Love Popovich's quote, "the ball doesn't stick"

[Jack Hall]

On offense. Love JBs defense, but wish he d figure out, on O the ball shouldnt stick. The Spurs proved w yet another title, this iso stuff is vastly overrated. When the Cuse starts really moving the ball on O (ie making the extra pass and kicking it inside out like the Spurs) i think JB gets title number 2!

 

[Brooky03]

It's easier to get spacing in the NBA, so there's more room for passing lanes. We tend to grab guys based on athleticism more so than fundamentals, so not all of our players are adept enough passers to always make the extra pass. Also, mismatches tend to be magnified at the college level which makes isolation a little more effective.

That said, I think this season's team will move the ball much more and more effectively than last season's team out of necessity. With JB's short leash, a decent amount of depth, and a bunch of young guys, nobody is going to be willing to put up too many contested shots or be a one-man offensive machine. I could be wrong, maybe McCullough will pull off a Donte Greene or Carmelo Anthony performance, but I would bet we'll see a lot of different high scorers throughout the season, rather than just 2 or 3 guys who get our points each game.

 

[OrangeAl]

Imagine if Melo became a Spur and rounded out his game. Nah, that's too much of a stretch.

 

[sufandu]

It's easier to get spacing in the NBA, so there's more room for passing lanes. We tend to grab guys based on athleticism more so than fundamentals, so not all of our players are adept enough passers to always make the extra pass. Also, mismatches tend to be magnified at the college level which makes isolation a little more effective.

That said, I think this season's team will move the ball much more and more effectively than last season's team out of necessity. With JB's short leash, a decent amount of depth, and a bunch of young guys, nobody is going to be willing to put up too many contested shots or be a one-man offensive machine. I could be wrong, maybe McCullough will pull off a Donte Greene or Carmelo Anthony performance, but I would bet we'll see a lot of different high scorers throughout the season, rather than just 2 or 3 guys who get our points each game.

Couldn't the argument be made that less spacing on the college level makes running iso more difficult too? I think it's simply a coaching philosophy thing. John Beilein has been bringing in athletic guys since he's been at Michigan, but they still move the ball really well. I think it's simply because that's what's emphasized and coached.

 

[OttoMets]

On offense. Love JBs defense, but wish he d figure out, on O the ball shouldnt stick. The Spurs proved w yet another title, this iso stuff is vastly overrated. When the Cuse starts really moving the ball on O (ie making the extra pass and kicking it inside out like the Spurs) i think JB gets title number 2!

Big 'like' for this.

SU is up and down with distribution from year to year (2010, for instance, looked a lot like San Antonio's style), but there's nothing worse than watching a team force isolation on a player who's not talented enough to execute.

It's rare that Syracuse will have an individual talent who thrives at isolation. We could take a page from San Antonio's book.

 

[longislandcuse]

Big 'like' for this.

SU is up and down with distribution from year to year (2010, for instance, looked a lot like San Antonio's style), but there's nothing worse than watching a team force isolation on a player who's not talented enough to execute.

It's rare that Syracuse will have an individual talent who thrives at isolation. We could take a page from San Antonio's book.

Iso-Fair might be the single most frustrating thing I have ever watched as a Syracuse Basketball fan.

Now put Fair is a motion offense where he can use his athleticism and craftiness and I think he would've been a complete monster.

 

[sufandu]

Iso-Fair might be the single most frustrating thing I have ever watched as a Syracuse Basketball fan.

Now put Fair is a motion offense where he can use his athleticism and craftiness and I think he would've been a complete monster.

Yeah, Fair's so much better when he isn't the focal point of the other team's defense. We can see that in the way he looked junior year versus senior year.

 

[NineOneSeven]

The opposite of 2013-2014 Syracuse.

 

[newmexicuse]

Watching the Spurs is like watching the Globetrotters the way they execute the weave. You just don't see anything like that in the modern NBA.

 

[jekelish]

I love how LBJ in his postgame PC said "that's how basketball should be played."

Then why are you guys trying to just assemble all-star teams rather than actual basketball teams, LeBron? You're doing the exact opposite of what the Spurs do and that's why you got your asses handed to you.

 

[longislandcuse]

I love how LBJ in his postgame PC said "that's how basketball should be played."

Then why are you guys trying to just assemble all-star teams rather than actual basketball teams, LeBron? You're doing the exact opposite of what the Spurs do and that's why you got your asses handed to you.

Im not giving them too much credit for 4 Finals appearances because the East is a cakewalk, but they did win 2 titles with the All-Star approach. He just needs new All-Stars now..

 

[Full_Rebar]

Not Lebron's fault that the Heat ownership sacrificed a 3-peat to save the luxury tax. They won because they had Allen/Miller to burn teams who collapsed in the paint and this year they had to convert Bosh to a 3-pt specialist to try and make up for Miller's loss.

It also hurt that Wade/Allen/Battier all seemed to hit the wall at the same time. Four Finals in a row is pretty successful and it took some great basketball from Dallas and SA to keep Miami from a Four-Peat.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Iso-Fair might be the single most frustrating thing I have ever watched as a Syracuse Basketball fan.

Now put Fair is a motion offense where he can use his athleticism and craftiness and I think he would've been a complete monster.

Haha. Agreed. As long as he doesn't have to dribble too much. The more and more I look back at things. I think Fair had some deserved senior-loyalty thing from Boeheim going on and was probably the most reliable to score on a very offensively challenged team.

I hope the NBA haters watched this Spurs performance. ISO ball would've gotten them beat and would've played right into MIA's hands. Their ball movement and unselfishness was amazing. They also had way more bench help and better players there than MIA.

 

[Millhouse]

I love how LBJ in his postgame PC said "that's how basketball should be played."

Then why are you guys trying to just assemble all-star teams rather than actual basketball teams, LeBron? You're doing the exact opposite of what the Spurs do and that's why you got your asses handed to you.

i think that's how the heat want to play, it's just that the spurs are better

it's not like the heat have some ancient clearout offense. they whip the ball around too. it's just that the spurs are in another league this year

 

[SoBeCuse]

i think that's how the heat want to play, it's just that the spurs are better

it's not like the heat have some ancient clearout offense. they whip the ball around too. it's just that the spurs are in another league this year

Yup. Mills/Diaw/Green/Splitter/Ginobili > Birdman/Haslem/Battier/Chalmers or Cole/Lewis. Way better bench or role players who all have better skill sets.

 

[Brooky03]

Couldn't the argument be made that less spacing on the college level makes running iso more difficult too? I think it's simply a coaching philosophy thing. John Beilein has been bringing in athletic guys since he's been at Michigan, but they still move the ball really well. I think it's simply because that's what's emphasized and coached.

Absolutely. There are definitely two sides to the coin and coaching philosophy makes a big difference.

Where I probably disagree with a lot of people, is that I don't place a premium on centering an offense around passing or the philosophy that everybody should touch the ball each possession. I'm okay with isolation.

As with anything, though, moderation is the key. You can't run Iso all the time like last season's team and you would be limiting yourself if you didn't take advantage of Iso mismatches because you want to pass the ball more. For instance, Fair needed to get the ball more on cuts, though he was still a solid isolation player; whereas, Melo needed the ball in isolation more because nobody could match up with him.

Boeheim adjusts to what he has on the court, from what I've seen. The Wes Johnson team shared the ball like it was nobody's business because, more or less, they had to and it fit the makeup of that team. I wouldn't agree that Jim B is overly dependant on isolation, if that's anybody's argument. He runs a pro style offense that tries to get the best player the ball. The players, and their willingness to pass, play a role in it, too. Ennis was an inexperienced PG that may not have understood the offense enough to get it running the way it should. I remember Flynn's teams sharing the ball more as he matured.

 

[Millhouse]

Yup. Mills/Diaw/Green/Splitter/Ginobili > Birdman/Haslem/Battier/Chalmers or Cole/Lewis. Way better bench or role players who all have better skill sets.

if the spurs don't have all star talent then the people who pick all star teams are stupid

just compare big 3. parker duncan ginobli > james wade bosh.

edit maybe ginobli should be replaced with leonard. i put ginobli in there because he's older like the rest of them

 

[Col. Bleep]

To thrive with a pass-oriented game you need two things:

A coach who pushes it.

Players who can execute it...especially the big men.

We didn't have that last season.
Our best passing big was Baye...when he could hold the ball long enough to pass it.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Guys, you do realize that the Spurs are just incredibly unique, right? They've got a special thing going. Sometimes a special thing is a special thing because other people just can't do it.

 

[Knicks411]

'

I love how LBJ in his postgame PC said "that's how basketball should be played."

Then why are you guys trying to just assemble all-star teams rather than actual basketball teams, LeBron? You're doing the exact opposite of what the Spurs do and that's why you got your asses handed to you.

I don't really agree with that, Miami generally has a very open and pretty offense to watch. The Spurs are the best at moving the ball, for sure, but Miami usually moves it very well as well. I wouldn't say the Heat aren't an actual team or whatever because they have James and Wade; James is the least selfish star player probably in the history of the game. The Spurs just did it better.

 

[sufandu]

Absolutely. There are definitely two sides to the coin and coaching philosophy makes a big difference.

Where I probably disagree with a lot of people, is that I don't place a premium on centering an offense around passing or the philosophy that everybody should touch the ball each possession. I'm okay with isolation.

As with anything, though, moderation is the key. You can't run Iso all the time like last season's team and you would be limiting yourself if you didn't take advantage of Iso mismatches because you want to pass the ball more. For instance, Fair needed to get the ball more on cuts, though he was still a solid isolation player; whereas, Melo needed the ball in isolation more because nobody could match up with him.

Boeheim adjusts to what he has on the court, from what I've seen. The Wes Johnson team shared the ball like it was nobody's business because, more or less, they had to and it fit the makeup of that team. I wouldn't agree that Jim B is overly dependant on isolation, if that's anybody's argument. He runs a pro style offense that tries to get the best player the ball. The players, and their willingness to pass, play a role in it, too. Ennis was an inexperienced PG that may not have understood the offense enough to get it running the way it should. I remember Flynn's teams sharing the ball more as he matured.

That Wes Johnson team was great at sharing the ball, absolutely. The criticism I have of JB is that I think he let's the players dictate too much sometimes. I think that Wes Johnson team shared so well because it came naturally to them. Melo was obviously someone that thrived in isolation, but we'll probably never see anything that him again. I differ in the opinion that Fair was good in isolation. I think last year's team was one that needed to move the ball more, use more motion, and get guys on cuts (like you said). Ennis may not have been ready to run the whole offense, but we should have seen some kind of evolution throughout the year if the team had been working on it, and we didn't. We've seen JB adapt in the past. I don't think he did a good job of that this year.

 

[LennX6]

It's easier to get spacing in the NBA, so there's more room for passing lanes. We tend to grab guys based on athleticism more so than fundamentals, so not all of our players are adept enough passers to always make the extra pass. Also, mismatches tend to be magnified at the college level which makes isolation a little more effective.

That said, I think this season's team will move the ball much more and more effectively than last season's team out of necessity. With JB's short leash, a decent amount of depth, and a bunch of young guys, nobody is going to be willing to put up too many contested shots or be a one-man offensive machine. I could be wrong, maybe McCullough will pull off a Donte Greene or Carmelo Anthony performance, but I would bet we'll see a lot of different high scorers throughout the season, rather than just 2 or 3 guys who get our points each game.

If McCullough is at least Terrance Roberts (as a freshman) I'll be happy.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

If McCullough is at least Terrance Roberts (as a freshman) I'll be happy.

That's a pretty low bar.

 

[LennX6]

Guys, you do realize that the Spurs are just incredibly unique, right? They've got a special thing going. Sometimes a special thing is a special thing because other people just can't do it.

They are a European style club. They play that way and their roster sure says so. If they played in NY or LA , LeBron and company would have been the "other big 3".

 

[LennX6]

That's a pretty low bar.

As a frosh he was decent. Thing is he didn't get that much better from there.
I am also saying that in the context of how some of our recent frosh have played. It has been a mixed bag. For every Ennis and Dion there has been Fab, Rak and DC.
If Rak and DC could have played as well as TR their freshman year, we would have been better by far.
McCullough doesn't have to be Billy Owens with the talent around him for us to be successful.
Not this year