Now is NOT the time to bail.

[DoctorBombay]

OK- I'm as frustrated as everyone else, and am sick & tired of losing. Period.
After the Minny game I stayed away from any CFB-related media, just to preserve my own sanity.
Upon further review- I'll play Capt. Obvious and reiterate that now is not the time to bail on this team.
We've been through the wringer, but I honestly feel HCDM is the man for this job, until proven otherwise.
I've watched Louisville and K-State, 2 teams that were in a similar position as we were, take major steps and yes, that's troubling. But, we all knew this year was gonna be tough, and honestly, 4 games is not enough to close the curtain.
Let's see the season play out and then have a SERIOUS, SERIOUS discussion when all is said and done.
Frankly, even if this year ends up a total disaster, I say let HCDM have next year as a final chance to realize his vision.
We're due for some good karma- we really have no other choice but to stick it out and back the squad to the best of our ability.
JMHO

 

[Chip]

No one is going to bail. We've been down this road before. People hit their most emotional point after games like Saturday, but no one is going anywhere. Might not prioritize watching each game if other plans are available, but that's the worst of it.

Hopefully we have a 1997-ish turnaround. Started 1-3 and then steamrolled through the remaining Big East games. There's nothing that makes me believe it could actually happen, but until it doesn't...let's at least beat Pitt (for once).

 

[44PRIDE]

Frankly, even if this year ends up a total disaster, I say let HCDM have next year as a final chance to realize his vision.

Really? Waste another year on an under performing coach? Why? So we can lose more recruits and fans?

The man is 0-8 against D1 competition. If HCDM doesn't go bowling this year, I say cut ties and go after a big fish.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Im just curious, and this isn't a jab at you or necessarily an implication of my loyalty, but what exactly do people see that to them makes "Marrone the man for the job". It's definitely unrelated to W-L.

 

[Nick44]

I think the problem that I have though is I can't even find any legitimate excuses to hang my hat on.

This year, he have a 5th yr sr QB who has played very well against a difficult schedule.

Next year, we likely have an inexperienced 5th yr sr QB vs an ACC conference schedule.

Can you really say with a straight face that next year will be better??

 

[DoctorBombay]

Its really quite simple- I'd rather he exhaust EVERY chance, then give up on him one year too soon.
Now obviously this year will play a major role in that determination. If we go 1-10, then he's gotta go.
But if we show improvement and we end the season with a few big wins, then I think he'll definitely deserve another year.
Put it this way, there was NO DOUBT that GRob was a disaster by the time he was canned- he had every opportunity.
I just believe HCDM deserves that same chance. I like his philosophy, dedication, and the direction he WANTS to take the program.
That is more than enough, IMO, to allow him another year to set things straight.

 

[44PRIDE]

Put it this way, there was NO DOUBT that GRob was a disaster by the time he was canned- he had every opportunity.
I just believe HCDM deserves that same chance. I like his philosophy, dedication, and the direction he WANTS to take the program.

So you would allow a head coach to run our program into the ground as Gump did before letting him go? That is foolish.

HCDM has made great strides off the field for the program. But the man can't make solid in-game decisions. Rather than running the program into the ground a second time, cut bait and hire a home-run hitter.

I don't think we can afford to start from scratch again.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

So you would allow a head coach to run our program into the ground as Gump did before letting him go? That is foolish.

HCDM has made great strides off the field for the program. But the man can't make solid in-game decisions. Rather than running the program into the ground a second time, cut bait and hire a home-run hitter.

I don't think we can afford to start from scratch again.

Since when does SU pay the money to hire home run hitters? The guys who many posters projected to be future home run hitters -- Skip Holtz, Turner Gill, Mike Locksley -- have done no better or worse than Doug.

 

[orangenirvana]

we all knew this year was gonna be tough

We did? Why?

It's year #4, this is the final season in the Big Easy and we have a sure-fire NFL Draft Pick (who is a 5th year senior!) behind center for the first time in 14 years.

If "we all knew this year was gonna be tough" then when isn't it going to be tough? Will it be easier when we don't have an NFL talent at QB? Will it be easier when we have to face a much more difficult conference schedule?

I'm not giving up and until I see otherwise I still say this team can/will win the Big East.

But please, for the love of God - enough with the excuses for loss after loss.

 

[mantonio]

The change that is needed immediately: RECRUITING

Marrone needs to bring in a specialist with a successful record of building a top notch talent base.

This team has no game changer on this squad, & you can't be Bowl eligible without at least ONE of those players.

 

[Shenexon]

Im just curious, and this isn't a jab at you or necessarily an implication of my loyalty, but what exactly do people see that to them makes "Marrone the man for the job". It's definitely unrelated to W-L.

It may be absolutely clear to others that Marrone isn't the man for the job, but I don't know that yet. Right now I'm more disappointed for him than in him. He's struggling to find the formula that he needs to be successful and I wish him the best. I want his to be a great story for SU and all of college football.

Wins and losses may be the ultimate metric, but complete focus on wins and losses gets you what happened at Penn State, SMU, and other places where football became more important than maintaining ethics & morals as part of the football program's place in the university as a whole. I still hope the program can find a way to win and to re-establish the strong football tradition that we've had in the past.

We see lots of good/great football coaches that have significant character flaws, i.e. Petrino, Paterno, Kiffin, Williams, Tressel, et al. I don't want that to be the moral of the story, i.e. you can either win games or you can maintain character in the program. I want a more elegant solution than that and am not ready to give up on it as yet. I believe in happy endings and will wait till this season is over to pass judgement on the team when 2/3 of the season is yet to be played. Past performance isn't always a good indicator of future results.

 

[RMH44]

So you would allow a head coach to run our program into the ground as Gump did before letting him go? That is foolish.

HCDM has made great strides off the field for the program. But the man can't make solid in-game decisions. Rather than running the program into the ground a second time, cut bait and hire a home-run hitter.

I don't think we can afford to start from scratch again.

Cut bait...? Home run hitter? Really?

How can a coach make great strides "off the field" yet run a program into the ground?

 

[br801]

It may be absolutely clear to others that Marrone isn't the man for the job, but I don't know that yet. Right now I'm more disappointed for him than in him. He's struggling to find the formula that he needs to be successful and I wish him the best. I want his to be a great story for SU and all of college football.

Wins and losses may be the ultimate metric, but complete focus on wins and losses gets you what happened at Penn State, SMU, and other places where football became more important than maintaining ethics & morals as part of the football program's place in the university as a whole. I still hope the program can find a way to win and to re-establish the strong football tradition that we've had in the past.

We see lots of good/great football coaches that have significant character flaws, i.e. Petrino, Paterno, Kiffin, Williams, Tressel, et al. I don't want that to be the moral of the story, i.e. you can either win games or you can maintain character in the program. I want a more elegant solution than that and am not ready to give up on it as yet. I believe in happy endings and will wait till this season is over to pass judgement on the team when 2/3 of the season is yet to be played. Past performance isn't always a good indicator of future results.

Thank you. That post alone cancels out much of the hysterical knee-jerk garbage I've been reading on this board this season. I'd like to believe there is still a sizable group of fans in your camp.

 

[DoctorBombay]

We did? Why?

It's year #4, this is the final season in the Big Easy and we have a sure-fire NFL Draft Pick (who is a 5th year senior!) behind center for the first time in 14 years.

If "we all knew this year was gonna be tough" then when isn't it going to be tough? Will it be easier when we don't have an NFL talent at QB? Will it be easier when we have to face a much more difficult conference schedule?

I'm not giving up and until I see otherwise I still say this team can/will win the Big East.

But please, for the love of God - enough with the excuses for loss after loss.

Bruh, I hear and see your frustration...I'll raise it X3.
But its not "excuses" to want to wait till this year plays itself out.
We have a ton of the season to play and things can turn around.
And I don't know about you, but PLENTY of folks looked at our schedule and figured we'd have a tough year...
ESPECIALLY if we didn't get that NW win.
If theres one trend about HCDM, its the big "what-ifs" for every close loss.
With GRob we were getting blown out & had no chance. Marrone has us competing even if the end result is still the same.
Not trying to blow smoke, just trying to maintain a fair perspective.

 

[rocklloyd]

The good news is that we're not getting blown out in these games. we're competing, which is different from the grob years. Unfortunately sillly mental mistakes have cost us nearly every game, fix them, a couple of things break in our favor and we're sitting here at 3-1 and maybe 4-0. Can they get fixed? TBD. It's great that their on him, but we're losing games because of it.

 

[Townie72]

The change that is needed immediately: RECRUITING

Marrone needs to bring in a specialist with a successful record of building a top notch talent base.

This team has no game changer on this squad, & you can't be Bowl eligible without at least ONE of those players.

And where would someone find such a genius?

The team's with top notch talent have top notch talent because they are big time football powers. Their Conference, their facilites, their fan base, etc., etc.

 

[kingottoiii]

My problem is that I have only been satisfied with our play on the field thrice in the last 21 games. That is a long stretch. It isn't just wins and losses but how we have been playing the game. If I felt like we were playing sound fundamentally strong football, but losing hard fought games because of talent then I would be content. But we are playing sloppy football where we have as much to do with the L as the other team. That isn't acceptable. When we play other teams win or lose you can tell if the opponent is a well coached team. Watching us I don't think we are a well coached team. I can deal a 4-8 record with a coaching performance like Grobe (Wakes HC). I cannot deal with a 4-8 record with a coaching performance like Wanny. One is giving it your all but coming up short due to having a ceiling. The other is underachieving. I feel we are underachieving the last 21 games.

 

[Scooch]

No one is going to bail. We've been down this road before. People hit their most emotional point after games like Saturday, but no one is going anywhere. Might not prioritize watching each game if other plans are available, but that's the worst of it.

Hopefully we have a 1997-ish turnaround. Started 1-3 and then steamrolled through the remaining Big East games. There's nothing that makes me believe it could actually happen, but until it doesn't...let's at least beat Pitt (for once).

Yeah, the majority of the fanbase "bailed" a lonnnng time ago. We're the idiots left still caring. We'll be here, because apparently we all have nothing better to do.

 

[orangenirvana]

Bruh, I hear and see your frustration...I'll raise it X3.
But its not "excuses" to want to wait till this year plays itself out.
We have a ton of the season to play and things can turn around.
And I don't know about you, but PLENTY of folks looked at our schedule and figured we'd have a tough year...
ESPECIALLY if we didn't get that NW win.
If theres one trend about HCDM, its the big "what-ifs" for every close loss.
With GRob we were getting blown out & had no chance. Marrone has us competing even if the end result is still the same.
Not trying to blow smoke, just trying to maintain a fair perspective.

People only felt that way because a) they're naturally pessimistic, or b) they don't have much if any faith in Marrone. Those aren't reasons to spare Marrone criticism or heat.

 

[OrangeAggieArmy]

I think recruiting has improved and we look more athletic and competitive in games. I think he's done a great job in NYC/LI and gotten good talent out of GA, TX, MI, etc. Also, the team always comes back looking bigger and faster after every off season; HOWEVER, my frustration is that we're still seeing the silly penalties and mental mistakes that we've been seeing since Marrone's first game. For someone who has a reputation as a disciplinarian, his teams play undisciplined football.

 

[billorange44]

The change that is needed immediately: RECRUITING

Marrone needs to bring in a specialist with a successful record of building a top notch talent base.

This team has no game changer on this squad, & you can't be Bowl eligible without at least ONE of those players.

After 4 years you would have thought he would have thought of this. He is the HC after all and who in hell says he can coach anyways. He hasn't really shown any ability as a head coach as far as I can see or his record shows. He may have been an offensive guru in New Orleans, but look at the talent he had to work with. Hell, I could do that with that talent.

 

[Scooch]

After 4 years you would have thought he would have thought of this. He is the HC after all and who in hell says he can coach anyways. He hasn't really shown any ability as a head coach as far as I can see or his record shows. He may have been an offensive guru in New Orleans, but look at the talent he had to work with. Hell, I could do that with that talent.

I think the past few years have shown that Sean Payton was the mastermind of the Saints offense.

 

[billorange44]

I think the past few years have shown that Sean Payton was the mastermind of the Saints offense.

good point

 

[Orangello]

The guys who many posters projected to be future home run hitters -- Skip Holtz, Turner Gill, Mike Locksley -- have done no better or worse than Doug.

So true. Be careful what you wish for. We as fans of this program should know this better than anyone else coming
off the epic diasaster that was Gump, who's hiring was certainly not done in a thoughtful and reflective manner. Do you think TGD would like to have that one back ?

Let the season play out. If he has another losing record in year 4 then you certainly have to evaluate your options, and they may not be so good.

 

[44PRIDE]

Cut bait...? Home run hitter? Really?

How can a coach make great strides "off the field" yet run a program into the ground?

Context...

I was responding to the OP who said we allowed GRob the opportunity to exhaust every chance available to him and should give Marrone the same chance. I replied that allowing Marrone (or any coach for that matter) the same leeway that Greggers had is foolhardy. No coach should be allowed to do what GRob did.

If we end up with a 4-8 or 3-9 (or worse) record, we should bring in another coach to build on Marrone's off the field accomplishments.....rather than allowing his good work to go to waste.