QB/Dino Question

[phil77]

Why is it such a struggle from QBs to throw a forward pass with consistency at Syracuse? I am not even asking for a Heisman type QB but just someone who is a competent thrower of the ball? They have recruited 2 star 3 star 4 star guys but no matter their background they come to Syracuse a just struggle. Other college teams have bad talent at WR and bad OLines but they all seem to have a consistent passing game.

Dino has done great things with offenses in his past especially at Bowling Green. They had a fast fun offense and a great passing attack with the fat pirate at the helm but at Syracuse we don’t see any of that. He even recruited a QB who is actually rostered in the NFL so he actually had an NFL with NFL talent but Dino couldn’t ever make that even work here. Like why? At Bowling Green when they played up he put points on the board against P5 teams on a regular basis. So why not here? Don’t tell me recruiting why can’t he teach his system here? Why did installing his sure fire system the system he was hired for fail here?


Beck has had great things said about the way he can communicate teach and get the best out of his QBs. Why hasn’t GS improved as a passer? Why are the down 3 scores in the 3rd and completely took the ball out of the QBs hands and started running the ball?

Del Rio was a 4 star prospect and number 12 ranked pocket passer in his draft class but it looks like a struggle for him to complete regular passes in mop up duty.

Why is it such a struggle here?

 

[cuse309]

I imagine most of the perennial basement dwellers have not had much luck at QB. It's pretty much why these teams are perennial basement dwellers.
I would actually say that it's been more of a consistent offensive line/pass blocking issue.
Our line in 18 was decent. Dungey threw pretty well. Our line with Nassib performed well, and he did too.
Tommy Devito say what you want about him here...played pretty well behind a good offensive line at Illinois, and threw well for the Giants in the pre season, and was pretty well protected.
I feel like the quality of your offensive line is what separates the blue bloods, from the good teams, from the basement dwellers.

 

[hoopsupstate]

I imagine most of the perennial basement dwellers have not had much luck at QB. It's pretty much why these teams are perennial basement dwellers.
I would actually say that it's been more of a consistent offensive line/pass blocking issue.
Our line in 18 was decent. Dungey threw pretty well. Our line with Nassib performed well, and he did too.
Tommy Devito say what you want about him here...played pretty well behind a good offensive line at Illinois, and threw well for the Giants in the pre season, and was pretty well protected.
I feel like the quality of your offensive line is what separates the blue bloods, from the good teams, from the basement dwellers.

In eight years Dino has recruited one good offensive lineman. Anyone else who is kind of decent were transfers.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

I don’t think we have a chance without a mobile QB that can take a lot of hits. See all the pathetic drops from WRs.

Next year should be a 3 way competition from guys who can run.

Assuming he isn’t injured I think we see good Shrader down the stretch after FSU.

 

[Dmcnabbrules]

I don’t think we have a chance without a mobile QB that can take a lot of hits. See all the pathetic drops from WRs.

Next year should be a 3 way competition from guys who can run.

Assuming he isn’t injured I think we see good Shrader down the stretch after FSU.

Good or bad Shrader is directly connected to the level of competition. When he is bigger and faster he is good. Against good defenses he has no chance. Garret is a Dodge Charger. Pretty fast but kinda clunky with a lot of blind spots.

 

[richmondcuse03]

Love Garrett but he was moved out of the QB spot previously for a reason. He needs to run to be successful. He’s not a pure pocket passer. And as others have noted, we generally don’t have a good offensive line for a pure pocket qb. We didn’t even for Mcnabb

 

[illi3]

The thing that has bothered me for 8 years is that every week of every season, I see decent/serviceable passers at lower tiers who keep their teams competitive against the big boys when they play. You’re telling me none of those kids wouldn’t want to be in the ACC for us?
The players we’re looking for are out there, and they’d come here. We just seem to miss them.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Good or bad Shrader is directly connected to the level of competition. When he is bigger and faster he is good. Against good defenses he has no chance. Garret is a Dodge Charger. Pretty fast but kinda clunky with a lot of blind spots.

I mean our season might have gone down the drain when he spun into a decleater for no reason after picking up the first down and the refs of course reversed the targetting. His arms not 100% after the surgery either.

I honestly have no problem giving the team the benefit of the doubt and forgetting UNC and Clemson happened I am that disgusted with the calls the refs made even with video review to me the games were 100% rigged and the officials crooked. I'd like to see CRDW get a start against an easier team but lets be honest his spring games have been embarrassingly bad and he misses easy throws by a mile. Fast cannon of an arm and looks like he can take a hit though we could use an AR15 type.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I mean our season might have gone down the drain when he spun into a decleater for no reason after picking up the first down and the refs of course reversed the targetting. His arms not 100% after the surgery either.

I honestly have no problem giving the team the benefit of the doubt and forgetting UNC and Clemson happened I am that disgusted with the calls the refs made even with video review to me the games were 100% rigged and the officials crooked. I'd like to see CRDW get a start against an easier team but lets be honest his spring games have been embarrassingly bad and he misses easy throws by a mile. Fast cannon of an arm and looks like he can take a hit though we could use an AR15 type.

Well, don't give up yet. We hoped to nick one of these last 3 games, and didn't.

But we also won our first four, including a couple somewhat challenging games.

The proof is in who we are coming out of the bye. Theoretically, we could be favored in pretty much all of these games.

Can we we win four out of five? Not that I expect to, but I think we could. Guys are playing for their jobs - how long has it been since we had a team that got better as the season wore on?

 

[anomander]

Why is it such a struggle from QBs to throw a forward pass with consistency at Syracuse? I am not even asking for a Heisman type QB but just someone who is a competent thrower of the ball? They have recruited 2 star 3 star 4 star guys but no matter their background they come to Syracuse a just struggle. Other college teams have bad talent at WR and bad OLines but they all seem to have a consistent passing game.

Dino has done great things with offenses in his past especially at Bowling Green. They had a fast fun offense and a great passing attack with the fat pirate at the helm but at Syracuse we don’t see any of that. He even recruited a QB who is actually rostered in the NFL so he actually had an NFL with NFL talent but Dino couldn’t ever make that even work here. Like why? At Bowling Green when they played up he put points on the board against P5 teams on a regular basis. So why not here? Don’t tell me recruiting why can’t he teach his system here? Why did installing his sure fire system the system he was hired for fail here?


Beck has had great things said about the way he can communicate teach and get the best out of his QBs. Why hasn’t GS improved as a passer? Why are the down 3 scores in the 3rd and completely took the ball out of the QBs hands and started running the ball?

Del Rio was a 4 star prospect and number 12 ranked pocket passer in his draft class but it looks like a struggle for him to complete regular passes in mop up duty.

Why is it such a struggle here?

CDRW is in his 3rd year in college. If he hasn’t shown it by now he’s not going to. That’s why i don’t get all excited about these higher rated HS guys who transfer in without ever cracking the lineup at their previous school. There is usually a reason you’re not playing.

Outside of Gadsen there hasn’t been 1 really good receiver Babers has recruited in 8 years. I’m also perplexed watching every other program work the middle of the field but we can’t throw the ball inbounds. We might have set a record with completed passes out of bounds. It’s like they never practiced a back shoulder throw.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The thing that has bothered me for 8 years is that every week of every season, I see decent/serviceable passers at lower tiers who keep their teams competitive against the big boys when they play. You’re telling me none of those kids wouldn’t want to be in the ACC for us?
The players we’re looking for are out there, and they’d come here. We just seem to miss them.

It actually pisses me off that other, lesser programs can pass the ball just fine, and yet Syracuse, the only program that plays its home games in a Dome... can't.

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

Anyone have an idea whats going on with Braden Davis?

The two guys in front of him couldn't look worse though I know the competition has been tough. He's already redshirted. Over half a season of practice.

 

[Millhouse]

Why is it such a struggle from QBs to throw a forward pass with consistency at Syracuse? I am not even asking for a Heisman type QB but just someone who is a competent thrower of the ball? They have recruited 2 star 3 star 4 star guys but no matter their background they come to Syracuse a just struggle. Other college teams have bad talent at WR and bad OLines but they all seem to have a consistent passing game.

Dino has done great things with offenses in his past especially at Bowling Green. They had a fast fun offense and a great passing attack with the fat pirate at the helm but at Syracuse we don’t see any of that. He even recruited a QB who is actually rostered in the NFL so he actually had an NFL with NFL talent but Dino couldn’t ever make that even work here. Like why? At Bowling Green when they played up he put points on the board against P5 teams on a regular basis. So why not here? Don’t tell me recruiting why can’t he teach his system here? Why did installing his sure fire system the system he was hired for fail here?


Beck has had great things said about the way he can communicate teach and get the best out of his QBs. Why hasn’t GS improved as a passer? Why are the down 3 scores in the 3rd and completely took the ball out of the QBs hands and started running the ball?

Del Rio was a 4 star prospect and number 12 ranked pocket passer in his draft class but it looks like a struggle for him to complete regular passes in mop up duty.

Why is it such a struggle here?

Might be getting fooled by randomness. Garrapolo and the old pirate in one direction and devito in the other. Shrader was never really part of the plan and I'm glad they chose him. I don't want to wait forever just so we get a big sample, get it right ASAP or move on. Cdrw is probably another swing and miss

Part of the appeal of the air raid to me is that developing QBs dominates practice , even at the expense of everything else. Four guys throwing all the time to four guys catching, overwhelming focus of time on that

 

[Cuse12]

It actually pisses me off that other, lesser programs can pass the ball just fine, and yet Syracuse, the only program that plays its home games in a Dome... can't.

Why is every other pass over the OL batted down? Qb staring down too much? Not picking his pockets within the OL? Can’t use the Devito excuse of “too short”. What is it? Every little detail is on the chopping block for me going forward. It’s utterly outrageous

 

[DPCuse]

Why is every other pass over the OL batted down? Qb staring down too much? Not picking his pockets within the OL? Can’t use the Devito excuse of “too short”. What is it? Every little detail is on the chopping block for me going forward. It’s utterly outrageous

Don't know. But given we also struggle to run, it seems like most of our problems start with the O line. Fix that and WRs will have time to get open, RBs will find holes, QBs will have time to go through their progressions, etc. A good O line makes everyone around them better.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Might be getting fooled by randomness. Garrapolo and the old pirate in one direction and devito in the other. Shrader was never really part of the plan and I'm glad they chose him. I don't want to wait forever just so we get a big sample, get it right ASAP or move on. Cdrw is probably another swing and miss

Part of the appeal of the air raid to me is that developing QBs dominates practice , even at the expense of everything else. Four guys throwing all the time to four guys catching, overwhelming focus of time on that

When Dino first got here we had guys catching 90+ balls. Now, it did not necessarily amount to wins but it was a hell of a lot of passing. Here are the leading pass catchers since Dino got here. Obviously some of these would be different based on # of games, or injuries (i.e. Gadsden this year). Two players catching 90+ is pretty crazy.

Where I sit, we have a lot of wide outs that do things very similar to each other, with the exception of Pena (who is hurt). Similar builds, similar abilities. Make a play here and there. Where are the Ervs?

2023- Allen (RB) 23, Brown 22, Hatcher 21, Alford 20
2022- Gadsden 61
2021- C. Jackson 37(!)
2020- Harris 58, in 10 games
2019- T. Jackson 66
2018- Riley 64
2017- Ishmael 105(!), Phillips 89(!)
2016- Etta-Tawo 94(!), Phillips 90(!)

 

[Cusefan69]

When Dino first got here we had guys catching 90+ balls. Now, it did not necessarily amount to wins but it was a hell of a lot of passing. Here are the leading pass catchers since Dino got here. Obviously some of these would be different based on # of games, or injuries (i.e. Gadsden this year). Two players catching 90+ is pretty crazy.

Where I sit, we have a lot of wide outs that do things very similar to each other, with the exception of Pena (who is hurt). Similar builds, similar abilities. Make a play here and there. Where are the Ervs?

2023- Allen (RB) 23, Brown 22, Hatcher 21, Alford 20
2022- Gadsden 61
2021- C. Jackson 37(!)
2020- Harris 58, in 10 games
2019- T. Jackson 66
2018- Riley 64
2017- Ishmael 105(!), Phillips 89(!)
2016- Etta-Tawo 94(!), Phillips 90(!)

And a chunk of fans still didn't like ED in 16 and 17 because he didn't throw a pretty ball but look at all those completions. Crazy. ED hid allot of issues with the oline those years as well.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

When Dino first got here we had guys catching 90+ balls. Now, it did not necessarily amount to wins but it was a hell of a lot of passing. Here are the leading pass catchers since Dino got here. Obviously some of these would be different based on # of games, or injuries (i.e. Gadsden this year). Two players catching 90+ is pretty crazy.

Where I sit, we have a lot of wide outs that do things very similar to each other, with the exception of Pena (who is hurt). Similar builds, similar abilities. Make a play here and there. Where are the Ervs?

2023- Allen (RB) 23, Brown 22, Hatcher 21, Alford 20
2022- Gadsden 61
2021- C. Jackson 37(!)
2020- Harris 58, in 10 games
2019- T. Jackson 66
2018- Riley 64
2017- Ishmael 105(!), Phillips 89(!)
2016- Etta-Tawo 94(!), Phillips 90(!)

 

[upperdeck]

CDRW is in his 3rd year in college. If he hasn’t shown it by now he’s not going to. That’s why i don’t get all excited about these higher rated HS guys who transfer in without ever cracking the lineup at their previous school. There is usually a reason you’re not playing.

Outside of Gadsen there hasn’t been 1 really good receiver Babers has recruited in 8 years. I’m also perplexed watching every other program work the middle of the field but we can’t throw the ball inbounds. We might have set a record with completed passes out of bounds. It’s like they never practiced a back shoulder throw.

to throw to the middle 2 things happen.. You need to stretch the field and block

Since we cant block, the middle becomes about 10 yds deep and the bodies make it tough to throw there. We had 4-5 of those plays last week to open WRs and they got knocked down.. Some of that is the QB staring the WRs down. Some is the DL/LB getting into lanes.

The best plays FSU ran were very slow plays that let the WR drag over the middle.. We dont have that kind of time.

 

[im4cuse]

When Dino first got here we had guys catching 90+ balls. Now, it did not necessarily amount to wins but it was a hell of a lot of passing. Here are the leading pass catchers since Dino got here. Obviously some of these would be different based on # of games, or injuries (i.e. Gadsden this year). Two players catching 90+ is pretty crazy.

Where I sit, we have a lot of wide outs that do things very similar to each other, with the exception of Pena (who is hurt). Similar builds, similar abilities. Make a play here and there. Where are the Ervs?

2023- Allen (RB) 23, Brown 22, Hatcher 21, Alford 20
2022- Gadsden 61
2021- C. Jackson 37(!)
2020- Harris 58, in 10 games
2019- T. Jackson 66
2018- Riley 64
2017- Ishmael 105(!), Phillips 89(!)
2016- Etta-Tawo 94(!), Phillips 90(!)

This is devastating. We are so boring to watch

 

[kirbivore]

It actually pisses me off that other, lesser programs can pass the ball just fine, and yet Syracuse, the only program that plays its home games in a Dome... can't.

While watching the rest of college FB it looks like SU is playing a different sport.

 

[anomander]

to throw to the middle 2 things happen.. You need to stretch the field and block

Since we cant block, the middle becomes about 10 yds deep and the bodies make it tough to throw there. We had 4-5 of those plays last week to open WRs and they got knocked down.. Some of that is the QB staring the WRs down. Some is the DL/LB getting into lanes.

The best plays FSU ran were very slow plays that let the WR drag over the middle.. We dont have that kind of time.

and to just think 3-4 years ago FSU had the same problem with an atrocious OL. Unfortunately, we can’t seem to recruit OT’s. On paper the interior OL should be decent, but other than Cruz, and potentially Wohlabaugh, there is literally no depth and no help in sight. I would do my best to be use the portal to try and get an experienced starter from the G5/FCS level.

You’re right that everything starts with the OL. Everyone sees Shrader throwing incompletions and WR’s not getting open, but the OL holds just as much responsibility, if not more. It’s no coincidence our best 2 teams in the last decade was 2012 and 2018 and both had outstanding OL’s.