Maybe it's time to step back and re-evaluate

[Ghost]

I agree with this. I think the thing that's been really disappointing this season is how far away MCW is from being a legit scoring threat. Really disappointing. And then there's Rak. My God, what a disappointing offensive season. Whatever my expectations or anyone's expectations were for him, he's been absolutely pitiful. He's scored 4 points or less in 11 of 15 BE games. He's scored 2 points or less in 9 -- NINE -- of 15 BE games. That means he's not even catching and finishing nor is he getting an offensive board and a put-back. That is truly terrible production.

So as frustrating as MCW has been and as lukewarm as I am on Triche and, for that matter Southerland, anyone "waiting for next year" should be concerned.

Hey, it's the annoying kid that defends the big men all the time!!! (That's me FYI)

So, on to the big men!

We've mishandled the bigs to the point of making them useless - the touches yesterday:

BMK touches he ball in actual post position for the first time since mid-January, and scores. Now, I think he hits that super-unbelievably awesome hook shot one out of twenty times, but who knows. Never going to touch the ball down there again anyway. He finished a couple other times off penetration - is he going to get blocked a lot, yup, Xmas too, but I'd take that goofy hookshot over a Triche 25 footer with 27 seconds on the shot clock. I really would.

Xmas got rejected a couple times under the rim on his first touch, then got a pass at the three point line, also unheard of, and hit a streaking MCW under the rim for an easy two. He can pass? Who knew. While he's standing out there, or BMK, waiting for the guards to not use the screen (Scoop and Dion were pretty decent at using screens) they could always pass and cut to the hoop...

Rak also finished on his second attempt - not a dunk! (A lay-up, but at least this proves all 60 of his field goals this year weren't dunks for those that doubted). The other times he got the ball, he had a shot, but looked terrified. Early in the year he showed a propensity for hitting that 10 footer, but that's what happens when you yank a kid every single time he makes a mistake. His brain is mush right now...

Instead of seeing incremental improvements from these three they've all regressed - and part of that is the competition is getting better, but part of it is the guards really, really, really, really think they can shoot.

CJ posted up once - and someone actually gave him the ball - and he scored! People like to say we go away from him because they "pack it in" - but if one of our sub-30% three point shooters is shooting w/ 20+ seconds on the shot clock we clearly haven't exhausted all of our options yet of offense.

Get the bigs a tiny bit involved and they play better. You see it, oddly, pretty much that one time a month that they actually get them involved. We took the lead by moving it around - and getting people touches inside/out. Then, on cue, BT takes some garbage three at the end of the first half with 30 on the shot clock, and all of a sudden a 4 point play on the other end off the ensuing fast break (since he missed rim) - and at the half our lead is almost gone.

We get the lead back up doing the same thing in the second half - everyone getting touches, everyone's involved in the game and then BT and MCW decide that the game isn't featuring enough of them - and the same happens.

Guards do little to make everyone else better so we just depend on one of them playing a bit over their heads (which they seem capable of doing against bad teams - just like the bigs did when they touched the ball!!)- decent in the open court, befuddled in the half court. The bigs are weak, but they should be progressing a little, but have never been given the opportunity to do so. So, honestly, I'm not sure what any of them could have provided this year.

Blah, this squad is an enigma. BT probably goes for 30 this weekend, and MCW ends up with a triple double.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Hey, it's the annoying kid that defends the big men all the time!!! (That's me FYI)

So, on to the big men!

We've mishandled the bigs to the point of making them useless - the touches yesterday:

BMK touches he ball in actual post position for the first time since mid-January, and scores. Now, I think he hits that super-unbelievably awesome hook shot one out of twenty times, but who knows. Never going to touch the ball down there again anyway. He finished a couple other times off penetration - is he going to get blocked a lot, yup, Xmas too, but I'd take that goofy hookshot over a Triche 25 footer with 27 seconds on the shot clock. I really would.

Xmas got rejected a couple times under the rim on his first touch, then got a pass at the three point line, also unheard of, and hit a streaking MCW under the rim for an easy two. He can pass? Who knew. While he's standing out there, or BMK, waiting for the guards to not use the screen (Scoop and Dion were pretty decent at using screens) they could always pass and cut to the hoop...

Rak also finished on his second attempt - not a dunk! (A lay-up, but at least this proves all 60 of his field goals this year weren't dunks for those that doubted). The other times he got the ball, he had a shot, but looked terrified. Early in the year he showed a propensity for hitting that 10 footer, but that's what happens when you yank a kid every single time he makes a mistake. His brain is mush right now...

Instead of seeing incremental improvements from these three they've all regressed - and part of that is the competition is getting better, but part of it is the guards really, really, really, really think they can shoot.

CJ posted up once - and someone actually gave him the ball - and he scored! People like to say we go away from him because they "pack it in" - but if one of our sub-30% three point shooters is shooting w/ 20+ seconds on the shot clock we clearly haven't exhausted all of our options yet of offense.

Get the bigs a tiny bit involved and they play better. You see it, oddly, pretty much that one time a month that they actually get them involved. We took the lead by moving it around - and getting people touches inside/out. Then, on cue, BT takes some garbage three at the end of the first half with 30 on the shot clock, and all of a sudden a 4 point play on the other end off the ensuing fast break (since he missed rim) - and at the half our lead is almost gone.

We get the lead back up doing the same thing in the second half - everyone getting touches, everyone's involved in the game and then BT and MCW decide that the game isn't featuring enough of them - and the same happens.

Guards do little to make everyone else better so we just depend on one of them playing a bit over their heads (which they seem capable of doing against bad teams - just like the bigs did when they touched the ball!!)- decent in the open court, befuddled in the half court. The bigs are weak, but they should be progressing a little, but have never been given the opportunity to do so. So, honestly, I'm not sure what any of them could have provided this year.

Blah, this squad is an enigma. BT probably goes for 30 this weekend, and MCW ends up with a triple double.

Yeah, people rag on Roy Williams, but if there's one thing he has done really well over the years, it's teach big men how to play a traditional back-to-the-basket post game, and actually use it in his offense to balance the floor and open things up for his shooters. Same thing with Coach K. He has had some lame overrated big men, but got them to play their role and function in an offense. These guys don't play 4 on 5.

It's inexcusable that we are like this almost every year, to be honest. You look back 37 years, and it's damn few years that we featured a competent offensive center. Boeheim relies way too much on his PG and his forwards for offense.

Hell, if you look back all 37 years, we haven't even had that many 2 guards who were really stars. It's almost always the PG and a couple forwards who we rely on for all our scoring.

 

[rstone7727]

Hell, if you look back all 37 years, we haven't even had that many 2 guards who were really stars. It's almost always the PG and a couple forwards who we rely on for all our scoring.

Yes, this is a testament to JB's coaching ability after winning 912 games. How did he do it?

 

[billsin01]

Hey, it's the annoying kid that defends the big men all the time!!! (That's me FYI) ...

I cut most of your impressive rant -- and no, I"m not being sarcastic. I enjoyed it.

I don't really disagree. I think my point on Rak was more that he hasn't looked good when he has gotten the ball and that you'd think you could get to 6 or 7 ppg in BE play based on effort and athleticism alone. Hustle down the floor on a break, fight for an offensive rebound and put-back, etc. We haven't seen much of that. In fact, Rak has 55 off rebs ... that's two more than Baye has in basically 200 more minutes.

But your points are valid. I've always been puzzled that JB has been so successful yet his teams never seem to really want to feed the post, rarely seem capable feeding the post and even more rarely have a guy who can do anything with the ball when he gets it in the post. The guy has won 911 more games than I have (I did coach my nephew's 9-year-old hoops team to a win while filling in for my brother), so I'm not going to go crazy with criticism, but it is worth pointing out that center play as rarely been a strong suit for his teams.

 

[Ghost]

I cut most of your impressive rant -- and no, I"m not being sarcastic. I enjoyed it.

I don't really disagree. I think my point on Rak was more that he hasn't looked good when he has gotten the ball and that you'd think you could get to 6 or 7 ppg in BE play based on effort and athleticism alone. Hustle down the floor on a break, fight for an offensive rebound and put-back, etc. We haven't seen much of that. In fact, Rak has 55 off rebs ... that's two more than Baye has in basically 200 more minutes.

I can only remember one time in the post where Rak looked truly lost - 3 or 4 games ago he did some bizarre move where he tried to back down his defender and eventually just lost the ball. I think he usually looks somewhat competent with the ball tbh, although less so as the season has progressed - but I do credit some of that to him being panicked a bit.

Again, not saying he has this vast repertoire of moves, but I do think he's shown some (a little) aptitude to be a post player - especially early in the year. I think that pass he made the other night is something they could do more of. I also think it might be worthwhile to just let him keep getting his shot blocked till he man's up and dunks on someone.

Most of my thinking on this is predicated on the fact that nobody can score on this team anyway - let Rak not score too! (by missing shots of course)!!!!

He is soft, I'm never going to argue against that point - I will argue ALL DAY about the whole lack of intensity nonsense though - hasn't been a problem at all of late. He goes up VERY WEAK - misses way too many convertible baskets (in spite of a decent FG PCT) - and his rebounding on the offensive glass is subpar (i have no issue with his defensive rebounding - which I'm going to get killed for saying). Not sure how you cure him of that though.