Northwestern football players win bid to unionize

[jekelish]

http://espn.go.com/college-football...rn-wildcats-football-players-win-bid-unionize

 

[orange79]

 

[All4SU]

 

[orange79]

The President of Northwestern was already on record as saying if this was approved, Northwestern (and other private institutions) may well drop out of D-I. "If we got into collective bargaining situations, I would not take for granted that the Northwesterns of the world would continue to play Division I sports."

 

[jekelish]

The President of Northwestern was already on record as saying if this was approved, Northwestern (and other private institutions) may well drop out of D-I. "If we got into collective bargaining situations, I would not take for granted that the Northwesterns of the world would continue to play Division I sports."

"And other private institutions"

Well, at least that wouldn't mean Syracuse, since.....

Oh, sh**.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/25/us/northwestern-football-players-union/

(that's where the quote comes from...it's actually a former president of NW, but still, the point remains)

 

[All4SU]

Maybe, just maybe, this will turn up the pressure to form professional minor leagues for football and basketball, and start the pendulum to swing in the other direction.

 

[xc84]

Maybe, just maybe, this will turn up the pressure to form professional minor leagues for football and basketball, and start the pendulum to swing in the other direction.

One big reason college football is so successful is related to the affiliation felt by alumni and regional fans. The resulting popularity makes it profitable. Take away the school affiliation and no one would really care to watch these games. Players would really find out what they are worth...and they'd realize that their current compensation package is a heck of a lot more lucrative than what they will get minor leagues. After college, those that don't make the NFL (most college players) at least have a degree to take with them. After a few years in the minor leagues and their measly salaries, they will have nothing. The very thing they are now fighting for they will lose if they win. Only a very small percentage of players will be better off if unions become standard.

 

[CarolinaCuse]

This decision is understandable given today's climate - but, athletics at universities used to be a much different beast. The term student-athlete was no different at Univ of Florida or Syracuse than it was at Oberlin or Allegheny. Students played a sport to be involved, have fun, be competitive, and develop as a person. Where we are today is product of a system taking advantage of people's connection with their alma mater/local university and turning it into an entertainment business. There nothing wrong with that. I'm not sure that universities will be able to afford paying student-athletes. Title IX will ensure that it's equitable. Interesting times.

 

[milerock]

There is a finite pile of money. If colleges are forced to fork over more to the athletes, makes sense the pool of athletes
may have to become much smaller thereby costing scholarships and coaching jobs.

 

[Full_Rebar]

It's about leverage for the student-athletes. College football isn't going to go away, but maybe instead of the Ohio St AD getting bonuses because a wrestler won a National title or a team gets a 3.0 GPA, that money will go towards students. Or maybe, the NCAA will let students get endorsements without impacting eligibility, which doesn't cost the schools anything in theory (I know that the income from current endorsements will shift from schools to students). I see nothing wrong with Tyler Ennis getting $1-2 bucks for every #11 jersey or Ice Man shirt sold.

 

[All4SU]

I see nothing wrong with Tyler Ennis getting $1-2 bucks for every #11 jersey or Ice Man shirt sold.

I believe that is very naive thinking.

 

[Full_Rebar]

Why is it naive? Should Holy Shirt and SU profit from his likeness or because his 1-2 years of college is paid for then it's fair enough?

 

[xc84]

It's about leverage for the student-athletes. College football isn't going to go away, but maybe instead of the Ohio St AD getting bonuses because a wrestler won a National title or a team gets a 3.0 GPA, that money will go towards students. Or maybe, the NCAA will let students get endorsements without impacting eligibility, which doesn't cost the schools anything in theory (I know that the income from current endorsements will shift from schools to students). I see nothing wrong with Tyler Ennis getting $1-2 bucks for every #11 jersey or Ice Man shirt sold.

If I create a patent while working for my company, I don't get the royalties. The patent is not mine. While I won't say there is something wrong with Ennis getting royalties...I also don't see anything wrong with him not getting royalties. People are making too much of the value of the players without realizing the value is in the brand. The players benefit from the school's brand. The reason we would want to buy a Tyler Ennis jersey has much more to do with the school than Tyler Ennis.

 

[Knicks411]

I read a piece from one of the players involved who said that they are really focused on medical coverage right now anyway, and less about just getting paid.

If I create a patent while working for my company, I don't get the royalties. The patent is not mine. While I won't say there is something wrong with Ennis getting royalties...I also don't see anything wrong with him not getting royalties. People are making too much of the value of the players without realizing the value is in the brand. The players benefit from the school's brand. The reason we would want to buy a Tyler Ennis jersey has much more to do with the school than Tyler Ennis.

I think this is true to an extent, but I would wager there are more Tyler Ennis jerseys sold than there are BJ Johnson jerseys sold. Also, what was the school's brand built on? Carmelo Anthony, Derrick Coleman, Sherm, Dave Bing, etc. The players who came before. (To follow your example, you may not get royalties if you create a patent, but you'd probably get a raise or something, no?)

I know I've told this story before, but I post mostly on the bball board anyway. I remember an anecdote from the book Fab Five (guess what it was about) where Mitch Albom was hanging out with Chris Webber and they were going to get something to eat. Webber orders his food, roots around in his wallet, notices he doesn't have enough money, so he changes his order. As this is happening, a student is walking by wearing a Webber jersey that probably cost him $80 or whatever. The juxtaposition of Webber not having enough money to pay for his lunch (and granted, it's an anecdote, he would have forgotten to go to the ATM, i get it) and someone paying $80 to wear his likness and him basically not seeing a dime of it, strikes me as a little messed up.

 

[Knicks411]

Here's the post from Reddit I was talking about

[–]Northwestern WildcatsgoB1Gcats 913 points 1 month ago*

NU player here on a throwaway. This isn't about getting paid. What it is about is protection. Many of us will have numerous injuries throughout our playing careers. A group of those players will continue to feel the effects of those injuries long after their playing days are over. The goal is to have some sort of medical protection if we need surgeries stemming from injuries sustained while playing for our university. Another goal is graduate school for those who were fortunate enough to play as a true Freshman. Most student-athletes get redshirted in their first year, and receive one year of grad school payed for in their fifth year of eligibility. We feel as though it is fair to ask for the same investment from the university all around. It isn't about getting an extra $200 a month for spending. We have our stipend, and if we budget correctly we are able to make it stretch for the month. Would it be nice to have some part of jersey sales or memorabilia sales? Absolutely. But that is not the goal as of right now.

Just wanted to add in that I am extremely thankful for the opportunity I have been given to not only play football, but to attend a world class university such as Northwestern. It is an opportunity millions dream of having. We are treated well at Northwestern, but unfortunately that is not the case at many other schools. Hopefully we can create a voice for the players and clean up these issues.

 

[bevosu]

 

[Full_Rebar]

If I create a patent while working for my company, I don't get the royalties. The patent is not mine. While I won't say there is something wrong with Ennis getting royalties...I also don't see anything wrong with him not getting royalties. People are making too much of the value of the players without realizing the value is in the brand. The players benefit from the school's brand. The reason we would want to buy a Tyler Ennis jersey has much more to do with the school than Tyler Ennis.

So if Holy Shirt makes an Ice Man t-shirt, which the SU Bookstore sells for $14.99 would it be fair to say that people are buying that particular shirt because of SU or because of Tyler Ennis? I am not saying there are ways for student-athletes to receive supplemental funds without the institution having to pay them, cut sports, etc.

I won't speak for the guys at Holy Shirt, but I'd guess they would be ok with a business model that paid Ennis a portion of the revenue in exchange for using his likeness. They were on tv saying that the original shirt was going to say "Ennions" but it wasn't used because they were afraid of a NCAA violation.

 

[Knicks411]

Remember when Jay Bilas posted that tweet showing you could go on the NCAA website and search for specific player names and pull up their jerseys? When the NCAA has always said the jerseys for sale aren't connected to specific players? (Which, LOL) yeah that was pretty funny

i don't know what the right answer is here. but anything that makes the NCAA look as bad as possible is fine with me

 

[xc84]

So if Holy Shirt makes an Ice Man t-shirt, which the SU Bookstore sells for $14.99 would it be fair to say that people are buying that particular shirt because of SU or because of Tyler Ennis? I am not saying there are ways for student-athletes to receive supplemental funds without the institution having to pay them, cut sports, etc.

I won't speak for the guys at Holy Shirt, but I'd guess they would be ok with a business model that paid Ennis a portion of the revenue in exchange for using his likeness. They were on tv saying that the original shirt was going to say "Ennions" but it wasn't used because they were afraid of a NCAA violation.

I am saying if Tyler Ennis was playing in the D-League, no one would want his shirt or at least not nearly the number that want it today. On a D-league team, Ennis would just not get the fan loyalty he gets at a college...nor would he get the attention. So what's the difference. Is it Tyler Ennis or the his affiliation with a college team?

 

[SU2NASA]

I can't wait for women's volleyball collective bargaining.

 

[xc84]

For every Carmelo, there are 30 players who are out of the loop. Imagine the team chemistry that would develop. Honestly, why don't players just jump ship and get paid what they think they are worth from some pro team?

Hint: because they can't find anyone to pay them more

 

[SU2NASA]

For every Carmelo, there are 30 players who are out of the loop. Imagine the team chemistry that would develop. Honestly, why don't players just jump ship and get paid what they think they are worth from some pro team?

Hint: because they can't find anyone to pay them more

I'd wager that over 95% of college athletes do not bring in more revenue than they cost the university. And of those that do, it's because they're affiliated with the university.

$40,000 per year in tuition plus tutors, food, etc. How many players are responsible for generating that much revenue for SU?

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Summons the end of college athletic scholarships. Entirely need based scholarships coming up. Or, Congress will re-write the law, exempting scholarship students from the definition of employee, but providing some safeguards, like 5 year scholarships, not year to year, etc.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

For every Carmelo, there are 30 players who are out of the loop. Imagine the team chemistry that would develop. Honestly, why don't players just jump ship and get paid what they think they are worth from some pro team?

Hint: because they can't find anyone to pay them more

Or, they are not allowed to go pro until they reach some arbitrary age.

 

[Orangezoo]

The real question here is will NW be a trend setter or simply put themselves on an island?