Lots Of Youth | Syracusefan.com

Lots Of Youth

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
A lot of young players out there on defense.

Micah Robinson, Keon Lyn, Eric Crume, Reddish, D. Davis, Wilkes, Spriull, Cam Lynch, Bromley all sophs/frosh. Plus guys like Goggins and Amene et al who have not played.

With experience the defense should improve in the near term.
 

OttoinGrotto

2020-21 Iggy Award Winner 3 Point Shooting %
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
49,198
Like
128,358
A lot of young players out there on defense.

Micah Robinson, Keon Lyn, Eric Crume, Reddish, D. Davis, Wilkes, Spriull, Cam Lynch, Bromley all sophs/frosh.

With experience the defense should improve in the near term.
I don't mean this to sound harsh, but that sounds like an excuse.

We've had excuses the last two seasons about a lack of bodies to provide adequate depth.

Now we have an excuse that we have a lot of guys that are young.

FWIW, I think this defense could be pretty good in 2012.
 

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
We are playing a lot of guys who have never played at this level.

In a complicated game like this game, lack of experience is consequential.

I gather that you understand the concept, given your final observation that by 2012 - with experience - this defense could be "pretty good"
 

OttoinGrotto

2020-21 Iggy Award Winner 3 Point Shooting %
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
49,198
Like
128,358
We are playing a lot of guys who have never played at this level.

In a complicated game like this game, lack of experience is consequential.

I gather that you understand the concept, given your final observation that by 2012 - with experience - this defense could be "pretty good"
My post was more of a commentary that I continue to see a persistent willingness by some to provide excuses for the team when it doesn't perform well than it was intended to disagree with your post, although I believe it will be a longer process than you do. You think it will get better near term, I don't think it will get much better until next season.
 

OrangeMuskyFish

Starter
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
1,212
Like
123
My post was more of a commentary that I continue to see a persistent willingness by some to provide excuses for the team when it doesn't perform well than it was intended to disagree with your post, although I believe it will be a longer process than you do. You think it will get better near term, I don't think it will get much better until next season.

I think you are right. They are excuses, and people are looking to defend the team... But I don't think it means that such stances aren't validated. When we had experience, we lacked playmaking ability (overall at least), now it's the other way around. Yet despite the challenges, this team continues to improve under Marrone, so it shouldn't be all that surprising that the ceiling for this squad remains very high.
 

OttoinGrotto

2020-21 Iggy Award Winner 3 Point Shooting %
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
49,198
Like
128,358
I think you are right. They are excuses, and people are looking to defend the team... But I don't think it means that such stances aren't validated. When we had experience, we lacked playmaking ability (overall at least), now it's the other way around. Yet despite the challenges, this team continues to improve under Marrone, so it shouldn't be all that surprising that the ceiling for this squad remains very high.
I just can't bring myself to be as bullish, because last year I think we did have experience and playmaking ability overall thanks to Hogue, Smith and Holmes. I don't see guys emerging on our defense at that level mid- or late season. We're going to be short on experience and playmaking this season. I just don't think that's going to change, especially with Chandler out or at less than 100%. I don't think that means the defense will be terrible or that we're doomed to a bad season, I just think we can't expect the defense to work miracles like it did last season.
 

SUFan44

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
7,659
Like
13,790
So OrangePA, how does one explain a veteran offensive line and offensive unit in general score 21 points -- and only 7 in the second half -- against a mid-level 1-AA team? I don't think it's youth we're talking about there.
 

tep624

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
8,016
Like
13,128
I just can't bring myself to be as bullish, because last year I think we did have experience and playmaking ability overall thanks to Hogue, Smith and Holmes. I don't see guys emerging on our defense at that level mid- or late season. We're going to be short on experience and playmaking this season. I just don't think that's going to change, especially with Chandler out or at less than 100%. I don't think that means the defense will be terrible or that we're doomed to a bad season, I just think we can't expect the defense to work miracles like it did last season.
It's going to be a season reliant on the offense. I think that's pretty clear. So far we're 2-0, not pretty but we're there.
 

OttoinGrotto

2020-21 Iggy Award Winner 3 Point Shooting %
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
49,198
Like
128,358
So OrangePA, how does one explain a veteran offensive line and offensive unit in general score 21 points -- and only 7 in the second half -- against a mid-level 1-AA team? I don't think it's youth we're talking about there.
I suppose it's possible that Marrone doesn't have the golden touch with o-linemen that so many believed he would bring.

And before anyone's head explodes, I'm not saying that means Marrone is poor at coaching the line by any stretch. It seems to me though that a lot of people were banking on Marrone coming in and immediately gifting the program with a top notch line, and I just don't think it's that easy.

Be sure though, this is Marrone's line. The right side are JUCOs he brought in. The center is the guy he's been talking up since the Pinstripe ended. The left guard was his recruit out of highschool, and the left tackle signed under GRob but has only been coached on Marrone's teams.

All said, I think he's been as successful as he can be with the guys that are there so far. If we assume that his coaching makes a difference and improves their performance, that's our given, we just have to hope the incoming players are better than the guys in there now if we want to see a better line.
 

SUalldway

All Conference
Joined
Sep 1, 2011
Messages
2,353
Like
2,489
A lot of young players out there on defense.

Micah Robinson, Keon Lyn, Eric Crume, Reddish, D. Davis, Wilkes, Spriull, Cam Lynch, Bromley all sophs/frosh. Plus guys like Goggins and Amene et al who have not played.

With experience the defense should improve in the near term.
Goggins has played in both games. He was outstanding last night.
 

Noexcuse

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 14, 2011
Messages
10,230
Like
11,055
I think the OL is better than it has been the last few years. The strength of the OL is probably it's depth and it will continue to get better as players cycle through over the next several years.
 

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
So OrangePA, how does one explain a veteran offensive line and offensive unit in general score 21 points -- and only 7 in the second half -- against a mid-level 1-AA team? I don't think it's youth we're talking about there.
My post addressed the defense.

As far as the OL is concerned, I was pretty unimpressed with it last year, so I wasn't expecting all that much this year, espectially with a young Macky at center.

Pugh is a sophomore, and Chibane is a young junior, so there is room for development with three of the OL starters.

Take back Nassib's bad INT and the bad miss on 4th and one, and the offense scores more points.

Lets not get too carried away here, we are still only three years from Greg Robinson's awful final season. We have a lot of work to do.

But in 2011, after two games, we have already won 20% of the number of games that Robinson won in his four years here, so we need to chill a bit,
 

SoBristol

All Conference
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
3,078
Like
2,817
We are young and inexperienced at LB and our kickers -- otherwise, not buying the assessment that this team is all that young compared to others. We have a veteran offense -- and the main issue right now is that our veteran line and senior RB aren't getting yards on first down. On the defensive side, we have average experience in the secondary (a senior and two juniors, all with starting experience, and one soph); the DL has upperclassmen plus Bromley, and experienced subs in Sharp and Ball. Goggins may be new, but he was recruited as a talented Juco, and Boatman is a senior.

Lots of teams on our schedule will be playing juniors, several sophs, a RF here and there, and an occasional true frosh. Last year, SU started a true frosh at LB, another true frosh played in the DT rotation, and another true frosh saw time in the secondary. Our QB was a soph; we had two rookies in the OL.

The issue is more one of talent. At a basic physical level, our lines were on a par with RI. Same with our RBs.

Our positive notes: the offensive scheme looked good, Nassib is solid when he has any time, and the receivers (Chew & Lemon particularly, but also Stevens) had excellent games; and some of those inexperienced kids look promising, Lynch, Lyn and Spruill in particular. Wish we had another young LB and DE in the mix, and a terrific young RB.
 

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
I don't think that's right.

When you're playing seven sophs/frosh with little or no game experience on defense - when you have lost seven to eight starters on defense to graduation - your defensive leadership for at least two years - you're young and need time to develope.

Marrone made that clear in his presser last night.

We are more talented than we have been for awhile. As the team gets experience, we will play better.

I am not discouraged at all and not all that surprised by what I see.
 

MadNY3

All Conference
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
3,962
Like
9,506
I don't think that's right.

When you're playing seven sophs/frosh with little or no game experience on defense - when you have lost seven to eight starters on defense to graduation - your defensive leadership for at least two years - you're young and need time to develope.

Marrone made that clear in his presser last night.

We are more talented than we have been for awhile. As the team gets experience, we will play better.

I am not discouraged at all and not all that surprised by what I see.

***

Totally agree with you about the defense.

The offensive line is disappointing. One small note...Chibane is a "young Junior"? You know they only get four years too actually play, right? (KIDDING!!!)
 

rrlbees

2017 ESPN Tourney Challenge Winner
Staff member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
92,246
Like
166,190
I don't think that's right.

When you're playing seven sophs/frosh with little or no game experience on defense - when you have lost seven to eight starters on defense to graduation - your defensive leadership for at least two years - you're young and need time to develope.

Marrone made that clear in his presser last night.

We are more talented than we have been for awhile. As the team gets experience, we will play better.

I am not discouraged at all and not all that surprised by what I see.

We are young and inexperienced at DT and one OLB spot along with C on offense. A lot of these guys got PT last year and some played a lot. Our biggest problem is only a handful of players brought in the past few years are talented football players. Maybe the star system is more right than wrong.
 

salessyracuse

Walk On
Joined
Sep 4, 2011
Messages
4
Like
1
We are young and inexperienced at DT and one OLB spot along with C on offense. A lot of these guys got PT last year and some played a lot. Our biggest problem is only a handful of players brought in the past few years are talented football players. Maybe the star system is more right than wrong.
Next year the defense could one of the be best in the BE, only lose two starters in Scott and Marinovich. Really like the linebackers Lynch and Davis. Those two along with Spruill could be better than the group we had last year.
 

rrlbees

2017 ESPN Tourney Challenge Winner
Staff member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
92,246
Like
166,190
Next year the defense could one of the be best in the BE, only lose two starters in Scott and Marinovich. Really like the linebackers Lynch and Davis. Those two along with Spruill could be better than the group we had last year.

I too like Davis and Lynch a lot also. But Davis misses a lot of tackles and is out of position a lot. That though, is due to his youth and inexperience. Love his size and speed.
 

44cuse

All Conference
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
2,342
Like
1,602
We are young and inexperienced at DT and one OLB spot along with C on offense. A lot of these guys got PT last year and some played a lot. Our biggest problem is only a handful of players brought in the past few years are talented football players. Maybe the star system is more right than wrong.
The whole star argument has always been a mystery to me. Seems to me, the stars (when taken in aggregate) are far more accurate than a lot of SU fans want to believe. Our talent level, particularly on the OL but definitely overall for the past few years, has been closer to FCS than it has Top 25 or Top 30. Marrone is fine...he'll coach up the OL and will get better players over time. It just takes time.

Begin series of posts about "diamonds in the rough."

44cuse
 

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
We are young and inexperienced at DT and one OLB spot along with C on offense. A lot of these guys got PT last year and some played a lot. Our biggest problem is only a handful of players brought in the past few years are talented football players. Maybe the star system is more right than wrong.
Well, the jury is still out on our talent level.

We shall see.

I do think we are longer, faster and more athletic, and I think that has actually hurt us a bit due to our collective lack of experience.
 

OrangePA

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
9,243
Like
12,009
***

Totally agree with you about the defense.

The offensive line is disappointing. One small note...Chibane is a "young Junior"? You know they only get four years too actually play, right? (KIDDING!!!)
Young in the sense that his frosh time on the field was very minimal.

He has basically played one season of major college football on the OL.
 

NovaOrange

Starter
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
1,103
Like
501
I thought Macky might have cost us several chances on big plays. IMO he was the worse starter on the field on Saturday. I think it's time to give Trudo the knod at center.
 

Similar threads

    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Thursday for Football
Replies
5
Views
526
    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Tuesday for Football
Replies
2
Views
461
    • Like
Orangeyes Daily Articles for Friday for Football
Replies
8
Views
703

Forum statistics

Threads
157,249
Messages
4,165,183
Members
5,507
Latest member
Lpoolnation

Online statistics

Members online
215
Guests online
680
Total visitors
895




Top Bottom