OT: Syracuse University 3rd party Survey, did you participate?

[orangeinjersey]

I guess the new chancellor spearheaded a new alumni survey this year. Did you all partake? What were your thoughts on the list of peer schools? Or shall I say the list SU thinks are peer schools??

The likes of Northwestern, BU, Penn State, NYU, RIT, UVA, Duke, Carnegie Mellon, Cornell etc. Did you think they aimed too high? Too low???

Personally, I think they aimed too high. I didnt really think SU had a better Academic profile than any on that list. Thoughts??

 

[cuseinchina]

I guess the new chancellor spearheaded a new alumni survey this year. Did you all partake? What were your thoughts on the list of peer schools? Or shall I say the list SU thinks are peer schools??

The likes of Northwestern, BU, Penn State, NYU, RIT, UVA, Duke, Carnegie Mellon, Cornell etc. Did you think they aimed too high? Too low???

Personally, I think they aimed too high. I didnt really think SU had a better Academic profile than any on that list. Thoughts??

Wasn't RIT it was U of R.

I think it actually shows where this chancellor wants us to be.

Some of SU's programs are competitive with the top of that list, the overall university is towards the bottom of it but only

Historically SU is at least on par with Penn State and certainly better than BU even if recent rankings don't show that. Carnegie Mellon is a bad comparison as that is an engineering school. I'd like to think Syracuse has the ability to under the right leadership to climb to on par with NYU and U of R. Northwestern, cornell and Duke will always be better academically...but I really think getting to U of R level is possible, particularly as they have fallen off quite a bit and are now low to mid 30's ranking consistently. And really the only thing good about NYU undergrad is its location - my sister worked there in the 'front office so to speak' before going to Texas for her phd and was consistently surprised at how bad the students were.

I like that he's aiming high. Get us back to the low 40's though and I'll be happy. The cantor years have really taken whatever sheen existed off of my undergrad degree - she's really destroyed brand value for alumni.

 

[orangeinjersey]

Wasn't RIT it was U of R.

I think it actually shows where this chancellor wants us to be.

Some of SU's programs are competitive with the top of that list, the overall university is towards the bottom of it but only

Historically SU is at least on par with Penn State and certainly better than BU even if recent rankings don't show that. Carnegie Mellon is a bad comparison as that is an engineering school. I'd like to think Syracuse has the ability to under the right leadership to climb to on par with NYU and U of R. Northwestern, cornell and Duke will always be better academically...but I really think getting to U of R level is possible, particularly as they have fallen off quite a bit and are now low to mid 30's ranking consistently. And really the only thing good about NYU undergrad is its location - my sister worked there in the 'front office so to speak' before going to Texas for her phd and was consistently surprised at how bad the students were.

I like that he's aiming high. Get us back to the low 40's though and I'll be happy. The cantor years have really taken whatever sheen existed off of my undergrad degree - she's really destroyed brand value for alumni.

UofR, yes you're right, my mistake.

 

[OttoMets]

Wasn't RIT it was U of R.

I think it actually shows where this chancellor wants us to be.

Some of SU's programs are competitive with the top of that list, the overall university is towards the bottom of it but only

Historically SU is at least on par with Penn State and certainly better than BU even if recent rankings don't show that. Carnegie Mellon is a bad comparison as that is an engineering school. I'd like to think Syracuse has the ability to under the right leadership to climb to on par with NYU and U of R. Northwestern, cornell and Duke will always be better academically...but I really think getting to U of R level is possible, particularly as they have fallen off quite a bit and are now low to mid 30's ranking consistently. And really the only thing good about NYU undergrad is its location - my sister worked there in the 'front office so to speak' before going to Texas for her phd and was consistently surprised at how bad the students were.

...

I did think that was one of the better comparisons - it's a school for B high school students whose parents have money, has a wacky president who's spend oodles of money and alienated a big chunk of the faculty (way more than Chancy Nancy did), and has name appeal that exceeds its overall quality.

Good for the chancellor to aim high, if that's what he's doing. It will prove difficult.

SU's better schools and programs are quite good. There are some fundamental weaknesses that affect the university as a whole, however. Many have pedagogical differences with SU's priorities that go beyond Chancy Nancy's preference for the soft sciences.

 

[cuseinchina]

I did think that was one of the better comparisons - it's a school for B high school students whose parents have money, has a wacky president who's spend oodles of money and alienated a big chunk of the faculty (way more than Chancy Nancy did), and has name appeal that exceeds its overall quality.

Good for the chancellor to aim high, if that's what he's doing. It will prove difficult.

SU's better schools and programs are quite good. There are some fundamental weaknesses that affect the university as a whole, however. Many have pedagogical differences with SU's priorities that go beyond Chancy Nancy's preference for the soft sciences.

I'm not sure that we know what SU's priorities are right now. I think it will be 6 months or so before we see what this guy is going to do. If SU plays to its strengths they can get back to where they were or better. Think about U of R versus a similarly ranked Syracuse - where would you want to go for 4 years? U of R has no sports, a boring campus, a reputation for bringing in less than well rounded geeks who couldn't get into ivy's...SU has country leading programs in some academic areas, a pipeline to NYC for alumni, better national brand recognition, big time sports to get excited about, a vibrant campus life, beautiful buildings, much better looking women. NYU on the other hand has an inflated reputation due to location. It's strengths are the arts and business -- but the business students are kids who couldn't get in to Columbia or cornell, and the their art program is way behind some of the smaller schools including CUNY Hunter which is a fraction of the cost. Basically NYU is for rich kids from the Midwest who fall in love with the village and want to live an imaginary life with their parents money for 4 years.

 

[OttoMets]

... Basically NYU is for rich kids from the Midwest who fall in love with the village and want to live an imaginary life with their parents money for 4 years.

That's a good way to sum it up.

 

[TexanMark]

I wonder if schools like NYU and Syracuse would ever merge or at least form an affliated relationship? I think an affliation for Syracuse with NYU would be beneficial.

BTW, when my son visited U of R I was underwhelmed with the student body. When we visited Syracuse the kids seemed more engaged and frankly more attractive.

 

[OttoMets]

I wonder if schools like NYU and Syracuse would ever merge or at least form an affliated relationship? I think an affliation for Syracuse with NYU would be beneficial.

BTW, when my son visited U of R I was underwhelmed with the student body. When we visited Syracuse the kids seemed more engaged and frankly more attractive.

Since John Sexton apparently wants NYU to have a million different campuses, that's not the craziest idea.

Syracuse is a more natural partner than Abu Dhabi.

 

[NashvilleOrange]

Athletics really push the Syracuse brand up; Your average college educated person in the South knows of Syracuse but doesn't know of University of Rochester. I think that speaks to the large focus on college sports but it is a good advantage Syracuse can have in the minds of national applicants over schools like Lehigh, RPI, Northeastern, Case Western, etc.
Also, it's insane that Penn State is ranked so far ahead of Syracuse; Why would someone go to a mammoth school, get taught by TAs and pay a premium out of state tuition when they can go to a better balanced private school? I like that they're aiming higher, being ranked alongside Clemson and behind University of Georgia is embarrassing and really pisses me off.

 

[orangeinjersey]

Athletics really push the Syracuse brand up; Your average college educated person in the South knows of Syracuse but doesn't know of University of Rochester. I think that speaks to the large focus on college sports but it is a good advantage Syracuse can have in the minds of national applicants over schools like Lehigh, RPI, Northeastern, Case Western, etc.
Also, it's insane that Penn State is ranked so far ahead of Syracuse; Why would someone go to a mammoth school, get taught by TAs and pay a premium out of state tuition when they can go to a better balanced private school? I like that they're aiming higher, being ranked alongside Clemson and behind University of Georgia is embarrassing and really pisses me off.

I know rankings are arbitrary, depending on who does the rankings and criteria, but I made sure to let them know that "perception is reality" and a lof of folks pick up US news and the like when doing the preliminary background research on potential college choice.

I also think it has to do with pretentious upper middle class/upper class mentality, my X is better than your X, becuase Y says so. I already see this here in NJ, when it comes to the zipcode you live in and the "school district".

 

[NashvilleOrange]

I know rankings are arbitrary, depending on who does the rankings and criteria, but I made sure to let them know that "perception is reality" and a lof of folks pick up US news and the like when doing the preliminary background research on potential college choice.

I also think it has to do with pretentious upper middle class/upper class mentality, my X is better than your X, becuase Y says so. I already see this here in NJ, when it comes to the zipcode you live in and the "school district".

Agreed. I'm not upset with my choice of going to Syracuse, great times, I got to cheer on the teams that I grew up rooting for and I ended up at a job that I enjoy. At the same time, I wish the reputation was better; since I've graduated we've continued to slip in the rankings all the while, I'm paying back student loans each month that make the investment look like a weaker and weaker choice. I love Syracuse and want it to be somewhere that I encourage my kids to go to later on in life, at this point I'd steer them elsewhere.

 

[OrangeTarheel]

SU's better schools and programs are quite good. There are some fundamental weaknesses that affect the university as a whole, however. Many have pedagogical differences with SU's priorities that go beyond Chancy Nancy's preference for the soft sciences.

When you say "soft sciences" do you mean the humanities? Because every school on earth is trying to turn itself into vocational school at the moment. The humanities teach diverse skill sets and I am willing to bet they are better appreciated in the coming decade. If Cantor did a poor job in encouraging their healthy growth that is one thing, to abandon them altogether ... I can't support that.

 

[OttoMets]

When you say "soft sciences" do you mean the humanities? Because every school on earth is trying to turn itself into vocational school at the moment. The humanities teach diverse skill sets and I am willing to bet they are better appreciated in the coming decade. If Cantor did a poor job in encouraging their healthy growth that is one thing, to abandon them altogether ... I can't support that.

Not the humanities, per se (as a former double major in English and history, I've got a strong appreciation for the humanities and am dismayed at the vocational trend you note). I'm thinking of the less traditional departments that fall under that umbrella.

I don't want to single anything out for fear of offending anyone, but English, philosophy, history, political science, and the classics should be integral to a well-rounded education and I'd like to see them prosper.