let this be our offense this year

[Alsacs]

So Lester was supposed to scrap the offense that was in place and put in a new one mid-season? Granted, the jet sweeps didn't work after Lester took over and put them in. But overall, in my mind, Lester had no choice but to keep the same system- a system that wasn't his. The offense wasn't built around what he had, but there wasn't much he could do about it mid-season. So to blame him for the offense's struggles in 2014 is far too easy of a cop-out.

I'm not a huge Lester fan, and this offense doesn't have me all that excited, but we got what we got.

Lester lost a lot of the benefit of the doubt from me when he had a bye week before the Pitt/BC games to end the season, and our offense looked like a Pop Warner team could stop us. There was nothing. We didn't have Estime or Broyld, but Jarrod West was healthy and he had the RBs. Our offense was pathetic. We would have been better off forfeiting than playing those 2 games.

I never said Lester was suppose to scrap the offense you said it sounds like an offense built around what he has. Lester should have been able to build better with what he had. Shafer poisoned Lester's well by publicly naming him OC after the McDonald garbage. He should have said it will be handled by the offensive coaches and not named Lester.

I have been watching Lester and have developed my current opinions by what I have seen. I want him to succeed, but I don't see it happening this year. I hope I am wrong though.

 

[TheCusian]

So Lester was supposed to scrap the offense that was in place and put in a new one mid-season? Granted, the jet sweeps didn't work after Lester took over and put them in. But overall, in my mind, Lester had no choice but to keep the same system- a system that wasn't his. The offense wasn't built around what he had, but there wasn't much he could do about it mid-season. So to blame him for the offense's struggles in 2014 is far too easy of a cop-out.

I'm not a huge Lester fan, and this offense doesn't have me all that excited, but we got what we got.

Not to mention the quotes from Lester saying that the WR and OL were taking the wrong 1st step half the time. Poor leadership at the top = takes time to rebuild.

 

[Alsacs]

I have no idea Alex Gibbs is and had no idea that Zone Blocking was his thing. I gave my interpretation of Lester's comments. If you and Millhouse want to keep taking everything so literally, that's fine. We're all going to be wrong anyway.

I thought you did a fine job. I am more upset the freaking OC can't explain what the heck he is taking from those guys. If it is zone blocking he should say that we have no freaking clue. You actually did the best job of anybody him included at giving a good plausible explanation.

 

[TheCusian]

By the way when I hear zone blocking I don't think of Mike Shanahan or Gary Kubiak I think of the OL coach Alex Gibbs. Gibbs taught that technique in all the offenses he was the OL coach for. He brought it to the Redskins and Falcons where he served as the OL coach after Denver. So if the thought is we are using those guys to describe OL blocking it is a lazy reason.

When I think of Shannhan or Kubiak I think of the strong armed-QB who can run the bootleg and have the arm strength to throw deep or check down and have an OL that cut blocks and plug in RBs to run the stretch play.

Remember the audience. It was radio and 5 minutes long in total.

 

[Millhouse]

That's like watching year one or two of Hackett and drawing a conclusion. He was a different OC by year 4, running a better system. Lester built that offense at Elmhurst with crappy players at first. It's not going to look pretty. The end product was different than the starting point.

The game I watched, the defense loaded up to take away his stud RB and they threw it all over the place against a superior opponent (to whom they would lose to, I think. I gave up mid-4th).

i was not upset about shafer getting the job but you have to wonder what would've happened if hackett got the job instead.

he needs to get away from marrone. the only good offense they ever had was the one where marrone got out of the way and gave him so little time to overhaul it that they were forced to go very simple and very college. and it worked! but then it was right back to white knuckle the next two years

 

[TheCusian]

maybe he was FOS in the interview and he's going to run that offense. maybe he ran that offense because it was a poor program and he'll do something different here. i would be more encouraged if what we saw and what he says had any connection

if that offense is a lot more rich rodriguez than gary kubiak then SAY THAT. we have seen plenty rich rod and texans offenses in the dome. we are all in agreement about which was better

You can keep trying to decipher a 5 minute radio interview or you could watch game tape.

 

[Alsacs]

That's like watching year one or two of Hackett and drawing a conclusion. He was a different OC by year 4, running a better system. Lester built that offense at Elmhurst with crappy players at first. It's not going to look pretty. The end product was different than the starting point.

The game I watched, the defense loaded up to take away his stud RB and they threw it all over the place against a superior opponent (to whom they would lose to, I think. I gave up mid-4th).

Hackett was Marrone's puppet. Sean Payton was to Doug Marrone what Marrone was to Hackett. He may taken criticism, but everything we did was on Marrone more than Hackett.

Lester is not getting time like he did at Elmhurst.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

I thought you did a fine job. I am more upset the freaking OC can't explain what the heck he is taking from those guys. If it is zone blocking he should say that we have no freaking clue. You actually did the best job of anybody him included at giving a good plausible explanation.

Well thanks. That DO article you posted made sense when it comes to how he explained his offense- show clips of other people's stuff. I can totally see why you think this may not work. I personally don't see this offense gaining more than 400 yards a game- Sorry Milly.

From what I've heard, Lester is a smart guy who knows the game and can think critically. I hope he's up to the task.

 

[TheCusian]

i was not upset about shafer getting the job but you have to wonder what would've happened if hackett got the job instead.

he needs to get away from marrone. the only good offense they ever had was the one where marrone got out of the way and gave him so little time to overhaul it that they were forced to go very simple and very college. and it worked! but then it was right back to white knuckle the next two years

I agree with that notion. I think the fear was age and consistency. Hackett had one good year while Shafer had a string of good years, coached under H at Stanford, etc.

 

[Millhouse]

Hackett was Marrone's puppet. Sean Payton was to Doug Marrone what Marrone was to Hackett. He may taken criticism, but everything we did was on Marrone more than Hackett.

Lester is not getting time like he did at Elmhurst.

2012 was hackett.

 

[TheCusian]

Hackett was Marrone's puppet. Sean Payton was to Doug Marrone what Marrone was to Hackett. He may taken criticism, but everything we did was on Marrone more than Hackett.

Lester is not getting time like he did at Elmhurst.

You're not tracking. I'm saying he doesn't need the same amount of time because the system is built. The dirty work was in the first couple of seasons at Elmhurst.

 

[Alsacs]

Remember the audience. It was radio and 5 minutes long in total.

The audience wasn't not casual SU fans if anything it was hardcore/diehards. I am not giving Lester any benefit of the doubt until I see change. He used up his honeymoon with that disaster to the end the season.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

Hackett was Marrone's puppet. Sean Payton was to Doug Marrone what Marrone was to Hackett. He may taken criticism, but everything we did was on Marrone more than Hackett.

Lester is not getting time like he did at Elmhurst.

It's been mentioned time and time again, but this will ultimately be Shafer's failing. Marrone was invested in the Offense (and eventually specials) and basically made Shafer the Head Coach of Defense.

Shafer is trying to oversee everything and, while he has his defense in place, the lack of having someone in control on offense is going to break him.

 

[Finwad32]

400 ypg should be a benchmark in 2015 for all of college football, I do not think we get there this year, but, I'm hopeful.

 

[Alsacs]

You're not tracking. I'm saying he doesn't need the same amount of time because the system is built. The dirty work was in the first couple of seasons at Elmhurst.

Dude, cmon the athletes in D-3 and athletes in P5 college football are a lot different. I judge by what I see. I watched the Elmhurst games and have some knowledge. They ran the same system in year 2 than in year 4. It took time for the players to be more experienced for it to do well and wasn't even the top of D-3. It was a good D-3 offense, but its not like we even got the top D-3 offensive mind.

The dirty work is now seeing how it does at P5 level and Lester used up his patience for some of the fanbase by how pathetic he did last year as OC even in another system.

 

[TheCusian]

The audience wasn't not casual SU fans if anything it was hardcore/diehards. I am not giving Lester any benefit of the doubt until I see change. He used up his honeymoon with that disaster to the end the season.

Sports radio during the day on ESPNCNY is not diehards. It's just local sports radio - they talk everything.

You've made it perfectly clear that you have low expectations.

 

[TheCusian]

Dude, cmon the athletes in D-3 and athletes in P5 college football are a lot different. I judge by what I see. I watched the Elmhurst games and have some knowledge. They ran the same system in year 2 than in year 4. It took time for the players to be more experienced for it to do well and wasn't even the top of D-3. It was a good D-3 offense, but its not like we even got the top D-3 offensive mind.

The dirty work is now seeing how it does at P5 level and Lester used up his patience for some of the fanbase by how pathetic he did last year as OC even in another system.

You're honestly saying that OC's don't improve over time? That systems don't change? The only job in America where the abilities of the person doing the job are completely stagnant?

You can attribute the growth solely to the players if you want - but they cycle through too.

Let me be clear: If you give complete blame to Lester for the position he was placed in as OC last year, you're insane and you expectations will never be met. I've said he deserves some blame (he was QB coach for 1.5 years) and things did get worse after the bye week (which I thought would help - I was wrong). But c'mon. It was a disaster and roughly 70% of it was out of his control.

 

[Alsacs]

You're honestly saying that OC's don't improve over time? That systems don't change? The only job in America where the abilities of the person doing the job are completely stagnant?

You can attribute the growth solely to the players if you want - but they cycle through too.

Let me be clear: If you give complete blame to Lester for the position he was placed in as OC last year, you're insane and you expectations will never be met. I've said he deserves some blame (he was QB coach for 1.5 years) and things did get worse after the bye week (which I thought would help - I was wrong). But c'mon. It was a disaster and roughly 70% of it was out of his control.

From what I saw in games year 2 and year 4 the plays and system look the same. I am positive they put the some new plays in as all teams do, but the system was the same. The QB and RB got better over the years.

I am not giving Lester complete blame it is mainly on SS and McDonald. However, Lester showed he wasn't that great an OC with how he did at play calling and game planning with how we performed. He used up his honeymoon. Typically, I give new coaches one year without complaining, but Lester used that up with how bad he was last year. If SS didn't name Lester OC last year I would have given him this whole year to work his system in and not complained about it unless it was Pariani bad.

 

[Faegan]

Time will only tell, but I for one am giving Lester the benefit of the doubt. I think you have to take the environment into consideration (my psychology background kicking in here). McDonald was still there - I'm going to go out on a limb and say he wasn't a happy camper. In the middle of the season Lester had to get the players to buy into his stepping in and modifying McDonald's system, all the while continuing to have a high level of commitment? Then you factor in the injuries - ludicrous in number and who was out - and it's a perfect storm. I simply cannot buy the assertion that we have seen what Lester is capable of as an OC at the D1 level with a healthy roster.

Now, I'm not saying he is going to get it done - I am only saying he hasn't gotten a fair shot yet.

 

[Millhouse]

You can keep trying to decipher a 5 minute radio interview or you could watch game tape.

not sitting through multiple 3.5 hour youtube videos where you can't skip around to see what the offense is doing.

the numbers show that WR don't get the ball. it's a big bet on hybrid players. i don't think we have them. maybe philips can make some noise.

i care about how he describes his offense. you don't.

i still don't like this quote

"I've had people tell me it's spread," Lester said. "I've had people tell me it's 12 personnel. I've had people tell me it's 20 personnel."

"It'll be multiple. That's one thing I know it will be."

now he's throwing NFL stuff at the wall hoping that sticks.

i'm all for running a rich rodriguez offense. we should hire someone who worked for him. not someone who has a youtube video that vaguely reminds someone of him

 

[FrancoPizza]

We're going to run the ball way more than what we saw under McF***it, and we're going to use the pass to open up the defense.

Milly's concern is valid, folks. Short passing doesn't open up anything, especially when you don't have the athletes to turn 5 yard passes into 20 yard gains. I, for one, am tired of relying on 15-play, error-free drives to score. Talent and explosiveness can expand the margin of error. Until we have that, I'm not sure it matters what system we're using.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

Milly's concern is valid, folks. Short passing doesn't open up anything, especially when you don't have the athletes to turn 5 yard passes into 20 yard gains. I, for one, am tired of relying on 15-play, error-free drives to score. Talent and explosiveness can expand the margin of error. Until we have that, I'm not sure it matters what system we're using.

We saw last year that we don't have the talent to turn 5 yard passes into 20 yard gains. I don't care how many plays it takes to get to the end zone. As long as we actually get there this year.

 

[FrancoPizza]

We saw last year that we don't have the talent to turn 5 yard passes into 20 yard gains. I don't care how many plays it takes to get to the end zone. As long as we actually get there this year.

But that's the point -- how often can a team expect to string together 15-play drives? Long, time-consuming drives typically fail because players are not robots... they'll eventually miss a block... or there's a fumble... then throw in a sack or a holding penalty and you're faced with 3rd and long and everything sputters.

If the offense is predicated on 15-play drives... it's because the talent is woefully deficient, or the coaches are afraid to learn/install something new because it's out of their comfort zone.

 

[KaiserUEO]

But that's the point -- how often can a team expect to string together 15-play drives? Long, time-consuming drives typically fail because players are not robots... they'll eventually miss a block... or there's a fumble... then throw in a sack or a holding penalty and you're faced with 3rd and long and everything sputters.

If the offense is predicated on 15-play drives... it's because the talent is woefully deficient, or the coaches are afraid to learn/install something new because it's out of their comfort zone.

even the Giants dropped the Erhardt-Perkins 15 play drive offense that won them 4 SuperBowls for a faster, quicker, less plays 'West Coast' offense last year.

and the bottom line is Syracuse plays in a FREAKIN DOME, not outside in a wind-swept, snow covered frozen field where that type of O is a necessity.

 

[FrancoPizza]

and the bottom line is Syracuse plays in a FREAKIN DOME, not outside in a wind-swept, snow covered frozen field where that type of O is a necessity.

Maybe Shafer saw an open-air stadium in the classified campus master plan.