OT - need some streaming tech guidance

[DonLightfoot]

First let me say I live in Canada and ESPN3 and WATCH ESPN are not available to Canadians, either on computers or phones. Furthermore, all those “boxes” or “devices” mentioned in several threads will probably not work up here either.

Since it appears we are faced with most of our beloved Orange games being streamed in the future (according to cuse.com I will only get 12 games on TV this season) I need to see if better streaming quality is available for me. On a scale of 1-10, I would have to say the best reception for me would be a 7/8 with more times than not about a 6 – very jerky. It is the ESPN3 feed I pick up, but it is probably sent halfway around the world then back again to the streaming sites I use.

I live in a rural area and utilize cable for my internet. The ISP company does not have a lot of customers in my area (don’t know if that means anything). I have 150 GB’s bandwidth per month which is well below my normal use. My speed rate (if that is the right term) is 20 mbps. I assume that is 20 megabytes per second???????

I contacted my ISP today and they ran a check and mentioned I have an old modem. New one will be installed Thursday. The advisor was not sure if that alone will help my problem or not. I pay a lot for this internet service (one downfall of living in Canada is the cost of living) and I could probably upgrade. However, the additional cost would like to be avoided if it does not provide a remedy. Before getting back to them about an upgrade I shall try Saturday’s game with the new modem and see how it is.

In any event, what do you think is my problem? Is it the 20mbps or the fact the stream is sent to too many various servers around the world? Please keep in mind I am not a tech guru and just want these stupid things to do what I want and do it now. Keep that in retrospect when responding.

Sorry for the length of this post, but Syracuse basketball is an important part of my life and the quality of viewing will go a long way to make me happy. Thank you in advance.

ADDENDUM - I just contacted my ISP again and were advised 20mbps is the most I can get in my rural area. They do offer 100mbps, but they do not know when it will be available for me.

 

[NateW]

This is probably as non-OT as it gets. Streaming is apparently a way of life now.

I've had choppy-frozen streams. May need to use your advice and get a new modem

 

[CuseCrew08]

Is the device in which you watch the games on getting internet via WiFi or is it directly plugged into the modem? I have found that plugging streaming devices directly into the modem helps with the buffering and choppiness of the feeds.

 

[DoubleDee]

I have a streaming box that gets me games in Europe, why couldn’t you get games in America?

Even if it would work, your mbps wouldn’t cut it for live sports.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

First let me say I live in Canada and ESPN3 and WATCH ESPN are not available to Canadians, either on computers or phones. Furthermore, all those “boxes” or “devices” mentioned in several threads will probably not work up here either.

Since it appears we are faced with most of our beloved Orange games being streamed in the future (according to cuse.com I will only get 12 games on TV this season) I need to see if better streaming quality is available for me. On a scale of 1-10, I would have to say the best reception for me would be a 7/8 with more times than not about a 6 – very jerky. It is the ESPN3 feed I pick up, but it is probably sent halfway around the world then back again to the streaming sites I use.

I live in a rural area and utilize cable for my internet. The ISP company does not have a lot of customers in my area (don’t know if that means anything). I have 150 GB’s bandwidth per month which is well below my normal use. My speed rate (if that is the right term) is 20 mbps. I assume that is 20 megabytes per second???????

I contacted my ISP today and they ran a check and mentioned I have an old modem. New one will be installed Thursday. The advisor was not sure if that alone will help my problem or not. I pay a lot for this internet service (one downfall of living in Canada is the cost of living) and I could probably upgrade. However, the additional cost would like to be avoided if it does not provide a remedy. Before getting back to them about an upgrade I shall try Saturday’s game with the new modem and see how it is.

In any event, what do you think is my problem? Is it the 20mbps or the fact the stream is sent to too many various servers around the world? Please keep in mind I am not a tech guru and just want these stupid things to do what I want and do it now. Keep that in retrospect when responding.

Sorry for the length of this post, but Syracuse basketball is an important part of my life and the quality of viewing will go a long way to make me happy. Thank you in advance.

ADDENDUM - I just contacted my ISP again and were advised 20mbps is the most I can get in my rural area. They do offer 100mbps, but they do not know when it will be available for me.

I'm not sure if it will actually help, but there's a thing called VPN. It essentially disguises your IP address, and makes it seem like you're in a different location/country. There's one called WindScribe that gives you 10GB of bandwidth per month for free/trial. Right now, i'm 'in Paris,' but i'm not... Try that, using a US location, to see if you can get into WatchESPN. I say that i don't know if it will help, because ESPN might need to recognize your cable company to give you access. I had been having problems with my ATT U-Verse not giving me (some?) Watch ESPN access, but i've been getting our games recently.

20Mb/s should be adequate for streaming anything. I think Playstation Vue specifies you only need 10-15 or some such, and when i check my throughput on my PS3 and Xbox One, which i use for streaming all my tv over the past 9 months (no more cable), i see that i'm only getting about 12-13Mb/s into those two boxes. Neither of which permits using my 5Ghz wifi. But, your 20Mb/s is probably going to be split between all the devices at use in your home...

Run an Internet Speed Check. Google search for one. But, don't trust the one your service provider tells you to use. ATT tells me to use their own speed check, and that actually says i'm getting almost twice the speed three other independent speed check sites indicate. Hmmmm.

If you're using online sports sites like Bosscast or FirstrowSports, yes, the stream can be icky. I used those two sites to watch every game from a certain team in a certain league for the past two years. The streams can be clean, but would vary during the broadcasts from crystal to unwatchable. Doesn't have anything to do with Your Personal internet stream. As you said, i think they're bounced around the world and through who knows how many masking agents.

Update: I just did a quick google search and this was the first thing that came up. Don't know if it'll work for you, but it's related to my first suggestion:
WatchESPN Canada – How to Watch ESPN in Canada 2017

 

[themorey]

Your 20Mbps is more than enough to stream the game. If you can't get WatchESPN directly I can only guess you're getting it from some other hosting site that is re-streaming it. If true the issue is probably on their end and there isn't anything you can do to improve it other than finding a new site hosting the stream.

 

[DonLightfoot]

CuseCrew08 - That is an option I may try, thanks. Unfortunately I would need a 70 foot Ethernet cable to reach from the modem to the computer which I send to the TV via HDMI cable. Do you or anybody else know if there is a major difference in quality, etc. between cable makers as Best Buy Canada has prices on 100 foot cables ranging from $30 to over $100?

Zelda Zonk - I checked into the VPN thing a couple of years ago and it appeared to be a pain with monthly fees. I may check it out again, thanks.

themorey - Historically I have two streaming sites I use which don't have all the BS associated with them. Quality does not seem to be any different between the two. Thanks.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Zelda Zonk - I checked into the VPN thing a couple of years ago and it appeared to be a pain with monthly fees. I may check it out again, thanks.

Yeah, i resisted subscribing, because i didn't really want to get into 'disguising' and didn't want to pay another fee, but i did join WindScribe for two months for a specific purpose. It was a painless thing, and they only billed me as i instructed. And then, after my 'intense' usage ended, i'm just relying on the free 10GB/month. It just works. It may slow things down a little, but since i only have it switched on for a couple of hours when i use it once a week, it's not a big deal.

 

[DonLightfoot]

It figures, tonight was the best stream I have had in a while. Kudos go out to a member on here who is willing to make and ship me a 100' Ethernet cable all the way from Denver if I need it

 

[HakAttack]

I use Unlocator, which is a DNS scrambler, during baseball season to get the Mets "in market" because we've cut the cord. It allows me to get around the local blackout when I have a MLB.TV subscription. It's $5/mo and I cancel after the season is over.

I would imagine you could use that service to "trick your IP" into thinking you're in the US, so you could watch ESPN3.

 

[sutomcat]

Have you tried this?

WatchESPN Canada – How to Watch ESPN in Canada 2017

 

[cuse10]

Regardless of the modem, WatchESPN will give you a lot of problems. I don't know anyone amongst my peers that has had a good streaming experience.

 

[DoubleDee]

Regardless of the modem, WatchESPN will give you a lot of problems. I don't know anyone amongst my peers that has had a good streaming experience.

Whether it be my box, or any other device, I’ve never had a single problem as long as I wasn’t somewhere crazy like camping or in the middle of nowhere. What do you get lag, or fuzzy picture?

 

[DonLightfoot]

What do you get lag, or fuzzy picture?

Both actually. When a shot goes up, normally I see the ball about every four feet or so. Player movement is jerky. When they show the basket camera for a free throw, I do not see the ball at all when it goes through the net. I would hate to watch a hockey game that way considering the speed of that sport. If I watch my Raiders football games the quality is normally a lot better than the ESPN3 SU feed, but that is usually a CBS production which may be better than ESPN3????????

Hard to say why the quality was so good last night

 

[cuse10]

Whether it be my box, or any other device, I’ve never had a single problem as long as I wasn’t somewhere crazy like camping or in the middle of nowhere. What do you get lag, or fuzzy picture?

Both. My current plan with my ISP (Optimum) is 200Mbps and with the exception of WatchESPN, I don't have any issues. At times last night, I wanted to toss my phone across the room.

 

[manleyzoo]

On cables: An ethernet cable is a cable is a cable. The only difference is branding not technology.

On speed: mbps is megabits per second. It's the smallest measurement for data. For example, a 6 mbps download means about 6 million bits of streaming data are hitting your computer per second. Picture resolution and download time are dependent on speed. 6 mbps is plenty for streaming but 6 is often 3.5 in actual use. You can run speedtest.net to see a snapshot of your download and upload speeds. It picks a server close to you with the best ping (hello, hello is anyone there?) BTW, there are a lot of reasons why someone with AT&T for an ISP sees faster speed on an AT&T server than others. Internet speeds measures through web browsers aren't reliable and can be mucked up by server traffic, your distance to the testing server, network protocols, etc. All of the measuring utilities are inaccurate to one degree or another.

As for 20 mbps -- it is often 15 and sometimes lower. But no matter both are plenty with updated transfer technology. What that means is the streaming algorithm (the rate at which the data is organized and send over the transom) is maximized with new equipment. You'd be best set up with a new modem and also an updated router from which you can run multiple devices if you want.

Those who are telling you that the problem with ESPN is downstream are correct -- the more users tapping into a server the worse your data transmission. That's completely out of your hands. You can change servers with a VPN but you kinda have to know what you're doing and there's no guarantee you'll find one with a better throughput rate.

I don't know your configuration but right now the latest Roku and Chromecast technology have the best consumer algorithms for data transfer. Amazon Fire isn't bad. All three support gazillions of channels including ESPN. And if you choose a packaged service like SlingTV that includes ESPN, that's supported as well. They can plug either into your laptop or your TV and are wireless.

The poster who told you that a wired connection is more reliable than wireless is correct. As for cable length for a Cat 5/6 ethernet cable, the maximum is 300 feet. In this case your problem isn't wired or wireless. Technically speaking, it's latency (how long it takes the data to transfer and packet loss (data doesn't make it to its destination because of network congestion). ESPN is notorious for running feeds in high traffic areas through more servers and vice versa in low trafficked areas. The steaming hubs can help with that to some degree but even they suffer from downstream server issues.

What to do? First, upgrade your modem/router. Next, ask your ISP to optimize your connection (they'll know what that means). Next, limit the number of devices on your network. Next, run speedtest.net to see what you're really dealing with but don't trust it as gospel. Anything at 6 or above is what you're looking for with your DSL connection. Next, go to your local computer store and look at the streaming hubs to see if they'll work with your devices. Next, go to a bar and watch the games there.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Whether it be my box, or any other device, I’ve never had a single problem as long as I wasn’t somewhere crazy like camping or in the middle of nowhere. What do you get lag, or fuzzy picture?

I had a new (bad) experience yesterday. I had been just streaming it to my iPad, which worked fine. Mostly. But, yesterday, i used the Xbox One app to run it on my tv. The picture was fine, but every commercial the picture would freeze and i'd have to exit the program, to the listings screen, and re-select the game to begin it again.

 

[andyw715]

What about the ACC app? Is that any better?

 

[realorange]

Regardless of the modem, WatchESPN will give you a lot of problems. I don't know anyone amongst my peers that has had a good streaming experience.

I think it all depends on where you are located, your ISP and router.

I have excellent WatchESPN 99% of the time.

 

[DonLightfoot]

What about the ACC app? Is that any better?

Tried that last year - won't work up here. Thanks for the thought.

 

[tbonezone]

well there's always this

 

[DonLightfoot]

manleyzoo – Wow, you have put a lot of time into your comments, and the details do actually make sense to this “non techie”, at least somewhat. Thank you very much.

As mentioned, new modem is going in Thursday. I’ll see how Saturday’s game comes through. My router is indeed an old one and that will probably be addressed next. Then I will see if an ethernet cable will be considered in the future.

At the present time the devices for the router are - one main computer, another computer that gets turned on every couple of weeks or so, two cell phones and my wife’s Ipod.

At this point I have forgone the use of another VPN.

In my opinion, I don’t see streaming hubs and other such plug-ins working up here for the ESPN3 feed.

I will call my ISP again in the next day or two regarding that “optimizing the connection”.

speedtest.net results – PING is 36ms (whatever that is) and DOWNLOAD is 22.13mbps.

Go to a bar in Canada to watch SU hoops? Ya, right. Nice idea, but all you will get is hockey, hockey and more hockey, or maybe some soccer

Thanks again to you and everyone else who is trying to help me out here

 

[shermstheman]

I was really frustrated with the streams too. Finally I used the Watch ESPN app on my phone and it was perfect- no issues at all and a very clear, if small, picture. No idea why it was superior.

 

[HakAttack]

manleyzoo – Wow, you have put a lot of time into your comments, and the details do actually make sense to this “non techie”, at least somewhat. Thank you very much.

As mentioned, new modem is going in Thursday. I’ll see how Saturday’s game comes through. My router is indeed an old one and that will probably be addressed next. Then I will see if an ethernet cable will be considered in the future.

At the present time the devices for the router are - one main computer, another computer that gets turned on every couple of weeks or so, two cell phones and my wife’s Ipod.

At this point I have forgone the use of another VPN.

In my opinion, I don’t see streaming hubs and other such plug-ins working up here for the ESPN3 feed.

I will call my ISP again in the next day or two regarding that “optimizing the connection”.

speedtest.net results – PING is 36ms (whatever that is) and DOWNLOAD is 22.13mbps.

Go to a bar in Canada to watch SU hoops? Ya, right. Nice idea, but all you will get is hockey, hockey and more hockey, or maybe some soccer

Thanks again to you and everyone else who is trying to help me out here

The big thing with VPNs is it also gets around the location blackout, which it seems like you have an issue with. That's a big time help. I would not use firstrowsports or some other crap like that. See if Sling TV will allow you to get a subscription in Canada. That's going to allow you to use ESPN3 with your sling account credentials. Then, using a VPN will help as your IP address will get the sense you live elsewhere.

 

[HakAttack]

On cables: An ethernet cable is a cable is a cable. The only difference is branding not technology.

On speed: mbps is megabits per second. It's the smallest measurement for data. For example, a 6 mbps download means about 6 million bits of streaming data are hitting your computer per second. Picture resolution and download time are dependent on speed. 6 mbps is plenty for streaming but 6 is often 3.5 in actual use. You can run speedtest.net to see a snapshot of your download and upload speeds. It picks a server close to you with the best ping (hello, hello is anyone there?) BTW, there are a lot of reasons why someone with AT&T for an ISP sees faster speed on an AT&T server than others. Internet speeds measures through web browsers aren't reliable and can be mucked up by server traffic, your distance to the testing server, network protocols, etc. All of the measuring utilities are inaccurate to one degree or another.

As for 20 mbps -- it is often 15 and sometimes lower. But no matter both are plenty with updated transfer technology. What that means is the streaming algorithm (the rate at which the data is organized and send over the transom) is maximized with new equipment. You'd be best set up with a new modem and also an updated router from which you can run multiple devices if you want.

Those who are telling you that the problem with ESPN is downstream are correct -- the more users tapping into a server the worse your data transmission. That's completely out of your hands. You can change servers with a VPN but you kinda have to know what you're doing and there's no guarantee you'll find one with a better throughput rate.

I don't know your configuration but right now the latest Roku and Chromecast technology have the best consumer algorithms for data transfer. Amazon Fire isn't bad. All three support gazillions of channels including ESPN. And if you choose a packaged service like SlingTV that includes ESPN, that's supported as well. They can plug either into your laptop or your TV and are wireless.

The poster who told you that a wired connection is more reliable than wireless is correct. As for cable length for a Cat 5/6 ethernet cable, the maximum is 300 feet. In this case your problem isn't wired or wireless. Technically speaking, it's latency (how long it takes the data to transfer and packet loss (data doesn't make it to its destination because of network congestion). ESPN is notorious for running feeds in high traffic areas through more servers and vice versa in low trafficked areas. The steaming hubs can help with that to some degree but even they suffer from downstream server issues.

What to do? First, upgrade your modem/router. Next, ask your ISP to optimize your connection (they'll know what that means). Next, limit the number of devices on your network. Next, run speedtest.net to see what you're really dealing with but don't trust it as gospel. Anything at 6 or above is what you're looking for with your DSL connection. Next, go to your local computer store and look at the streaming hubs to see if they'll work with your devices. Next, go to a bar and watch the games there.

Excellent work. Do you work in IT?

 

[DonLightfoot]

See if Sling TV will allow you to get a subscription in Canada. That's going to allow you to use ESPN3 with your sling account credentials. Then, using a VPN will help as your IP address will get the sense you live elsewhere.

It would appear that Sling and a VPN would likely cost me over $40 CDN per month. Not economically sound in my mind. Thanks for the input.