Mets

[OrangeFoo]

One weakness I see on this team is the need for a solid left handed relief pitcher. Gilmartin and O'Flaherty just haven't proven to be that reliable.

Set up or closer...either would help.

Keep in mind that once the playoffs hit Steve Matz or Niese are moving to the bullpen. Either of those guys will give them that left handed bullpen arm. They just need to get to the playoffs first. The playoff rotation will be Harvey, deGrom and either Niese or Syndergaard... I'm guessing it will be Niese starting with Syndergaard and Matz as 7th inning guys who can get the ball to Clipart and Familia.

 

[Briancuse]

Keep in mind that once the playoffs hit Steve Matz or Niese are moving to the bullpen. Either of those guys will give them that left handed bullpen arm. They just need to get to the playoffs first. The playoff rotation will be Harvey, deGrom and either Niese or Syndergaard... I'm guessing it will be Niese starting with Syndergaard and Matz as 7th inning guys who can get the ball to Clipart and Familia.

They could, its also possible that Synderguard could move to the bullpen. I don't see Niese as a bullpen guy.

 

[bevosu]

Keep in mind that once the playoffs hit Steve Matz or Niese are moving to the bullpen. Either of those guys will give them that left handed bullpen arm. They just need to get to the playoffs first. The playoff rotation will be Harvey, deGrom and either Niese or Syndergaard... I'm guessing it will be Niese starting with Syndergaard and Matz as 7th inning guys who can get the ball to Clipart and Familia.

I think that will be the strategy if they make the playoffs. In the meantime they could use another lefty in the pen. Should be a proven guy though (it probably won't happen). One semi-reliable lefty in the bullpen just doesn't leave me feeling comfortable.

 

[Knicks411]

I think it has more to do with the revenue that they would receive from a deep playoff run. I have come to the conclusion that the Wilpons are having some serious financial problems, and don't have the money.

Ha, what on earth brought you to that conclusion??

The bridge loan to MLB was a few years ago; they didn't pay it back on time. That right there should have been enough to force them to sell. They have loans out with JP or BOA now; i forget which. Pretty sure they just refinanced it in the last few days.

The Wilpons admitted in SI that they signed players to deferred compensation contracts because they figured with Madoff's returns, by the time they had to pay that money they've would have made more money that from Madoff. The problems with that are:

1) It's the player's money they are essentially loaning to the club to enhance the club's present by allowing them to spend that money to improve the team such that, (hopefully), the player will play his last years on contending teams and then get the financial security of a continuing income into his retirement.

2) Once loaned, the money is the ballclub's money. the ballclub is a corporation. The Wilpons are majority owners but that doesn't mean the corporation's money belongs to them. They can decide that the corporation should pay them a salary or a dividend. They can sell stock and make money off of that. But they can't just take the ballclub's money and give it to Bernie Madoff to see if they can make a personal profit off of it.

Frankly, that is a crime or should be. And it's a bigger crime if they knew Madoff was running a Ponzi scheme. It's worse than anything the McCourts did. The Wilpons should have been thrown out of baseball for their shenanghans but, unlike Frank McCourt, Fred Wilpon was buddies with Bud Selig so he's not only still in baseball but, as you point out, sitting pretty.

I don't really have a problem with the first item; teams defer salary all the time. In general, considering inflation, it's smart. In this case; not so much.

 

[SWC75]

The one area you are incorrect, unfortunately, is that baseball teams are not corporations... well at least all but four (http://www.forbes.com/2007/02/16/baseball-team-ownership-biz-cx_mw_0217baseball.html). The article is old and I think the Cubs are no longer owned by a corporation either. So this means that unfortunately the Wilpons can do whatever the hell they want because its their money. If the Mets were owned by a corporation I suspect the Wilpons would have been tossed a long time ago and to your point probably in jail. I agree with the rest of your post.

I don't know what it is about NY state teams and owners. The Bills had Wilson who, god bless his soul, either couldn't afford to compete or didn't know how to compete in the new NFL world that is entirely salary cap driven. I have a TON of respect for Wilson as he is the only reason the Bills are in Buffalo but it's fun to see the team change under the Pegulas. Dolan is the worst owner in the NBA and potentially all of sports, although weirdly the Rangers do pretty well in spite of him. And the Mets have the Wilpons. For the last 15 years my three main professional teams have been saddled by owners who were and in some cases are holding them back.

http://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/snapshot.asp?privcapId=12486682

"The New York Metropolitan Baseball Club Inc. operates a baseball club and team in New York. The company was founded in 1961 and is based in New York, New York. The New York Metropolitan Baseball Club Inc. operates as a subsidiary of Sterling Mets L.P."


Your article says "Currently, only four teams are owned by outside corporations–the Atlanta Braves by Liberty, the Chicago Cubs by Tribune Co. , the Seattle Mariners byNintendo and the Toronto Blue Jays by Rogers Communications ." That doesn't mean the team itself is not incorporated. It means the other teams have individuals or groups of investors who own the majority of the stock.

 

[OttoMets]

What was with Darling's ranting and raving about Robles's "etiquette" breach last night? I often agree with him, but this is one time when it really would have been nice to have Keith in the booth; neither Ron nor Gary even hinted at presenting an opposing viewpoint.

When I was taught to play the game, one point of emphasis was that anyone who has two feet in the batter's box better have both eyes on the pitcher and be prepared to swing. If not, ask for time and get out of the box.

 

[OttoMets]

... Bobby Bonilla's being the most infamous example.

...

The Mets gave more money to Bonilla in 2015 than they will to Harvey and de Grom combined. Fun fact.

 

[Knicks411]

What was with Darling's ranting and raving about Robles's "etiquette" breach last night? I often agree with him, but this is one time when it really would have been nice to have Keith in the booth; neither Ron nor Gary even hinted at presenting an opposing viewpoint.

When I was taught to play the game, one point of emphasis was that anyone who has two feet in the batter's box better have both eyes on the pitcher and be prepared to swing. If not, ask for time and get out of the box.

Yeah I would have liked someone to at least bring up this point. I can get the argument of not wanting to throw a pitch when a guy isn't looking, but why aren't you looking at the pitcher if you're in the box?

 

[OrangeFoo]

Yeah I would have liked someone to at least bring up this point. I can get the argument of not wanting to throw a pitch when a guy isn't looking, but why aren't you looking at the pitcher if you're in the box?

I see both sides... Darling's point was that he was looking at his feet to make sure they were in the box before looking up and Robles didn't wait to see if he was looking up. Darling was basically saying that you can't throw at a guy who isn't looking because you could hit him. I basically stopped playing baseball after taking a line drive to the face as a pitcher and after never being able to hit a baseball so I have no idea if it's common to look down when first stepping into the batter's box to see where you are or not. But I do know when I play softball I step in look at the plate, tap it and then look up. Is that not allowed?

My bigger concern is that either Murph or Cespedes is going to get beaned tonight and this will escalate into something that could lead to suspensions. Unlike the Phillies the Mets are playing for big stakes here and can't afford suspensions... although if Colon was suspended I might be cool with that.

 

[Knicks411]

I see both sides... Darling's point was that he was looking at his feet to make sure they were in the box before looking up and Robles didn't wait to see if he was looking up. Darling was basically saying that you can't throw at a guy who isn't looking because you could hit him. I basically stopped playing baseball after taking a line drive to the face as a pitcher and after never being able to hit a baseball so I have no idea if it's common to look down when first stepping into the batter's box to see where you are or not. But I do know when I play softball I step in look at the plate, tap it and then look up. Is that not allowed?

My bigger concern is that either Murph or Cespedes is going to get beaned tonight and this will escalate into something that could lead to suspensions. Unlike the Phillies the Mets are playing for big stakes here and can't afford suspensions... although if Colon was suspended I might be cool with that.

I agree that i see both sides. It can be dangerous to throw a ball when someone isn't looking. The umpire gave him the ready for pitch, he had both feed in the box...I don't really know. Robles does like to quick pitch people. I don't think Ruf was checking to see if his feet were in the box though.
I also think the D'Arnaud bat flip earlier in the game got the Phillies riled up, I don't think it was just Robles.

 

[SWC75]

Baseball teams spend entirely too much time getting incensed over "unwritten rules". I think they do it to pump themselves up. I agree with the point of view that, if a better has both feet in the box, it's up to him to be ready and the pitcher has the right to throw the ball when he pleases. In fact, I think one way they could speed up and improve the games is to not allow time-outs.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Baseball teams spend entirely too much time getting incensed over "unwritten rules". I think they do it to pump themselves up. I agree with the point of view that, if a better has both feet in the box, it's up to him to be ready and the pitcher has the right to throw the ball when he pleases. In fact, I think one way they could speed up and improve the games is to not allow time-outs.

This is one thing I am not looking forward to if/when the Mets make the playoffs. Playoff baseball is filled with batters staring into space for what seems like 5 minutes after every pitch while the TV guys give us closeups of the dugouts of each team which given the clarity of hdtv lets you see their boogers and nose hairs. I will say that those pauses do ratchet up the tension though.

 

[skurey]

I'm pissed

 

[skurey]

big trouble

 

[Briancuse]

Horrible loss today, you can't lose that game.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Horrible loss today, you can't lose that game.

Why oh why didn't they go to Familia?

The Mets bullpen is a major weakness right now. Can't get any clean innings... every out is a struggle. Not good. Going to cost them the pennant.

 

[SWC75]

Starting to get images of...2007!!!!

 

[Briancuse]

Huge win today.

 

[OttoMets]

Can't believe that anyone on that roster has respect for Matt Harvey this morning.

 

[SWC75]

Can't believe that anyone on that roster has respect for Matt Harvey this morning.

From the telecast it appeared he didn't want to come out. I think he's just been caught in the middle of this.

"The last thing I ever want to do, especially in a close game like that, is come out," said Harvey, scheduled for two more (probably abbreviated) starts during the regular season. "I'm going to be ready for my next start, whenever it is." (ESPN)

I am so sick of pitch counts and inning counts. They turn 1-0 leads into 2-11 losses.

I'm glad SU found a way to win. What a weekend it would have been without that. Other than that it was a root canal.

 

[OttoMets]

From the telecast it appeared he didn't want to come out. I think he's just been caught in the middle of this.

"The last thing I ever want to do, especially in a close game like that, is come out," said Harvey, scheduled for two more (probably abbreviated) starts during the regular season. "I'm going to be ready for my next start, whenever it is." (ESPN)

I am so sick of pitch counts and inning counts. They turn 1-0 leads into 2-11 losses.

I'm glad SU found a way to win. What a weekend it would have been without that. Other than that it was a root canal.

Agree with the general sentiment. And maybe he did get caught in the middle, but it's Harvey's own employee who created the problem. And if he wanted to pitch a reasonable number of innings, he could make that happen. So I'm bitter toward him, fair or not.

It's like Doc Gooden said a couple weeks ago - what kind of a pitcher is close to clinching and isn't willing to give everything he's got to make that happen? This is 180 degrees different from Santana throwing the two-hitter against the Marlins in '08. Harvey just doesn't stack up favorably against a lot of his predecessors.

 

[orangefog]

Agree with the general sentiment. And maybe he did get caught in the middle, but it's Harvey's own employee who created the problem. And if he wanted to pitch a reasonable number of innings, he could make that happen. So I'm bitter toward him, fair or not.

It's like Doc Gooden said a couple weeks ago - what kind of a pitcher is close to clinching and isn't willing to give everything he's got to make that happen? This is 180 degrees different from Santana throwing the two-hitter against the Marlins in '08. Harvey just doesn't stack up favorably against a lot of his predecessors.

But the guy is staring a $100 million + contract in the face. One more nasty arm injury and that all goes away. It has to be difficult to balance what your doctor and agent are feeding you with your competitive instincts. I am not sure what I would do in his situation.

 

[OttoMets]

But the guy is staring a $100 million + contract in the face. One more nasty arm injury and that all goes away. It has to be difficult to balance what your doctor and agent are feeding you with your competitive instincts. I am not sure what I would do in his situation.

I do think the injury risk is overblown. The innings limit was arbitrary and the medical information doesn't seem to indicate that he's at significantly greater risk of wrecking his elbow again.

Wouldn't like to see anyone get hurt, of course.

 

[orangefog]

I do think the injury risk is overblown. The innings limit was arbitrary and the medical information doesn't seem to indicate that he's at significantly greater risk of wrecking his elbow again.

Wouldn't like to see anyone get hurt, of course.

Of course not, nobody wants him to get hurt. I can just empathize with him, if his agent is in his ear saying that the doctor has found that beyond X amount of innings is putting his future at risk. I can see an athlete taking the advice of his paid representation. The thing is, they are trying to protect his future, but at the same time, taking this course of action may scare off many of the teams that would have offered him a huge contract, questioning his competitiveness.

 

[OttoMets]

Of course not, nobody wants him to get hurt. I can just empathize with him, if his agent is in his ear saying that the doctor has found that beyond X amount of innings is putting his future at risk. I can see an athlete taking the advice of his paid representation. The thing is, they are trying to protect his future, but at the same time, taking this course of action may scare off many of the teams that would have offered him a huge contract, questioning his competitiveness.

That's a more nuanced and accurate take than I gave.

After this weekend, I just want to call the guy derogatory names.