Nick Williams to FSU

[anomander]

If not Williams, who exactly you thinking about blaming here?

The lack of talent.

 

[Scooch]

The lack of talent.

This confused me regarding Robinson too. So Williams is an ace recruiter but we don’t have talent on the DL? Is this a “freshman arent ready” thing or are we totally bereft of talent?

 

[bnoro]

Williams is towards the bottom of the people blamed for this. They had Dwight Freeney as a part time coach specifically working with DE’s. I guess he should take some of the blame as well?

Yeah, maybe Freeney isn't a good coach either. Elite players don't always translate to good coaches.

 

[ImperialOrange]

The lack of talent.

And who was responsible for said lack of talent then? So your point is he can actually coach but was poor recruiting then?

 

[illi3]

The lack of talent.

So we can't lose the dynamic amazing recruiter who also had no talent at his position that be recruits for?

 

[djorange1989]

Williams is a recruiting powerhouse. That hit is gonna leave a mark.

He'll kill it at FSU.

He won’t have much time to kill it, when Norvell gets canned in October

 

[Trueblue25]

LSU and FSU can afford to bring these guys on to be recruiting focused because they can also afford the x’s and o’s guys to work alongside them.

We have the best recruiter in the ACC in Fran. He needs to complement that by supplementing his weaknesses. That’s experience/development and in game coaching.

Fran’s showing he intends to be a CEO and decentralize command with experience and proven coaching. He can handle recruiting. Time to bring in guys that can coach.

 

[oldpinepoint]

LSU and FSU can afford to bring these guys on to be recruiting focused because they can also afford the x’s and o’s guys to work alongside them.

We have the best recruiter in the ACC in Fran. He needs to complement that by supplementing his weaknesses. That’s experience/development and in game coaching.

Fran’s showing he intends to be a CEO and decentralize command with experience and proven coaching. He can handle recruiting. Time to bring in guys that can coach.

I would argue FSU cant afford anything right now.

 

[HtownOrange]

I would argue FSU cant afford anything right now.

Spot on. The BOT,so heavily enamored with AD Michael Alford not so long ago, bought into his garbage plan, spent money,took on debt and poorly bargained contracts, has put their collective foot down and refused to allow him to fire Nor ell because they cannot afford the buyout nor the new contract.

ESPN gifted them the court case settlement and they cannot buy their way out of the ACC.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

LSU and FSU can afford to bring these guys on to be recruiting focused because they can also afford the x’s and o’s guys to work alongside them.

We have the best recruiter in the ACC in Fran. He needs to complement that by supplementing his weaknesses. That’s experience/development and in game coaching.

Fran’s showing he intends to be a CEO and decentralize command with experience and proven coaching. He can handle recruiting. Time to bring in guys that can coach.

He made a mistake that many first time head coaches do. Got away with it his first year, but the defense has been an unmitigated disaster since Fran took over. He promoted his good friend from position coach to DC and it did not work out. He has corrected the mistake.

 

[orange79]

I would argue FSU cant afford anything right now.

 

[PhatOrange]

LSU and FSU can afford to bring these guys on to be recruiting focused because they can also afford the x’s and o’s guys to work alongside them.

We have the best recruiter in the ACC in Fran. He needs to complement that by supplementing his weaknesses. That’s experience/development and in game coaching.

Fran’s showing he intends to be a CEO and decentralize command with experience and proven coaching. He can handle recruiting. Time to bring in guys that can coach.

If the narrative is that Williams is not a good coach because his unit didn't perform well, then how is it that a losing team can afford to bring in a bad position coach, and also in a new scheme 3-3-5. I just don't buy it.

He's a huge loss from a recruiting standpoint. There's no sugar coating it. Williams was on the road a lot. I feel like he was in darn near every single home visit picture.

Robinson was long considered a top notch DL coach and maybe that's because he's always been able to coach the very best high school kids. But at LSU he'll get his 5* DTs, will coach them to the nfl and look like an all-star again. Can't see him ever being more than a position coach at the P4 level though.

 

[UD1954]

It's easier to look like a great coach when all you're dealing with is 5* talent which is what Robinson will have at LSU.....you need a different kind of coach trying to develop 3*talent. While l love Williams energy his lack of experience showed by the product on the field. The adversity we had this year (losing streak) showed all the warts(teaching) in the coaching staff. l wish the coaches fired nothing but the best going forward.

 

[anomander]

And who was responsible for said lack of talent then? So your point is he can actually coach but was poor recruiting then?

which one of his recruits did he actually coach? We had all upperclassman leftover space fillers. I’d take a bet that this classes DE haul may provide results.

 

[anomander]

So we can't lose the dynamic amazing recruiter who also had no talent at his position that be recruits for?

He had no talent because he couldn’t max out 5th yr Sr Chase Simmons , oft-injured Sr. Denis Jaquez, 25 year old David Reese?

ok got it.

 

[SuRaider307]

My take is that DC coverage/play calling is atleast 50% responsible for our DL underperforming. How aggressive were we this year? Did anyone actually see complicated/well structured blitz packages being utilized other than sparingly and even then were very generic as i have watched every game atleast a few times. I would also guess that some coaching was lacking from units working together depending on the calls/coverage for plays. There were times when I scratched my head after seeing the cushion on either the slot or WR1 in weird times when comparing down/distance with the actual coverage. It told me were were inexperienced in either the secondary or coaching or probably a little bit if both. I don't think there was a ton of trust between position groups with the coaches to be honest. Not saying infighting.. I am saying trust with players executing in the strongest position(literal)/line-up for the coverage/play call called. I think it was a combination of coaching/inexperience IMO

 

[ImperialOrange]

which one of his recruits did he actually coach? We had all upperclassman leftover space fillers. I’d take a bet that this classes DE haul may provide results.

Okay but you cannot have it both ways. He cannot be an elite recruiter AND not have been able to recruit over what you call "leftover space fillers. Elite recruiters would have ready made players from day 1.

He also cannot be an excellent coach AND not have been able to coach up "space fillers" while also not successful at coaching up underclassmen to surpass them.

I'm on record as saying both Coack Nick and Coach ERob should have gotten another year to coach more of "their" players but simply stating the logic being applied is flawed.

 

[PhatOrange]

It's a little disingenuous to have expected Williams and Robinson to upgrade the DL talent pool with ready made college players. Just like OL it's a position that takes some development. They were both responsible for landing 4-star DE Kamron Wilson and keeping him from flipping to Florida State. We'll see going forward if we can get those type of wins.

 

[ImperialOrange]

My take is that DC coverage/play calling is atleast 50% responsible for our DL underperforming. How aggressive were we this year? Did anyone actually see complicated/well structured blitz packages being utilized other than sparingly and even then were very generic as i have watched every game atleast a few times. I would also guess that some coaching was lacking from units working together depending on the calls/coverage for plays. There were times when I scratched my head after seeing the cushion on either the slot or WR1 in weird times when comparing down/distance with the actual coverage. It told me were were inexperienced in either the secondary or coaching or probably a little bit if both. I don't think there was a ton of trust between position groups with the coaches to be honest. Not saying infighting.. I am saying trust with players executing in the strongest position(literal)/line-up for the coverage/play call called. I think it was a combination of coaching/inexperience IMO

I don't think anything you mentioned is false nor are they mutually exclusive. We had holes all over the defense due to injury, talent level, play calling and coaching. Jobity and Perry being hurt along with Maraad leaving and Fadil graduating really hurt the DL. That said we brought in a few transfers and got seemingly little from them. Rooks, Reese and Thomas should have at least given us something albeit perhaps we took Thomas elder to land Thomas younger. We also had 5 frosh DL last year that all probably needed a year to cook. The Canadians specifically look the part athletically.

As with everything it all starts, and is magnified in the trenches. Beyond that our most experienced LB was hurt and we've seemingly not been able to coach up anyone behind the 3 players that were all new to that position for us last year (true frosh, transfer, position switch). Sparrow can't tackle, Heard and ZMG are enigmas at this point with athleticism to burn but no meaningful game time. Jahide, Fatim, Trey and Caden are all complete unknowns still after 2 years with the team.

Our tackling in the secondary was abysmal once Grant got hurt. CBs did well enough when called on but you can't keep running 3 safety sets once it's apparent you have 0 healthy, ready and or capable.

We consistently schemed for players we didn't have which is likely why there wasn't trust between groups and now our entire defensive staff is being turned over.

 

[ImperialOrange]

It's a little disingenuous to have expected Williams and Robinson to upgrade the DL talent pool with ready made college players. Just like OL it's a position that takes some development. They were both responsible for landing 4-star DE Kamron Wilson and keeping him from flipping to Florida State. We'll see going forward if we can get those type of wins.

Again, I thought they (Erob and Nick) should have gotten another year to prove their worth with healthy players (if they so desired) and we should have turned over the offensive coaching staff.

However, that doesn't change what we got from them as coaches with some recuits they brought in or had at their disposal via prior roster or transfers. My expectations aren't all first team conference players out of the box at Syracuse BUT there should be some production and a product that doesn't land in the triple digit rankings IMO.

 

[EuclidBred]

What does that mean?

It means Fran thought the staff/team would be better with a new voice in that room.

 

[Chip]

Losing Watson was just a killer for them

Yeah, 2nd portal window giveth (Angeli) and taketh (Watson).

The new one portal window policy is great for protecting who you have, but bad for your oh ****, that guy's not as good as I thought moments.

 

[RMH44]

Again, I thought they (Erob and Nick) should have gotten another year to prove their worth with healthy players (if they so desired) and we should have turned over the offensive coaching staff.

However, that doesn't change what we got from them as coaches with some recuits they brought in or had at their disposal via prior roster or transfers. My expectations aren't all first team conference players out of the box at Syracuse BUT there should be some production and a product that doesn't land in the triple digit rankings IMO.

I generally agree with this as long as ERob staying was as DL coach and not as DC. He was epically bad at that job.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[23Zone]

Yeah, maybe Freeney isn't a good coach either. Elite players don't always translate to good coaches.