Mike waters article on early entries

[realorange]

Ah, the Internet! Let's argue about something that's unknowable without ever admitting it's an opinion!

It's quite strong opinion that Grayson would have gone higher last year than this.

 

[Knicks411]

I've said my opinion on this subject, but I would highly recommend listening to the Bill Simmons podcast with JJ Redick that they just did.

At the end of podcast (last 10 minutes or so, maybe?), JJ gives his POV on how he viewed going to Duke vs. the NBA at the time he went and what he would do now. He expounds on it, but he said that if he were coming to Duke now, he would only stay two years.

He also gives his opinion on college basketball vs the NBA and what you can do in college vs the NBA to get better.

Link: J.J. Redick on Philly’s Future, CP3’s Moment, and Stopping LeBron

I just finished listening. He made some really good points. I hate that I like him so much.

 

[jgeorge322]

Which raises the question of whether another year in school would help them learn to manage their money better.

Thats a definite no.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Indeed - the real question is if waiting another year would have improved their draft status or overall development and thus increased their earnings. And did he forget Harris and Devendorf?

The concept that you can develope your basketball skills more by having academic requirements than just training for basketball has always struck me as odd.

 

[Bayside44]

The concept that you can develope your basketball skills more by having academic requirements than just training for basketball has always struck me as odd.

A player at Cuse would have basketball from lets say 1PM on. Would spend 12-15 nights away from home for game travel as opposed to whatever NBA guys have (50 plus nights).

As far as the money thing goes, not like they guys are getting a 30 year fixed mortgage on some modestly priced house.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The thing people always overrate is how much maturity changes year to year.

I don't know about you guys, but I made a jump in maturity as a freshman because I was living away from home, but Sophomore to Senior year I was pretty much the same guy.

And don't even get me started on my 5 and a half years as a master's student.

 

[DoctorBombay]

JB for the most part has contended that getting to the second contract is the point. Lydon and Richardson aside, 8 of 12 made it to the second contract. That's quite an accomplishment. As for the $3M - $4M, the point isn't that most ppl don't make that in a lifetime, it's that most ppl don't spend like young NBA players spend. Right off the top you're losing more than 50% of it before you see a real dime. It's a well proven axiom that the more you have the more you spend.

 

[DoctorBombay]

The concept that you can develope your basketball skills more by having academic requirements than just training for basketball has always struck me as odd.

This is a great point. Its like the young singer, actor, or comedian being told to go to college instead of getting paid to be on stage and hone his craft.
If side issues of maturity become a hindrance, that's another aspect altogther. But there's no doubt that the best path is one where they can hone their talent, while getting compensated. Seems obvious, don't it?

 

[jgeorge322]

This is a great point. Its like the young singer, actor, or comedian being told to go to college instead of getting paid to be on stage and hone his craft.
If side issues of maturity become a hindrance, that's another aspect altogther. But there's no doubt that the best path is one where they can hone their talent, while getting compensated. Seems obvious, don't it?

Its actually not. Theres a lot more that goes into it and everyone is different. Fit is a huge part. Also, not taking on more than you can handle too soon, is another factor. Its better for some to continue to play in college and build your confidence than jumping early for a pay check when you arent ready and get discouraged. Doing anything strictly for monetary purposes is typically not the best way to make a decision. The fact that people try to boil it down to simply that and pretentiously act that its so “obvious” is plain and simple ignorant.

 

[DoctorBombay]

Its actually not. Theres a lot more that goes into it and everyone is different. Fit is a huge part. Also, not taking on more than you can handle too soon, is another factor. Its better for some to continue to play in college and build your confidence than jumping early for a pay check when you arent ready and get discouraged. Doing anything strictly for monetary purposes is typically not the best way to make a decision. The fact that people try to boil it down to simply that and pretentiously act that its so “obvious” is plain and simple ignorant.

Puhleeze. Again, JMHO, but returning to college to play another year to gain"maturity", or to avoid "taking on more than you can handle too soon", is a crock of isht put up by those with a selfish interest in not seeing these guys leave their "favorite" team.
Its not a "one size fits all" scenario, that's for sure, but the examples of kids who've stayed an extra year and lowered their stock in the one profession that they've trained for their entire lives, are many and varied.
The ignorance comes when folks try to dictate the life choices of others based on their own self interests. I submit if the opportunity exists to leave, then in almost every case, the better option is to in fact do so. Will there be a coupla kids that fall through the cracks "following the money"? Of course. But people attend college to earn degrees, to enable them to increase their market value. Whether that takes 2 years, 4 years, or 8 years, is wholly dependent on the subject they're majoring in. If a 2nd year Engineering student is recruited outta SU by GE and offered a ton of money to leave before getting their piece of paper, what...should they refuse that option because they haven't earned their degree? And again, questions of individual maturity are not what I'm talking about here. Gaining the opportunity is, in all its simplicity, the bottomline. JMHO

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Puhleeze. Again, JMHO, but returning to college to play another year to gain"maturity", or to avoid "taking on more than you can handle too soon", is a crock of isht put up by those with a selfish interest in not seeing these guys leave their "favorite" team.
Its not a "one size fits all" scenario, that's for sure, but the examples of kids who've stayed an extra year and lowered their stock in the one profession that they've trained for their entire lives, are many and varied.
The ignorance comes when folks try to dictate the life choices of others based on their own self interests. I submit if the opportunity exists to leave, then in almost every case, the better option is to in fact do so. Will there be a coupla kids that fall through the cracks "following the money"? Of course. But people attend college to earn degrees, to enable them to increase their market value. Whether that takes 2 years, 4 years, or 8 years, is wholly dependent on the subject they're majoring in. If a 2nd year Engineering student is recruited outta SU by GE and offered a ton of money to leave before getting their piece of paper, what...should they refuse that option because they haven't earned their degree? And again, questions of individual maturity are not what I'm talking about here. Gaining the opportunity is, in all its simplicity, the bottomline. JMHO

People who want others to delay their dreams don't seem to understand that these things aren't just dreams for these kids: they are burning, consuming passions.
Jennifer Lawrence, I believe, left school at about 13 to pursue her passion. ( Not sure how that worked)

 

[All4SU]

11 early departures in the last decade. Sheesh!

 

[two3zone]

11 early departures in the last decade. Sheesh!

And most of them barely played.

 

[RandygoCuse]

Its actually not. Theres a lot more that goes into it and everyone is different. Fit is a huge part. Also, not taking on more than you can handle too soon, is another factor. Its better for some to continue to play in college and build your confidence than jumping early for a pay check when you arent ready and get discouraged. Doing anything strictly for monetary purposes is typically not the best way to make a decision. The fact that people try to boil it down to simply that and pretentiously act that its so “obvious” is plain and simple ignorant.

I also think that athletics is unique from other fields in that we really don't know if players will develop better playing college ball compared to G-League/NBA.

 

[HOFCeluck]

If doctors have to stay in school then we should make people who want to play a game for money stay as well.

 

[jgeorge322]

People who want others to delay their dreams don't seem to understand that these things aren't just dreams for these kids: they are burning, consuming passions.
Jennifer Lawrence, I believe, left school at about 13 to pursue her passion. ( Not sure how that worked)

You act like this is so personal. Some people think its better to go back to school. Others think otherwise. Im sure theres some wild cards out there, but no rational person would wish that a syracuse player come back to school to thw detriment of his own career. You trying to phrase it that way is dishonest.

 

[HOFCeluck]

no rational person would wish that a syracuse player come back to school to thw detriment of his own career.

Rational people? Probably not.

But you can make an argument that people who post on a message board about their favorite sports team aren't rational. Let alone the ones on syr.com or the ones who follow players/recruits on twitter.

 

[CusefanATL]

When Syracuse basketball players leave early for NBA, it's almost always right decision

What i dont get about the article is there is a lack of explanation as to the criteria for what he considers a right decisuob. This seems to be an editorial. waters seems to say the decision to leave might not have been a bad one, but that doesnt mean its the right decision imho. We can never truly know what is right or wrong as you can only make one choice, but waters should at least provide some type of rationale, otherwise, he mine as well just publish a list of career nba earnings for former players which the post does every so often as well.

I like Mike Waters - this was 1 of his worst articles I can ever remember. YOu are spot on calling it an editorial.

Using the JOhnny Flynn injury as a reason it was the right decision is dumbfounding. He literally wouldnt have been in that situation had he stayed. That being said, he made the right decision to go pro at the time (no one would argue that, even though Waters said some did which is wrong). But in hindsight (which cant be used in reasoning), staying almost assuredly wouldnt have ruined his career. He would probably still be playing and made much more money.

 

[CusefanATL]

If we're talking about success simply being a kid going high in the draft and getting a big payday, then anybody who signed for a million plus made a good decision.
But, if basketball is an art, (and, isn't that why we follow it?) then we should be evaluating success by how well each player developed his game in order to establish an appreciable career in the NBA.

That isnt true.

Here is a good example - Lebron could have probably gone pro in football or basketall. he probably would have been a phenomenal football player and maybe made $75-100 million. Great decision right?

Wrong - because he chose basketball - he will make nearly $2 billion by the end of his career.

Every decision has consequences - some are clear and easy decisions - some arent. Tyus is not an easy decision by any means. staying may be right it may be wrong. and there is no way to know for sure which way to go. As a Cuse fan, you can only hope whatever he chooses works out for him.