Class of 2018 - Marcus Zegarowski to Creighton / Max Zegarowski to D2 Lynn | Page 6 | Syracusefan.com

Class of 2018 Marcus Zegarowski to Creighton / Max Zegarowski to D2 Lynn

That's how you end up getting a Kaleb Joseph.

I wont eat the staffs lunch for Joseph, he was a highly rated guy coming out of HS, he busted for us. It's the guys who weren't rated who weren't great coming in and ended up not being great leaving who I don't understand why we recruit. More times than not, a guy in Josephs rating is going to succeed.
 
I wont eat the staffs lunch for Joseph, he was a highly rated guy coming out of HS, he busted for us. It's the guys who weren't rated who weren't great coming in and ended up not being great leaving who I don't understand why we recruit. More times than not, a guy in Josephs rating is going to succeed.

Love Kaleb and think he will be solid this year at Creighton after the redshirt year. That was just what he needed. I think he will fit in well there and show his talent.
 
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That's how you end up getting a Kaleb Joseph.
I don't agree with that. We didn't end up with Kaleb because we looked at more than one kid and ended up with the least talented kid. When Kaleb happened it wasn't viewed as a settle in my opinion. It was thought that he was more athletic than Ennis and if he developed a jump shot that he would be a really good player. Obviously he didn't develop like we thought but he was a top 50 kid.
 
This is the strategy I would use. Recruit multiple players for one position that are similar and throw that at them. "Listen, we have one spot, three of you are the guys we want, first one signs has the spot". Bam, we don't deal with what we're dealing with now. Well, I guess all three could tell us to pound sand and then we're really boned.
Are you in sales? Sometimes the worst thing you can do in sales is create competition where it does t need to exist. 9 times out of 10 when you create the scenario you may out the person who has the least options will react to this. And don't forget that most of the time these are verbal commits. It's ok to push kids to commit in football but with limited heads in basketball you can't risk the placeholder commits.
 
Are you in sales? Sometimes the worst thing you can do in sales is create competition where it does t need to exist. 9 times out of 10 when you create the scenario you may out the person who has the least options will react to this. And don't forget that most of the time these are verbal commits. It's ok to push kids to commit in football but with limited heads in basketball you can't risk the placeholder commits.
I'm in sales and competition is almost always a good thing. It's gets people to do what the might normally do in a faster manner. It also leaves you without a lot of wasted time where you miss out on other opportunities. I'm a commercial real estate broker and if I say something like, "We would love to do a deal with you but we have anther group interested in the space too so I need to move reasonably quickly." If the person reacts by not moving any differently you are normally 3 or 4 on their list of places to lease and they probably will never sign the lease anyway. While you were waiting on their decision and not aggressively finding other options you miss out on other tenants to lease the space and the income that would generate. If you are truly a space the person is interested in they speed up and make a decision.
 
Are you in sales? Sometimes the worst thing you can do in sales is create competition where it does t need to exist. 9 times out of 10 when you create the scenario you may out the person who has the least options will react to this. And don't forget that most of the time these are verbal commits. It's ok to push kids to commit in football but with limited heads in basketball you can't risk the placeholder commits.

I was in sales for a long time, now I'm on the operational side of things and manage the operational side of the company.

You're not wrong, but while there is competition there is also a fear of loss, while I think all sales are very similar in some cases giving the fear of loss can put somebody in a spot where they don't want to lose what you're offering and end up biting on the offer. I've had a lot of success with that "tactic". As for the creating more competition, that can also work in your favor, if you have a limited supply of a product or resources, the buyer may jump even faster at what you're offering.

If I was running say a basketball team I'd probably do a breakdown like this, only using star rating as an example (again, very simple):

Say point guard is an open position you know you're going to have. You have 6 guys you're watching, 3 are in one tier. Go after the 3 hard (but continue to show interest in the other 3), use the "ultimatum", nobody bites or they take other offers you at least have a fall back on the other 3 when you do the same with them. I may think our program is better than most but if there are 6 targets, I'm willing to bet that one of them will want to play for our school, especially if we have an opening with playing time available.

The past couple of years it just seems like there has been no plan and it's fill spots at the last, I'm not saying the one I wrote above is the best, but at least it's some sort of a plan. Showing up to a gym at the last minute doesn't seem to work or at least isn't a path of long term success.
 
I was in sales for a long time, now I'm on the operational side of things and manage the operational side of the company.

You're not wrong, but while there is competition there is also a fear of loss, while I think all sales are very similar in some cases giving the fear of loss can put somebody in a spot where they don't want to lose what you're offering and end up biting on the offer. I've had a lot of success with that "tactic". As for the creating more competition, that can also work in your favor, if you have a limited supply of a product or resources, the buyer may jump even faster at what you're offering.

If I was running say a basketball team I'd probably do a breakdown like this, only using star rating as an example (again, very simple):

Say point guard is an open position you know you're going to have. You have 6 guys you're watching, 3 are in one tier. Go after the 3 hard (but continue to show interest in the other 3), use the "ultimatum", nobody bites or they take other offers you at least have a fall back on the other 3 when you do the same with them. I may think our program is better than most but if there are 6 targets, I'm willing to bet that one of them will want to play for our school, especially if we have an opening with playing time available.

The past couple of years it just seems like there has been no plan and it's fill spots at the last, I'm not saying the one I wrote above is the best, but at least it's some sort of a plan. Showing up to a gym at the last minute doesn't seem to work or at least isn't a path of long term success.

Most of these recruiting styles are years long. I don't know that we are showing up at gyms and trying to get commits. I agree that if you offer three people one position you will get someone to take the spot but you may find yourself with a roster of plan C's. while I understand that your comparison is that we are there now, Boehiems approach has worked more than it hasn't over the years. I believe our current situation is more around Boeheim taking a backseat to Hop over the last few years to ensure Hop owns recruiting. Obviously that has changed but we are not a blue blood. We can't make ultimatums.
 
I'm in sales and competition is almost always a good thing. It's gets people to do what the might normally do in a faster manner. It also leaves you without a lot of wasted time where you miss out on other opportunities. I'm a commercial real estate broker and if I say something like, "We would love to do a deal with you but we have anther group interested in the space too so I need to move reasonably quickly." If the person reacts by not moving any differently you are normally 3 or 4 on their list of places to lease and they probably will never sign the lease anyway. While you were waiting on their decision and not aggressively finding other options you miss out on other tenants to lease the space and the income that would generate. If you are truly a space the person is interested in they speed up and make a decision.
I am not saying competition isn't good. I am saying ultimatums aren't good. You are selling properties that are available and a number of factors drive demand. Recruiting is a little more core to sales where there are multiple options and each has its own value prop. It is also a very long sales cycle compared to your environment. These are kids and if you give them a you better hurry and get your spot while another team treats them like A priority You will reap what you sow.
 
I am not saying competition isn't good. I am saying ultimatums aren't good. You are selling properties that are available and a number of factors drive demand. Recruiting is a little more core to sales where there are multiple options and each has its own value prop. It is also a very long sales cycle compared to your environment. These are kids and if you give them a you better hurry and get your spot while another team treats them like A priority You will reap what you sow.
Agreed. Sometimes you'll create competition and clients will look other places that aren't forcing them to make a decision. I've changed a lot of my sales style to try and feel out when certain clients need time and others can use that additional push, but it's not an exact science.
 
Hard not to feel like we missed the boat on Marcus. Especially given our need at PG in the class of 2018.

Kid is tremendously skilled, can shoot, and has a killer handle.
 
Hard not to feel like we missed the boat on Marcus. Especially given our need at PG in the class of 2018.

Kid is tremendously skilled, can shoot, and has a killer handle.
I agree. We could have offered him and really put up a fight and got in early and made him a priority. Having said that I really thought once Hop left he would have the inside track. Hop was so close with MCW and his family. It would have been hard to win them over no matter what.
 
They have Max listed as a 3 star and Marcus ashooting a 2 star! :noidea:
:bat::rolling:
Surely this is a case of another twin mixup.
 
I'm shocked that Marcus didn't crack the top 100, let alone get a 4-star ranking. This kid tore it up in LA and was 1st team all-EYBL LA, shot close to 50% from three and averaged something like 17 ppg and 6 apg.
 
We aren't on Marcus list.

DDwEcYEW0AEWB8S
 
I haven't watched his film but I wonder if he wasn't MCW's brother if anyone would care about this kid. The list isn't exactly a who's who of college ball. Lots of hand wringing about quality of recruits and yet people seem bothered we aren't in play.
 
I haven't watched his film but I wonder if he wasn't MCW's brother if anyone would care about this kid. The list isn't exactly a who's who of college ball. Lots of hand wringing about quality of recruits and yet people seem bothered we aren't in play.
Yeah and if we were to end up with him, people can continue the we lost out on other recruits because our recruiting sucks and "settled" for him story. There is a reason the staff did not even offer.
 
Mike Hopkins offered.
This kid isn't a bum he is the 4 year type kid we always say we need for depth.

We aren't going to hammered with scholarship reductions but let's continuing only offering a few kids and then get left scrambling.
 
Mike Hopkins offered.
This kid isn't a bum he is the 4 year type kid we always say we need for depth.

We aren't going to hammered with scholarship reductions but let's continuing only offering a few kids and then get left scrambling.
Normally I would agree, but I think we already have that 4 year program guy on our roster. I'd like to think we could fine another at some point before HW graduates in four years.
 
Normally I would agree, but I think we already have that 4 year program guy on our roster. I'd like to think we could fine another at some point before HW graduates in four years.

Yep, we have a four year guard who is a PG but shoots well enough to play off the ball. I think many here will be very pleased with Washington once he is an upper classman.
 
Yep, we have a four year guard who is a PG but shoots well enough to play off the ball. I think many here will be very pleased with Washington once he is an upper classman.
I'm trying to find a historic comparison for this kid (HW). He's bulky, like Billy Eidelin, but doesn't seem as crafty inside. And he's a serviceable shooter. Um, Laz Sims? Michael Lloyd?
 
I'm trying to find a historic comparison for this kid (HW). He's bulky, like Billy Eidelin, but doesn't seem as crafty inside. And he's a serviceable shooter. Um, Laz Sims? Michael Lloyd?

The only Edelin comparison I would make is that like Edelin he doesn't have eye popping athleticism or speed. From what I've seen of him he is athletic enough, plays under control, makes open shots and has a pretty good handle. I think he plays like he is looking to get the ball to the right people in the right places on offense. This is from highlights and a couple full games I watched on the internet so its not a really knowledgeable breakdown.
 

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