then most of those players would've been players he recruited

 

[Millhouse]

Did you watch? You may not like what you see - but at least you'll have a better frame of reference (rather than a radio interview). Just my 2 cents.

maybe he was FOS in the interview and he's going to run that offense. maybe he ran that offense because it was a poor program and he'll do something different here. i would be more encouraged if what we saw and what he says had any connection

if that offense is a lot more rich rodriguez than gary kubiak then SAY THAT. we have seen plenty rich rod and texans offenses in the dome. we are all in agreement about which was better

 

[Alsacs]

Sounds like an offense built around the players he had.

You can't say that and then ignore last year and he did as the OC. If the offense was built around what he had and he couldn't even put any semblance of an offense on the field that is concerning no matter whose playbook was being used.

I watched some Elmhurst games and was not impressed. If Lester got 4 years here I would bet by year 4 we would have a decent offense, but the patience is not going to allow that. I watched year 2 and 3 stuff to be fair and that didn't impress me. Also, having the best player in D-3 as his RB made his offense a lot easier to run the ball if necessary and at SU he will never the D-3 POY equivalent. He will have talent, but not Heisman talent right away.

 

[Finwad32]

If the blocking is taken care of, we will move the ball. The only time this Spring that the offense really struggled was when they couldn't get the run game or PA going because they struggled to block the 3-tech.

 

[Millhouse]

If the blocking is taken care of, we will move the ball. The only time this Spring that the offense really struggled was when they couldn't get the run game or PA going because they struggled to block the 3-tech.

i hope this isn't 2002 again when the offense looked great in the spring for reasons other than the offense being good.

shafer is a good defensive coach but it's too bad for him that his make or break year has so many new guys on defense.

 

[Alsacs]

By the way when I hear zone blocking I don't think of Mike Shanahan or Gary Kubiak I think of the OL coach Alex Gibbs. Gibbs taught that technique in all the offenses he was the OL coach for. He brought it to the Redskins and Falcons where he served as the OL coach after Denver. So if the thought is we are using those guys to describe OL blocking it is a lazy reason.

When I think of Shannhan or Kubiak I think of the strong armed-QB who can run the bootleg and have the arm strength to throw deep or check down and have an OL that cut blocks and plug in RBs to run the stretch play.

 

[Finwad32]

You can't say that and then ignore last year and he did as the OC. If the offense was built around what he had and he couldn't even put any semblance of an offense on the field that is concerning no matter whose playbook was being used.

I watched some Elmhurst games and was not impressed. If Lester got 4 years here I would bet by year 4 we would have a decent offense, but the patience is not going to allow that. I watched year 2 and 3 stuff to be fair and that didn't impress me. Also, having the best player in D-3 as his RB made his offense a lot easier to run the ball if necessary and at SU he will never the D-3 POY equivalent. He will have talent, but not Heisman talent right away.

Lester had a really strong year in 2012, a history making year at Elmhurst. And, since he left, they've done nothing.

My main point is that the offense didn't go because they had such a tremendous talent at RB. Scotty Williams had been there since 2009, and then he exploded in 2012. he was 5'5 175 lbs. Don't get me wrong, he was steady in 2011 and 2010, but, the reason his statistics exploded were because the team and the offense became more productive. He got more carries because they were able to move the chains more. Chicken or the egg?

 

[Finwad32]

i hope this isn't 2002 again when the offense looked great in the spring for reasons other than the offense being good.

shafer is a good defensive coach but it's too bad for him that his make or break year has so many new guys on defense.

Well, one reason it looked great is because it's not an offense the defense would typically prepare for. In the beginning of the Spring, the O dominated because our D's base packages weren't designed to stop it. As the Spring went on, the Defense adjusted.

One positive of this offense that I like, is that most teams will only have a week to prepare for something they'll most likely only see once all season.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

You can't say that and then ignore last year and he did as the OC. If the offense was built around what he had and he couldn't even put any semblance of an offense on the field that is concerning no matter whose playbook was being used.

I watched some Elmhurst games and was not impressed. If Lester got 4 years here I would bet by year 4 we would have a decent offense, but the patience is not going to allow that. I watched year 2 and 3 stuff to be fair and that didn't impress me. Also, having the best player in D-3 as his RB made his offense a lot easier to run the ball if necessary and at SU he will never the D-3 POY equivalent. He will have talent, but not Heisman talent right away.

So Lester was supposed to scrap the offense that was in place and put in a new one mid-season? Granted, the jet sweeps didn't work after Lester took over and put them in. But overall, in my mind, Lester had no choice but to keep the same system- a system that wasn't his. The offense wasn't built around what he had, but there wasn't much he could do about it mid-season. So to blame him for the offense's struggles in 2014 is far too easy of a cop-out.

I'm not a huge Lester fan, and this offense doesn't have me all that excited, but we got what we got.

 

[Finwad32]

i hope this isn't 2002 again when the offense looked great in the spring for reasons other than the offense being good.

shafer is a good defensive coach but it's too bad for him that his make or break year has so many new guys on defense.

Our secondary is alot more scrappy than I thought they'd be for their size. LB play is going to be fine, there will be a learning curve but it's a talented unit. The DLine is going to be a work in progress. We need to stay healthy there. We may see some tighter games this year because it's possible we'll get attacked via the run more than usual.

But if i'm a big time team with big time wide outs, I'm attacking our corners.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

By the way when I hear zone blocking I don't think of Mike Shanahan or Gary Kubiak I think of the OL coach Alex Gibbs. Gibbs taught that technique in all the offenses he was the OL coach for. He brought it to the Redskins and Falcons where he served as the OL coach after Denver. So if the thought is we are using those guys to describe OL blocking it is a lazy reason.

When I think of Shannhan or Kubiak I think of the strong armed-QB who can run the bootleg and have the arm strength to throw deep or check down and have an OL that cut blocks and plug in RBs to run the stretch play.

I have no idea Alex Gibbs is and had no idea that Zone Blocking was his thing. I gave my interpretation of Lester's comments. If you and Millhouse want to keep taking everything so literally, that's fine. We're all going to be wrong anyway.

 

[TheCusian]

You can't say that and then ignore last year and he did as the OC. If the offense was built around what he had and he couldn't even put any semblance of an offense on the field that is concerning no matter whose playbook was being used.

I watched some Elmhurst games and was not impressed. If Lester got 4 years here I would bet by year 4 we would have a decent offense, but the patience is not going to allow that. I watched year 2 and 3 stuff to be fair and that didn't impress me. Also, having the best player in D-3 as his RB made his offense a lot easier to run the ball if necessary and at SU he will never the D-3 POY equivalent. He will have talent, but not Heisman talent right away.

That's like watching year one or two of Hackett and drawing a conclusion. He was a different OC by year 4, running a better system. Lester built that offense at Elmhurst with crappy players at first. It's not going to look pretty. The end product was different than the starting point.

The game I watched, the defense loaded up to take away his stud RB and they threw it all over the place against a superior opponent (to whom they would lose to, I think. I gave up mid-4th).