My best case - Oklahoma to B1G

[tep624]

I'm going on record saying that SU won't be a B10 consideration until we hear some announcement that we're pairing up with SUNY upstate medical (to get AAU back).

Or if ND wants us as their partner to join.

Both very unlikely scenarios.

I'm wondering though if the B1G (not saying SU would get an invite anyway) would consider a "restore AAU membership" model, similar to how Temple was put on notice to upgrade their athletic programs or get the boot from the Big East. Basically, we'll accept you into membership, providing that by year x you have restored your AAU membership.

That being said, Nebraska was in the same boat as SU (recently lost AAU membership) and ND is not an AAU member. Not sure if Nebraska is being pushed to restore AAU membership or not.

 

[IthacaMatt]

The B1G has repeatedly stated that there is no rule about contiguous states. The B1G analyzed data from about 2 dozen schools, several that would not be contiguous. Remember, they would have taken Texas (with or without TAMU) and flatly rejected taking any schools hanging on to Texas' coattails (read: TTech).

From an academic perspective, Kansas, ISU and OU are all viable. From a marketing POV, none are viable. Syracuse, BC, UVA or UNC bring more than all three of those schools combined. I lean towards the B1G looking for large markets. Syracuse (good relations with B1G schools) UVA, UNC and GATech are all strong candidates.

Sorry, but Oklahoma is a MAJOR brand. To say they are not viable from a marketing perspective is wrong, IMO.

 

[orange79]

Texas and OK, first and foremost, if $$ is driving everything. Markets that the B1G isn't in, and markets that those teams own. I may not understand all the nuances of the cable companies and subscriber packages, but I'd think that a television network that people actually tune into would be more valuable to the cable companies than one that people don't (which is what will happen with RU and MD - their fan following in their states pales in comparison to Texas or OK).

When the Big 10 did their first round of expansion in 2010, and they hired an investment firm to analyze schools, the schools they considered were Nebraska, Missouri, Syracuse, Pitt, Rutgers, and Notre Dame. They settled on Nebraska for the time being, but it's not a coincidence that all of those schools were contiguous to the current model. It's also not a coincidence that MD was contiguous to Rutgers and Rutgers to PSU.

I would think that the B1G hired someone this time around too. If they chose MD and RU, it's because they thought those two would give them the biggest boost in their revenue stream (along with some other added bonuses previously documented on this board - entry into east coast markets, dividing the ACC territory, an FU/warning shot to ND, etc.). But mainly, it's a money grab. In this case, it seems that entry into additional households trumps fan following. We agree to disagree.

 

[orange79]

I'm wondering though if the B1G (not saying SU would get an invite anyway) would consider a "restore AAU membership" model, similar to how Temple was put on notice to upgrade their athletic programs or get the boot from the Big East. Basically, we'll accept you into membership, providing that by year x you have restored your AAU membership.

That being said, Nebraska was in the same boat as SU (recently lost AAU membership) and ND is not an AAU member. Not sure if Nebraska is being pushed to restore AAU membership or not.

This is related to something I have been wondering about. I wonder if the coming change in SU administration could subtly change the direction of the university towards a more research-oriented bent that could lead to reinstatement in the AAU. I admit I don't know enough about this to further comment, but interesting to think about.

 

[HtownOrange]

Sorry, but Oklahoma is a MAJOR brand. To say they are not viable from a marketing perspective is wrong, IMO.

I'm referring to the market size that the school is within. Oklahoma is clearly a national brand and a solid add to any conference.
Oklahoma has 3.7MM people. Much less than Upstate NY, less than half of Virginia's 8MM and NC and Georgia's near 10MM. As it appears that the B1G is looking for TV sets for their BTN, OU, though a good choice, is not the most lucrative. I would not be surprised to see the B1G take OU because that would all but guarantee BTN coverage in the state of Oklahoma.

 

[Jeepers]

I'd imagine we were on the low end when they did their research. We gave up AAU shortly after that, if memory serves. Would be even lower now. Private is bad enough--it'd be a hard sell without AAU as well.

Nebraska was kicked out of AAU by their own schools (Michigan and Northwestern, I believe). I would think the B10 is doing everything in their power to bump them back up.

Curious if it would be easier to join the AAU, or rejoin the AAU. I know it takes an awfully long time to get into the AAU.

Wondered the same thing, orange79. Whenever I hear someone in a high position quits, I always assume they were fired. Who knows--might be related.

 

[HtownOrange]

I'd imagine we were on the low end when they did their research. We gave up AAU shortly after that, if memory serves. Would be even lower now. Private is bad enough--it'd be a hard sell without AAU as well.

Nebraska was kicked out of AAU by their own schools (Michigan and Northwestern, I believe). I would think the B10 is doing everything in their power to bump them back up.

Curious if it would be easier to join the AAU, or rejoin the AAU. I know it takes an awfully long time to get into the AAU.

Wondered the same thing, orange79. Whenever I hear someone in a high position quits, I always assume they were fired. Who knows--might be related.

I would tend to agree that we may be a lesser option, especially now that Rutgers has joined, with the exception that Syracuse still brings in a huge market and has inroads to NYC, a real prize, after Texas or ND. Also, we still have support in the B1G.

The Issue of the AAU is less than most people are making of it. The AAU is focused on hard science research, primarily medical. Nebraska will not be getting a medical school, the state has a medical school and cannot really support one at UNL. regardless, from my understanding - which should not be taken as carved in stone - is that UNL research a lot of agriculture issues. Similarly, Syracuse researches a lot of administrative/managerial issues, neither is considered the "hard sciences" (engineering, mathematics, medicine) though both do some research in them. Also, Syracuse does a lot of research for private industry and the state, whereas AAU looks primarily at federally funded research.

Personally, I would like Syracuse to increase their hard sciences research, if possible, work out a co-research deal with Upstate or another hospital. Whether Syracuse regains AAU status or not, I think it would be good to invest in hard sciences.

 

[orange79]

Wondered the same thing, orange79. Whenever I hear someone in a high position quits, I always assume they were fired. Who knows--might be related.

According to cto (who should know), Cantor was not pushed. cto said 10-ish years is about the average time spent in a chancellor's job, in general. Will be interesting to see if SU moves in a different direction.

 

[SmilinBob]

I have to wonder if BC was ever contacted by the Big 10? They fit in a lot of ways except for the private school thing.

 

[Jeepers]

I dunno. From what a I hear, some of these initial feelers are being laid out at the AAU meetings. Also, AAU just makes it easier to get the go-ahead from everyone involved. Doubt Delany actually cares himself.

 

[Upstate]

BC was the latest rumor late last week.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'm referring to the market size that the school is within. Oklahoma is clearly a national brand and a solid add to any conference.
Oklahoma has 3.7MM people. Much less than Upstate NY, less than half of Virginia's 8MM and NC and Georgia's near 10MM. As it appears that the B1G is looking for TV sets for their BTN, OU, though a good choice, is not the most lucrative. I would not be surprised to see the B1G take OU because that would all but guarantee BTN coverage in the state of Oklahoma.

Yes, but Oklahoma is a national brand, just like Nebraska. The Big 10 is balancing the addition of television sets (Maryland, Rutgers), with strong national brands that appeal outside the immediate geographic area. Oklahoma and Nebraska are national brands, that casual fans anywhere in the country would be interested in watching on a given day, say compared to an Iowa State, or a UConn or a Kentucky (for football).

 

[IthacaMatt]

I'd imagine we were on the low end when they did their research. We gave up AAU shortly after that, if memory serves. Would be even lower now. Private is bad enough--it'd be a hard sell without AAU as well.

Nebraska was kicked out of AAU by their own schools (Michigan and Northwestern, I believe). I would think the B10 is doing everything in their power to bump them back up.

Curious if it would be easier to join the AAU, or rejoin the AAU. I know it takes an awfully long time to get into the AAU.

Wondered the same thing, orange79. Whenever I hear someone in a high position quits, I always assume they were fired. Who knows--might be related.

Getting SU back up to AAU standards would require ending the program that is offering admission to any City of Syracuse students who meet certain grades. The "town and gown" programs have generated lots of goodwill and publicity for the school, and its innovative thinking about how to use their assets to improve the community, but it has been at a price, in terms of bringing in a less exclusive student body, with lower SAT scores. You have to be more selective in who you admit to get back to AAU level, and the research has to continue to increase.