Ok State's Mike Gundy: Stop investing in facilities. Invest in NIL instead.

[rrlbees]

Admittedly i don’t know for sure what i heard was true or not,

Regardless of him. Tuition is close to what, $80k/yr? I can rattle off famous millionaire alumni one after another. I’m not one to tell anyone how to spend their money, but i just can’t believe we are one of the few P5 programs that can’t find donors. I also know being a big time donor you would expect preferential treatment. Can you honestly tell me Syverud is bought in to NIL and what comes along with it?

We do pretty well with NIL.

 

[FrancoPizza]

We do pretty well with NIL.

Then we should see an uptick in recruiting if this is correct.

 

[FasterCuse]

Then we should see an uptick in recruiting if this is correct.

I would also think our head coach wouldn't call it out as a major issue in one of his pressers.

 

[orangenauburn]

Mike Gundy is stating that because he is falling behind.

They are 42-22 last five years vs 78-26 the 8 years prior.

He knows the talent he needs is getting harder and harder to get.

Let's be real. If the leader of the program backed by T Boone money feels like he is falling behind, then we are light years away.

Not sure how you fix or address this on our end

 

[anomander]

We do pretty well with NIL.

In comparison to who?

 

[hoopsupstate]

SU finally got off the pot and started investing in facilities after they were embarrassed after beating Clemson in 2017. Football fans laughed at the hs locker room they saw after Dino went viral with his post game speech after beating Clemson.

 

[rrlbees]

In comparison to who?

Everyone. There was an article about 6 months ago that talked about NIL. We were one of the better schools in the NE but of course aren’t going to compare with the factories.

 

[NYCCuse826]

Mike Gundy is stating that because he is falling behind.

They are 42-22 last five years vs 78-26 the 8 years prior.

He knows the talent he needs is getting harder and harder to get.

Let's be real. If the leader of the program backed by T Boone money feels like he is falling behind, then we are light years away.

Not sure how you fix or address this on our end

Who knows what was left to Ok State by Pickens after he passed. Back in June, the T. Boone Pickens Foundation only gave 25M to the university for a complex that was under construction. The other 95 went towards scholarships and other initiatives. That's why Gundy is asking people to donate to NIL. The faucet is being turned off.

 

[orangefog]

Everyone. There was an article about 6 months ago that talked about NIL. We were one of the better schools in the NE but of course aren’t going to compare with the factories.

Are we in the top half of our conference?

 

[zjscuse]

If Onondaga and surrounding counties could just find a way to add an NIL tax, we wouldn’t be complaining about Dino’s coaching abilities anymore. The state charged taxpayers to finance the bills new stadium and the bills are privately owned. So why can’t SU get its fair share of tax revenue?

 

[gmoney44]

If Onondaga and surrounding counties could just find a way to add an NIL tax, we wouldn’t be complaining about Dino’s coaching abilities anymore. The state charged taxpayers to finance the bills new stadium and the bills are privately owned. So why can’t SU get its fair share of tax revenue?

That’s about the only thing NYS doesn’t tax us for now. So you may be on to something.

 

[All4SU]

It’s so SU to finally get in the facilities arms race 30 years after it started only to miss the boat on the start of the NIL arms race.

The facilities arms race has been going on for 50 years, and it never stops.

 

[richmondcuse03]

You need big donors to be in.

The school didn’t even cultivate big donors. They ran some off.

Admittedly i don’t know for sure what i heard was true or not,

Regardless of him. Tuition is close to what, $80k/yr? I can rattle off famous millionaire alumni one after another. I’m not one to tell anyone how to spend their money, but i just can’t believe we are one of the few P5 programs that can’t find donors. I also know being a big time donor you would expect preferential treatment. Can you honestly tell me Syverud is bought in to NIL and what comes along with it?

The bigger issue is SU did a terrible job cultivating donor relationships across the board for decades. Athletics, academics etc. talk to anyone in the industry or the school and they will admit this. They had to catch up on the overall endowment. They had to catch up in athletics. They didn’t do basic things when it came to maintaining relationships or even pursuing things. This isn’t about Weitsman. It’s about hundreds of others and many other factors. We can complain about it for months if we want.

I think the AD has committed to doing things the right way. I can’t speak to the rest of the university except for the fact that they’re extremely territorial about fundraising and up until recently, did a bad job encouraging people to donate to the initiatives they want vs steering toward academic issues. That’s finally starting to change so I do think the university as a whole is invested in athletics.

Weitsman is a red herring and really not the right situation to judge the school on.

 

[Newhouser]

Everyone. There was an article about 6 months ago that talked about NIL. We were one of the better schools in the NE but of course aren’t going to compare with the factories.

So we do pretty well with P5 schools in the NE?

 

[MadNY3]

We do pretty well with NIL.

From what I sense, the NIL strategy focuses on retaining the kids doing well/better than expected here and being a player to get the disenfranchised four-star who committed to an all-world program and it didn’t work out.

I expect our recruiting classes to not ever be top 30 good, but I bet we can have top 30 portal classes if that’s a thing.

 

[FrancoPizza]

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i didn’t see you protesting your tax dollars going to the Bills billionaire. Why is this any different?

 

[Stern]

The arms race was about facilities at one point with schools spending tens of millions for bells and whistles. Now, coaches are explicitly telling donors to stop earmarking money for fancy locker rooms and weight rooms, but donate to their collectives. Syracuse needs the facilities, but seeing this shows how much ground they need to make up on multiple fronts.

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What's interesting is that Gundy doesn't chastise talent for leaving for a better economic opportunity.

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I have been saying this since NIL started, good for Gundy for saying the quiet part said behind the scenes out loud. Kid's don't care about fancy weight rooms or nice dorm rooms anymore or ping pong tables and nap pods...they just want to be paid.

The world has changed. Anyone who is behind the curve will get left behind.

Have a war-chest of NIL money you can semi-control to pay players. Only thing that matters. College football is now flat. Literally all the advantages the "big boys" have had for decades truly are gone outside of their "history" of a program which kids don't give two flying you know what's about. You can be anyone now and if you can generate enough NIL money you can go from doghouse to penthouse overnight.

 

[Consigliere]

First, Dino was responding to a direct question about depth. While I don’t necessarily agree with his tone or timing, the message is valid and not Syracuse specific. And it’s not just Duce and Linton who were poached, but players like Courtney Jackson and Anthony Queeley and some of the developmental offensive linemen who were depth pieces that could contribute a bit in a pinch.

This thread has certainly shown that Syracuse needs to make an effort to educate the ignorant masses. The average fan has no idea how NIL works, how to differentiate between the different channels available, what role the Athletic Department can take in supporting collectives and how an individual fan can get involved and make a difference, one player at a time.
There was a town hall held for local small businesses very early in the NIL era that the AD and all major sports coaches attended that invited local businesses to come and learn about NIL. At that point, most couldn’t spell NIL let alone understand it and it was lightly attended. There were additional sessions that were supposed to be scheduled and never were. SU was among the first to launch INFLCR as part of their ACCELERATE platform but did little to publicize it until recently. While every student athlete is given overview training on NIL generally and SU’s programs specifically, few take advantage of deeper dives and support systems in place including a curriculum offered through Falk.
More than half of the 26 student athletes that we have worked with as a part of our initiative fail to respond to initial transaction offers and have to be prompted via social media or other channels to sign on and review. When I talk to them they explain that they didn’t think anyone would be interested in offering a deal to someone of their stature. And this includes football and men’s basketball players, some starters.

So my takeaways are that NIL is one piece of the holistic student athlete experience, more important to the upper crust talent, but facilities, amenities, and yes, educational opportunities matter as well.
When Dino says that depth is impacted by the portal and NIL, it’s the nature of the beast now that top line players may have opportunities to move on to factories, but second line players at those factories have opportunities to move into programs where they can ascend to top line.
Short of violating one of the few rules around use of NIL in the recruiting, increased transparency can show that a culture of support is in place where players beyond the level of QB1 can expect to have opportunities.
There is a glaring need to educate the fan base, both businesses and individuals, on the process, channels to engage and impact of involvement. It’s not just Other People’s Money that is needed to build that culture of support. It’s every one of us. It’s an offhand joke in a text chain that can escalate into a crowd sourced venture that has raised over $35k in 17 months and has supported 26 student athletes across 6 sports ranging from $250 to an ROTC member walkon to $10,000 to an at the time under the radar redshirt freshman Offensive Lineman. And, by the way, that player regularly hosts recruits and his work with us is always a high point of their discussions.
If everyone complaining that SU doesn’t have a competitive NIL program ponied up
and became part of our SyraCRUZ program, that 26 player/$35k program could grow exponentially. It’s up to all of us.

 

[FrancoPizza]

So we do pretty well with P5 schools in the NE?

How many others NE P5 football schools are there? BC and UConn?

 

[Consigliere]

The school didn’t even cultivate big donors. They ran some off.

The bigger issue is SU did a terrible job cultivating donor relationships across the board for decades. Athletics, academics etc. talk to anyone in the industry or the school and they will admit this. They had to catch up on the overall endowment. They had to catch up in athletics. They didn’t do basic things when it came to maintaining relationships or even pursuing things. This isn’t about Weitsman. It’s about hundreds of others and many other factors. We can complain about it for months if we want.

I think the AD has committed to doing things the right way. I can’t speak to the rest of the university except for the fact that they’re extremely territorial about fundraising and up until recently, did a bad job encouraging people to donate to the initiatives they want vs steering toward academic issues. That’s finally starting to change so I do think the university as a whole is invested in athletics.

Weitsman is a red herring and really not the right situation to judge the school on.

Frankly I would love to take Syracuse University out, get it drunk and have it spill the other side of the Weitsman story that decorum prevents them from divulging. Upstate Shredding has been a major supporter of SU Athletics for years, but ultimately SU had no choice in severing that relationship and it goes well beyond the ostentatious nature of Adam’s support efforts.

 

[Consigliere]

I have been saying this since NIL started, good for Gundy for saying the quiet part said behind the scenes out loud. Kid's don't care about fancy weight rooms or nice dorm rooms anymore or ping pong tables and nap pods...they just want to be paid.

Sweeping generalizations are always wrong. There are absolutely some kids that sell themselves to the highest bidder but that is a small percentage of an 85 man roster. Most are still looking at the bigger picture and multiple criteria when deciding on a school.

And Gundy is at a school that has been cashing 8 figure checks from T Boone Pickens for years and investing in facilities. The only thing OSU could build with more athletics facility money is a private space shuttle

 

[Trueblue25]

we can’t chase these guys away when you do have them

Pass!

 

[NYCCuse826]

The school didn’t even cultivate big donors. They ran some off.

The bigger issue is SU did a terrible job cultivating donor relationships across the board for decades. Athletics, academics etc. talk to anyone in the industry or the school and they will admit this. They had to catch up on the overall endowment. They had to catch up in athletics. They didn’t do basic things when it came to maintaining relationships or even pursuing things. This isn’t about Weitsman. It’s about hundreds of others and many other factors. We can complain about it for months if we want.

I think the AD has committed to doing things the right way. I can’t speak to the rest of the university except for the fact that they’re extremely territorial about fundraising and up until recently, did a bad job encouraging people to donate to the initiatives they want vs steering toward academic issues. That’s finally starting to change so I do think the university as a whole is invested in athletics.

Weitsman is a red herring and really not the right situation to judge the school on.

I was having this conversation the other day. The school is doing something to turn off prospective donors especially those who are younger.

 

[elimunelson]

It makes sense.

The facilities arms race became a complete joke years ago. Once you have the state-of-the-art weight room, training facilities, recovery facilities, etc., what the hell else do you need? The answer, of course, was wasting money on nonsense like having PS5's for every kid at their locker.

If we're going to piss money away, might as well just give it to the athletes that make everyone else richer.

Absolutely. For what it's worth i'll never (and i'll say never which i never do) spend a dime on NIl for Syracuse. I'll donate, and have donated, to the boosters for facilities that are forever things for all athletes to use but to donate so a kid can buy a ford 150 truck, no thank you.

 

[Cuse181]

Absolutely. For what it's worth i'll never (and i'll say never which i never do) spend a dime on NIl for Syracuse. I'll donate, and have donated, to the boosters for facilities that are forever things for all athletes to use but to donate so a kid can buy a ford 150 truck, no thank you.

Depending on the amount of donors with this same thought process, its not too surprising the best players are going elsewhere in both major sports. Not that you're doing anything wrong, just a potential view.